He did get that right. It's probably worth noting the pick that was used to select DT was partially attributable to the Cutler trade. I'd be surprised if there are still holdouts thinking the Broncos would have been better off keeping Cutler.
OT: Other Sports aka CSU Football Thread XX
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He did get that right. It's probably worth noting the pick that was used to select DT was partially attributable to the Cutler trade. I'd be surprised if there are still holdouts thinking the Broncos would have been better off keeping Cutler.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
It's easy to say that when we have Manning but without the miracle that brought us him I think it's a very fair debate.
I just thank God we don't have to deal with the Tebow situation anymore. Leader he maybe was, NFL quarterback he was not.
...and I will never forget when he beat the Steelers in the playoffs, but he just wasn't good enough to cut it.
...and I will never forget when he beat the Steelers in the playoffs, but he just wasn't good enough to cut it.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
Going to the NFC championship game was a lot more than we would have done without Manning. I get that he's a jerk and his DGAF attitude just makes him worthless when things aren't going well but I just don't think much of pretty much every other QB option that would have been out there. Who was it going to be after Tebow? Matt Cassel? Christian Ponder?
The NFC Championship game is something of a cherry pick if you're going to consider his entire career... which, if the results were better, no one would care about his attitude. But even if you look at that single playoff run, they did beat the only playoff team in NFL history with a losing record while the #1 seed got to play the Packers. A better argument could be made for Tebow using those parameters. Anyway, there's probably endless butterfly effect possibilities for what might have been if Manning didn't sign here, and it doesn't make for a very good argument when compared to what is actually going on in Chicago at the moment.
Which is like Dan Reeves taking Terrell Davis as validation of his offensive schemes with Sammy Winder (this actually happened).
Fact is the team was demonstrably worse and had a more poisonous culture in it after McDaniels regime than before. Also none of the QBs he brought in were as good as Cutler (Cassel, Orton, Tebow, Simms, Quinn, Brandstater...)
Not really sure what is being debated here... it's a lot of tire spinning. One the first point... no clue what I wrote that is like Dan Reeves using TD as validation. The second point is totally irrelevant... there's no argument being made repudiating the stink of the McDaniels era. Perhaps some are stuck on the belief that you got to pick a side on the whole McDaniel's/Cutler spat, like it's a presidential election and you only got two choices. I'm content not to take either side. Actually if there's a side I'm on it's Elway's, and the way history played out, McDaniels had to happen for Elway to come in and save the day. I'm not really interested in pondering alternative realities as something more legitimate than the things that actually happened.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
I'm not a fan of either Cutler or McDaniels, I don't really care about either side of the debate. My only point is how Fed we were at QB after Cutler left and how likely that would have continued. So to say it's done and settled we were right in dumping him is incorrect I say.
"That likely would have continued" is an alternative history. It's a strange argument to present an alternative history as more legitimate than actual history.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
The 999,999/1,000,000 chance that they didn't get a HOF QB to land in their lap is considered "alternate universe"? That's like saying I walked across the highway once and didn't get hit and therefore it was a good decision. And well, it's not like we've won anything in this universe either.
Bears fans probably wouldn't agree with any analogy that equates keeping Cutler with not being hit by a car.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
Tim Tebow broke football for me to some degree. After that 18-1 seemed like it was just run of the mill NFL-insanity.
Butterfly Effect Possibilities like EJ Manuel, Geno Smith, and Blake Bortles.
Heck maybe we could have pulled Johnny Manziel!
- Dec 4, 2002
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According to Klis, estimated salary ranges for some Broncos FAs:
Knighton: $5-8M
Franklin: $4-7M
Moore: $3-5M
If Knighton and Franklin are really that close in salary range, I'm taking Knighton 100 times out of 100.
Moore won't be resigned at that upper-end number, Franklin either. Knighton though?…….
Knighton: $5-8M
Franklin: $4-7M
Moore: $3-5M
If Knighton and Franklin are really that close in salary range, I'm taking Knighton 100 times out of 100.
Moore won't be resigned at that upper-end number, Franklin either. Knighton though?…….
Or you know, Peyton Manning. Perhaps I'm kind of old school for an internet message board for considering things that actually happen a possibility? I don't know.
All quips, analogies, and random butterfly effect possibilities aside, the crux of this debate is simply, were the Broncos better off parting ways with Cutler when they did or not. And it boils down to this question: Were the Broncos in a better situation actively looking for a solution at QB rather than being tied to Cutler and his potential, as the Bears have been for a while? This thread is one of the last places on earth where the idea that being tied down to Cutler and his endless journey to reaching his potential is still considered to be an ideal situation. I guess you can find anything on the internet.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
And search we did and search we will do when Manning is gone and search Chicago will do if they get rid of him. But I guess there is some novelty in having a new QB every year, keeps it interesting.
Well, it's an agree to disagree debate at this point. Obviously, the other side of the argument is that it is better to have Jay Cutler than to be searching for something better (perhaps because there's nothing out there that could possibly be better than Jay Cutler?). I can agree to disagree with that.
I dunno - you're saying getting rid of Cutler was a slam dunk win and yet you have Broncos fans telling you it could have not been. I think the point's been made it's a not a slam dunk? There was three outcomes of this - Keeping Cutler (.500 team?) Getting Manning (.750+ team) or Trading Cutler and never getting a replacement (.300 team). So to say getting rid of Cutler was the correct decision - I don't know that it was. The only thing that didn't make it a disaster was signing Peyton. If we hadn't signed him this team would probably be in dire straits.
This debate is failing for the reason so many internet debates fail. Nobody is having the same debate. I'm not arguing that at the time the decision was made, it should have been regarded as a good decision. Has hindsight made it a good decision? Hell yes, it's obvious! Isn't it? I mean we are not seriously entertaining thoughts otherwise right? If we are, we disagree.
Of course it seemed like a bad decision at the time. I thought so at the time and have never claimed otherwise. I guess I am willing to change my mind when the course of events prove me wrong. The insistence on placing value on alternative history makes more sense now. The counter argument insists on viewing it from the perspective of when the decision was made, and I am viewing it from my present day perspective.
Another thing we disagree on is that .500 mediocre football is better than .300 bad football. How is it better to be the team that missed the playoffs on the last game versus missing it by week 10? At the very least you get a better draft pick.
Lastly, there would have been options to pick up QB at least Cutler caliber QBs if Manning hadn't worked out. Alex Smith and Mark Sanchez are mediocre enough to stand shoulder to shoulder with Cutler and they can even match his sterling conference championship tally to boot.
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