OT: OT: Lets Go Cardinals! (All Baseball Talk Here) Part 2

[ChicagoIsBedarded]

They do just enough to make the playoffs but not even close to being a serious contender. No need to be as long as 3 + million sheep pile on into Busch.

I honestly don't think people in STL really like baseball all that much.

I think there's so many alcoholics in that town, they slur "We really like baseball" so they don't have to face it.

Go have another one while complaining opening day isn't a national holiday.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I

I honestly don't think people in STL really like baseball all that much.

I think there's so many alcoholics in that town, they slur "We really like baseball" so they don't have to face it.

Go have another one while complaining opening day isn't a national holiday.

You gotta say it in a drunken, post- stroke Harry Caray.

 

[Puck Luck]

some of the takes in here are insane. I get that losing in the playoffs (and mostly not showing up) sucks to watch but jeez

In game one, I think Marmol did all the right things except for going to Helsley too early and not proactively having a reliever backing him up. 2 run lead is a slim margin and Helsley was injured.

That being said, all of the other moves worked out beautifully, like all of the other reliever moves (no one before Helsley gave up runs and Pallante got the ground balls to limit the damage) and pinch hitting Yepez. Not sure why Pujols was hitting 2nd or why Dickerson was anywhere near the starting 9 but they did enough to win game 1. Even Helsley was pitching well until all the sudden he wasn't (which is a good enough reason to be proactive with removing Q even when it looked like he was cruising)

Game 2 might have just been the hangover from losing game 1 late, but Wheeler and Nola are excellent pitchers. Would have liked to have seen better at bats from Goldy and better luck for Nado (how many long fly balls died at the track?) but that's the way it goes.

 

[Pizza!Pizza!]

I honestly don't think people in STL really like baseball all that much.

I think there's so many alcoholics in that town, they slur "We really like baseball" so they don't have to face it.

Go have another one while complaining opening day isn't a national holiday.

I've been saying the same thing for years. I see it at the Blues games too, its why I refuse to sit in the upper bowl anymore - too many drunks that aren't even watching the game and keep asking stupid questions or yelling "shoot the puck" when the Blues don't even have possession.

 

[Puck Luck]

... or yelling "shoot the puck" when the Blues don't even have possession.

How else are the players supposed to know when to shoot the puck?

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

RIP to Bruce Sutter. One of the first great closers. His strikeout to end the '82 Series is probably the happiest I have ever been watching a baseball game.

 

[eibyyz]

RIP to Bruce Sutter. One of the first great closers. His strikeout to end the '82 Series is probably the happiest I have ever been watching a baseball game.

That was the first STL WS where I was old enough to realize what was going on. That photo of Darrell and Bruce...both gone. Le sigh.

 

[TheDizee]

Was before my time but RIP Mr Sutter.

The golden age of Cardinals baseball for me was 98-2006. Nothing has been close since outside of 2011's magical ending. The 2005 team is still IMO the best team they've had, even better than 04 and other world series winners. Losing Al Reyes before the postseason and not having a healthy Scott Rolen that year cost them a title IMO.

 

[Bobby Orrtuzzo]

Bader killing it in the playoffs so far for the Yanks

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Bader killing it in the playoffs so far for the Yanks

I'm happy for him. Trade looks like a win-win so far

 

[TheDizee]

we should trade dejong to the yankees so he can hit .300 with 30hrs again.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

There is a Dark Lord!!!

Also Waino will be returning for another year.

Hopefully we can get a hitting coach that's going to actually help our batters.

 

[BadgersandBlues]

Honestly, I'm happier that Maddux is leaving. For some reason Albert got all the hate year after year but our pitching staff hasn't exactly been dominant these last number of years, and that includes all our young pitching prospects that were supposed to come up and be at least useful. Remember the days when we could grab some guy off the scrap heap and he'd be a middle of the rotation starter for us for like 3 years under Duncan? Maddux never seemed like he really unlocked much with anyone.

Dunno how much I attribute our lack of hitting to our hitting coach vs. just us over valuing our prospects....Donovan, Edman, Nootbar, Arenado, and Goldschmidt all had solid (two even MVP) years. Yadi has been in decline for like five years now, I'm not sure how much of his terrible plate performance can be attributed to Albert.

At the end of the day, I think this team is in desperate need of some left-handed pop. Nootbar is good, but he's not enough. Gotta wonder if we had signed Schwarber if we'd be in the WS right now instead of the Phillies. But it always comes back to how much the front office is willing to pay guys in UFA - we'd rather sign five Steve Matz then one Scherzer.....ah well.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Honestly, I'm happier that Maddux is leaving. For some reason Albert got all the hate year after year but our pitching staff hasn't exactly been dominant these last number of years, and that includes all our young pitching prospects that were supposed to come up and be at least useful. Remember the days when we could grab some guy off the scrap heap and he'd be a middle of the rotation starter for us for like 3 years under Duncan? Maddux never seemed like he really unlocked much with anyone.

Dunno how much I attribute our lack of hitting to our hitting coach vs. just us over valuing our prospects....Donovan, Edman, Nootbar, Arenado, and Goldschmidt all had solid (two even MVP) years. Yadi has been in decline for like five years now, I'm not sure how much of his terrible plate performance can be attributed to Albert.

At the end of the day, I think this team is in desperate need of some left-handed pop. Nootbar is good, but he's not enough. Gotta wonder if we had signed Schwarber if we'd be in the WS right now instead of the Phillies. But it always comes back to how much the front office is willing to pay guys in UFA - we'd rather sign five Steve Matz then one Scherzer.....ah well.

I wanted both Maddux and Albert gone. So I'm happy with that. I am sad that Skip is gone tho.

Going into last season we were coming off of Gold Glove seasons for Bader and O'Neill and Carlson a finalist for NLROTY, all with O'Neill hitting 30 HRs. I don't think many would have suspected the injury wave that hit our OF to be so dramatic that we would have needed an All-Star Caliber Outfielder signing as well. But hindsight is 20/20.

I also still think Matz was a good signing. But, it would have been better with another signing to compliment it.

 

[Allens Five Hole]

Count me as one who did not understand the hatred for Jeff Albert. We were a top 5 offense and top 10 in every major slash line number this year. We went cold at the wrong time and that happens.

I could be projecting but I think those who attribute those failings to the hitting coach are older generation fans who are more used to the contact-style of baseball they grew up watching. The analytics have changed over the last decade+ and a result of that is that offenses will be much more hot and cold.

Majority of fans only watch their own team so they see those struggles up close and don't notice that essentially every other club, including the big boys, go through those lulls. It's simply the give and take of the new-age offense that values power and XBH over contact just for the sake of contact.

 

[TheDizee]

can we fire marmol and get Oquendo in as manager already?

willie mcgee for hitting coach
chris carpenter for pitching coach

 

[PJJJP]

Count me as one who did not understand the hatred for Jeff Albert. We were a top 5 offense and top 10 in every major slash line number this year. We went cold at the wrong time and that happens.

I could be projecting but I think those who attribute those failings to the hitting coach are older generation fans who are more used to the contact-style of baseball they grew up watching. The analytics have changed over the last decade+ and a result of that is that offenses will be much more hot and cold.

Majority of fans only watch their own team so they see those struggles up close and don't notice that essentially every other club, including the big boys, go through those lulls. It's simply the give and take of the new-age offense that values power and XBH over contact just for the sake of contact.

Every other fanbase hates their hitting coach. I just think people use them as the easy scapegoat when hitting goes cold over a bad stretch of games.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Arenado agrees to stay with the Cards until 2027. But, tells ownership they need to start spending money. Cards will be heavy in the Catcher and SS Market this offseason. Contreras most likely being the Cards Main target behind the plate.

 

[Davimir Tarablad]

Arenado agrees to stay with the Cards until 2027. But, tells ownership they need to start spending money. Cards will be heavy in the Catcher and SS Market this offseason. Contreras most likely being the Cards Main target behind the plate.

Apparently Wainwright's deal has deferred salary, so between that and the money Colorado is sending over for Arenado, Cards have a ton of open money for the payroll next year if they commit to increasing it.

 

[Vladys Gumption]

Arenado agrees to stay with the Cards until 2027. But, tells ownership they need to start spending money. Cards will be heavy in the Catcher and SS Market this offseason. Contreras most likely being the Cards Main target behind the plate.

Contreras would be a good add. But I still think we need another high end rotation arm.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Contreras would be a good add. But I still think we need another high end rotation arm.

100% I want them to grab Rodon. But, idk if we should really be adding another Starting LHP.

 

[Vladys Gumption]

100% I want them to grab Rodon. But, idk if we should really be adding another Starting LHP

I don’t really even care about handedness if we’re talking a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I don’t really even care about handedness if we’re talking a top of the rotation pitcher.

That's definitely fair.

 

[Vladys Gumption]

That's definitely fair.

I’d rank pitching and catcher above shortstop. Edman is good enough to play there every day. Gorman and Donovan can man second well enough.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I’d rank pitching and catcher above shortstop. Edman is good enough to play there every day. Gorman and Donovan can man second well enough.

I agree. Plus I'd like to get a better 4th OF than Dickerson. Unless Walker is ready for the big time next year.