Ontario Reign 22-23 thread. Nothin' lasts forever, even cold November Reign

[mysterman2]

Some have said he’s a top 9 players while others like myself say he has a very good chance of being too 6, Mike Richards type.
The kid creates a ridiculous amount of high danger chance, unfortunately most of his line mates have been underwhelming. Swap Lizotte with Turcotte and I guarantee you’d see that top 5 pedigree

Would love to see him get that chance....if not this season for next. I like Lizotte as undersized fireplug but hes been abused in recent games and looks like thats effected his decision making to some extent. I am really hoping Turcotte and get goal #1 this season just to get the monkey off his back. Gotta be squeezing the stick a bit tight these days.

 

[Vino]

Some have said he’s a top 9 players while others like myself say he has a very good chance of being top 6, Mike Richards type.
The kid creates a ridiculous amount of high danger chance, unfortunately most of his line mates have been underwhelming. Swap Lizotte with Turcotte and I guarantee you’d see that top 5 pedigree

Is this "others like myself say he has a very good chance of being top 6, Mike Richards type" - some kind inside joke, what I just don't get?

Turcotte is 21 - soon 22 - years old kid, who has not shown any signs, that he is a future top 6-player in the NHL. He has played four games in the NHL this season and how many puckbattles he has won? One or two? He really can skate and he competes, but he is undersized and easily outmuscled. And Mike Richards was a nasty, he had nastiness in his game and Turcotte has not.

Top 5 pedigree? Even Arizona's 5th round pick Matias Maccelli has shown more top 6-potential (in the AHL or in the NHL) than Turcotte. If Turcotte turns out to be a solid third line center (like Jimmy Fox says) I'm more than happy.

 

[Statto]

Is this "others like myself say he has a very good chance of being top 6, Mike Richards type" - some kind inside joke, what I just don't get?

Turcotte is 21 - soon 22 - years old kid, who has not shown any signs, that he is a future top 6-player in the NHL. He has played four games in the NHL this season and how many puckbattles he has won? One or two? He really can skate and he competes, but he is undersized and easily outmuscled. And Mike Richards was a nasty, he had nastiness in his game and Turcotte has not.

Top 5 pedigree? Even Arizona's 5th round pick Matias Maccelli has shown more top 6-potential (in the AHL or in the NHL) than Turcotte. If Turcotte turns out to be a solid third line center (like Jimmy Fox says) I'm more than happy.

I think you have to consider his age vs the injuries. I’m sure at this point it might have affected his upside however he is a smart, intense player and still has middle six potential. I disagree that he’s shown no signs because his game has looked NHL ready and I think he’s looked decent when he’s played. As RJ says he’s a guy that created opportunities for others, he also just makes things happen. For his offensive side to emerge he needs offensively gifted guys to capitalise on what he brings. However I’m quite happy for him to just get games currently, just to give him time to properly settle in.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I think you have to consider his age vs the injuries. I’m sure at this point it might have affected his upside however he is a smart, intense player and still has middle six potential. I disagree that he’s shown no signs because his game has looked NHL ready and I think he’s looked decent when he’s played. As RJ says he’s a guy that created opportunities for others, he also just makes things happen. For his offensive side to emerge he needs offensively gifted guys to capitalise on what he brings. However I’m quite happy for him to just get games currently, just to give him time to properly settle in.

I think that this year I've learned vs. the mean that I have great patience for prospects and very little for NHL staffs

I do think this forum at large discounts the effects of health issues on prospects and development. I know some will say that's just an excuse though.

When I had covid and lost 20 lbs I was bedridden. I tried to play a short executive golf course about 5 days after i was healthy and I came home wheezing and with bruises all over my core. I can't imagine walking right back into a pro sport like Byfield after his broken leg or illness. Or like Turcotte back into the middle of a college season. Or Rossi after cardiac issues. It absolutely takes time to get your body back to a spot where its timing is where you thought it was, where your mind is still writing checks your body can't cash.

 

[Trash Panda]

I think you have to consider his age vs the injuries. I’m sure at this point it might have affected his upside however he is a smart, intense player and still has middle six potential. I disagree that he’s shown no signs because his game has looked NHL ready and I think he’s looked decent when he’s played. As RJ says he’s a guy that created opportunities for others, he also just makes things happen. For his offensive side to emerge he needs offensively gifted guys to capitalise on what he brings. However I’m quite happy for him to just get games currently, just to give him time to properly settle in.

I’m obviously about as far from a professional athlete that someone could be, but after getting a decent chunk of my Meniscus trimmed out of my right knee, it took me longer to get back up to Beer-League speed than I ever thought it should. It still doesn’t feel half as decent as my good knee.

I can’t even begin to imagine how a kid his age would struggle to put on man strength & develop a pro game with the gauntlet of injuries he has dealt with.

He just oozes NHL smarts and potential, I just honestly think the guy needs time to trust his body again.

 

[Statto]

I’m obviously about as far from a professional athlete that someone could be, but after getting a decent chunk of my Meniscus trimmed out of my right knee, it took me longer to get back up to Beer-League speed than I ever thought it should. It still doesn’t feel half as decent as my good knee.

I can’t even begin to imagine how a kid his age would struggle to put on man strength & develop a pro game with the gauntlet of injuries he has dealt with.

He just oozes NHL smarts and potential, I just honestly think the guy needs time to trust his body again.

Agree. Just being on the ice is enough just now, he just needs time IMO.

 

[All The Kings Men]

I was at the Reign game last night and the plays Turcotte made that caught my eye were almost all in the defensive zone.

Solid game and he got himself a nice little goal on top.

 

[funky]

Kaliyev took massive steps, Vilardi is starting to look like an everyday pro player, Byfield is getting better and better each passing week and has shown he plays better with skilled players and now if Turcotte can stay healthy and gain momentum we have a great mix of high skilled players that can provide different skill sets

If Byfield keeps developing he is that rare unicorn of massive size, great speed, and high end skills.

Vilardi is another big body but with a big shot and great vision. he is also a right hand shot giving us a bumper on the PP

Kaliyev has an elite release. He oozes special team sniper. He also is a big body that is learning the other side of the game.

Turcotte is the ball if energy that can play with any of the above players. He is all over the ice, high energy and a guy I see leading the league in 3rd assists if that stat existed. He seems to drive offense without being credited in the stat sheet for offence. I really hope he stays healthy.

 

[Herby]

Helenius however was a 2nd rounder, did well at the WJC and the Finnish league but not a single goal so far. He is playing with an edge but that’s about it so far. Disappointing.

It would have been nice to let him play one more season in Finland to develop his offensive game a bit more. The Kings brought him over at 19, why?

 

[Surf Nutz]

It would have been nice to let him play one more season in Finland to develop his offensive game a bit more. The Kings brought him over at 19, why?

Adjustment to the north american game.
Up close development and evaluation and thats how they do it repeatedly'
That is how they will continue to do it.
Also he acts as a reserve in case there is a deluge of injuries at one position.
Its smart management of all significant assets.

 

[Herby]

Adjustment to the north american game.
Up close development and evaluation and thats how they do it repeatedly'
That is how they will continue to do it.
Also he acts as a reserve in case there is a deluge of injuries at one position.
Its smart management of all significant assets.

But is that good for letting a player grow offensively? It certainly wasn’t for Turcotte and Kupari.

I realize that Helenius wasn’t expected to be a big scorer, but he also wasn’t a 6th round goon prospect, he did show some offensive upside in the Finnish league. Is having him score 1 goal in 55 AHL games good for him in any way?

 

[King'sPawn]

But is that good for letting a player grow offensively? It certainly wasn’t for Turcotte and Kupari.

I realize that Helenius wasn’t expected to be a big scorer, but he also wasn’t a 6th round goon prospect, he did show some offensive upside in the Finnish league. Is having him score 1 goal in 55 AHL games good for him in any way?

While he's a second-round pick, I always saw Helenius as more of a bottom-six, tough guy, potentially culture changer type, like Kyle Clifford.

I'm not worried about his production or lack thereof. It would be nice to see more, but even if he scored 10 goals by now, would his expected role change drastically?

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Edit: wrong thread

 

[Surf Nutz]

But is that good for letting a player grow offensively? It certainly wasn’t for Turcotte and Kupari.

I realize that Helenius wasn’t expected to be a big scorer, but he also wasn’t a 6th round goon prospect, he did show some offensive upside in the Finnish league. Is having him score 1 goal in 55 AHL games good for him in any way?

It is a fair question.
It is hard to say, at times.
Especially with TMac demanding they develop first as a non-liability, regardless
A different coach, having a lot of the say about ice time and where, things could be different.

Turcotte was injured, some luck is involved.
Kupari is a better argument.
Helenius too, but we have seen this before with young men in their first year or two, especially from overseas.

I think generally earlier is better after evaluating their situation , and how much hope management has in them actually being a Kings player and if there are even bigger hopes, for the player to be part of the team's core.
All through the lens of Tmac being the main gatekeeper to those possibilities, until that changes

 

[Statto]

But is that good for letting a player grow offensively? It certainly wasn’t for Turcotte and Kupari.

I realize that Helenius wasn’t expected to be a big scorer, but he also wasn’t a 6th round goon prospect, he did show some offensive upside in the Finnish league. Is having him score 1 goal in 55 AHL games good for him in any way?

I suppose it depends on what they were seeing in Finland and how his team intended to use and develop him. If they were going to take him in a different direction to how the Kings saw him as a player, or maybe they just did not like his coaching team out there. I don’t know, I’d like to understand the rationale as the Finnish league is a pretty good one for preparing guys for the NHL. I’m definitely surprised he came over that early.

I think that’s my problem because we judge these things with hindsight and not knowing the true rationale. We start to think some of our speculation is definitely correct and build a narrative from it. With Turcotte we can say he should have stayed in college but in that first year everything seemed pretty chaotic at times with Turcottes use and deployment. The was a lot of talk that the game plan was ‘let Cole score’ which if true was great for him but perhaps not the best for the development of the other players. I didn’t see enough to say anything for certain but the stuff I saw made me understand why people said it. Later in the year when he was 100% fit he was definitely driving things and playing well but was still being used in a ‘bridesmaid’ role. So perhaps not how they wanted him used.

I’m not making excuses just speculating as to why they may have made the decision. Simply spit balling because I’m sure there will be factors we are not privy to.

IF it wasn’t a great environment in that first year I could understand why he went pro. Granted it definitely seemed better there the following season but that’s what hindsight gives us. Again there will be information we aren’t aware of but nobody is going to publicly say ‘Coach ‘A’ hated Turcotte, or something similar. We also have no idea how things will have gone had he not had the health and injury issues he’s had to deal with. Had he stayed healthy it could have been a genius decision - although with hindsight I agree he needed another year in college.

 

[mysterman2]

good comeback win last night....said it before and will say it again- spence is a lock as top 4 dman. Just no weakness to his game and ill be crushed if he is included in a package for some other player. Said before he is better than Durzi & Walker right now. Note as well...Fagemo/Chromiak really coming into their own. Chromiak in particular....19pts in 28 games, 16 pts in the last 15 games for a Euro Rookie playing in a mens league is impressive AF. Fagemo 2 goals in 13 at the NHL level getting 4th line ice time and hitting a couple of posts to boot. If im blake and making move- Turcotte and Grans should be the ones on the table.

 

[Schmooley]

good comeback win last night....said it before and will say it again- spence is a lock as top 4 dman. Just no weakness to his game and ill be crushed if he is included in a package for some other player. Said before he is better than Durzi & Walker right now. Note as well...Fagemo/Chromiak really coming into their own. Chromiak in particular....19pts in 28 games, 16 pts in the last 15 games for a Euro Rookie playing in a mens league is impressive AF. Fagemo 2 goals in 13 at the NHL level getting 4th line ice time and hitting a couple of posts to boot. If im blake and making move- Turcotte and Grans should be the ones on the table.

How far is Chromiak from the NHL? You project him as a top six player?
If they decide to move Byfield back to 3c could he be an option to play with Kopitar and Kempe?
Thanks for the update! I dont get to watch Reign games.

 

[BringTheReign]

I was at the Reign game last night and the plays Turcotte made that caught my eye were almost all in the defensive zone.

Solid game and he got himself a nice little goal on top.

That's Kings hockey, baby.

 

[Fishhead]

How far is Chromiak from the NHL? You project him as a top six player?
If they decide to move Byfield back to 3c could he be an option to play with Kopitar and Kempe?
Thanks for the update! I dont get to watch Reign games.

Chromiak is going to need another year at least. He can score and if given time and space he will do so. He won't get that luxury at the NHL level so he'll need to continue to work at that, kind of like how Arty learned to back off and give himself room. He's not a high level scorer despite his Jr. numbers, playing with Wright will do that for you. But he's no Roussin, either.

I don't see top-line player in him. I do think he'll be a little boom/bust at this point, I don't see a wider range of tools say like a Kupari, where he could adapt his game to lower lines at the NHL level. He's not particularly big and certainly not physical. His skating is average overall, decent speed but with an inefficient stride. Not as noticeable as Clarke.

If I had to project I'd say upside of a decent third line option, downside AHL tweener.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Chromiak has given me Toffoli vibes since juniors

Maybe a little shiftier

 

[Fishhead]

Chromiak has given me Toffoli vibes since juniors

Maybe a little shiftier

If he turns into that I'll be ecstatic.

My biggest concern with Chromiak was that he wasn't impressive anywhere until he got stapled next to Wright. Without him, he's maybe a 30g guy in his 19-year-old season. Tyler almost hit 60 when he was a year younger and was doing it pretty much by himself.

He's got more warts, obviously, being a 5th rounder. Losing that pandemic year makes his development a difficult read because we all know a lot of the Euro leagues don't give opportunities to younger guys unless they are flat-out stars. 3 straight years in Kingston would have made it easier to gauge the Wright effect.

 

[kings11]

good comeback win last night....said it before and will say it again- spence is a lock as top 4 dman. Just no weakness to his game and ill be crushed if he is included in a package for some other player. Said before he is better than Durzi & Walker right now. Note as well...Fagemo/Chromiak really coming into their own. Chromiak in particular....19pts in 28 games, 16 pts in the last 15 games for a Euro Rookie playing in a mens league is impressive AF. Fagemo 2 goals in 13 at the NHL level getting 4th line ice time and hitting a couple of posts to boot. If im blake and making move- Turcotte and Grans should be the ones on the table.

Fagemo is expendable as he lacks any willingness to be physical and his board play is nearly non existent. As for who’s in play for trade, well that depends on how they feel about Arvy, AI and Lizotte. If those guys are being kept long term then Turcotte, Fagemo, Pinelli, Madden, Kupari and maybe even JAD could be in play.
On the defensive front, they need to decide what to do with Durzi, Walker, Roy and Bjornfot.. Clarke and Spence are top 4 Dmen prospect and scouts and teams are drooling over guys like Grans and his tool box.. so what do you do there?
Tough decisions need to be made at the TDL, draft and off-season.

 

[Statto]

I thin

How far is Chromiak from the NHL? You project him as a top six player?
If they decide to move Byfield back to 3c could he be an option to play with Kopitar and Kempe?
Thanks for the update! I dont get to watch Reign games.

I think his health issues this year mean that he will only get a call up this season in an injury crisis but stranger things have happened. He’s in great form so there is a case for it, even if next season is the much more realistic option for a mid season cup of coffee.

 

[Schmooley]

I thin

I think his health issues this year mean that he will only get a call up this season in an injury crisis but stranger things have happened. He’s in great form so there is a case for it, even if next season is the much more realistic option for a mid season cup of coffee.

Yea I wasnt thinking this season. More asking if he had a chance to make it out of camp next season if Byfield moves back to center.
Kopitar and Kempe can create space on the ice for a good goal scorer if he can find soft areas.

 

[Surf Nutz]

Yea I wasnt thinking this season. More asking if he had a chance to make it out of camp next season if Byfield moves back to center.
Kopitar and Kempe can create space on the ice for a good goal scorer if he can find soft areas.

Blake likes to keep guys that are not trusted by TMac and showing real potential down until there ELC expires. That way he can sign the to the next contract cheaper.
Most here don't see it and are at their wits end as to why Blake hold the majority down and only the truly exceptional are allowed up.
Chromiak will fall in the hold down group.
He has a lot of potential and we will see how he grows and develops.