Seravalli: Official JT Miller Trade Thread - NEW Update (1/25/22) - Rangers Interest "Next Level"

[Boom Boom Apathy]

This post is satire right? Miller does not get his majority of points from the powerplay, can also play all three positions very well, and is usually the first guy over the boards on the PP and PK.

But then to follow up all that with "Stop talking about the Rangers as if you actually watch them, because it’s clear as day that you don’t".

A+ irony.

I did a summary on the Canes board comparing him to Necas, which is why I chose just last year and this year (trying to get close to 82ish games total). Here's the breakdown of his scoring (did this a few days ago so a couple more games may have been played since).

NOTE: I think if you go back to the first season he was in VAN, the 5v5 numbers look much better though per my discussion with another VAN fan. Anyhow, here it is for last season and this:

He's had 84 points in 91 games over the past 2 seasons broken down as follows:

Total: 84 points
5v5: 37 points: This total points ranks around 80th for NHL forwards over this stretch.
PP: 35 points: This ranks 7th best for NHL forwards over this stretch.
3v3: 4
PK. 1
W/EN: 2
A/EN: 4
4v4(?): 1

He most certainly has excelled on the PP last season and this. He is one of the top point producers in the NHL over that stretch. Only 6 forwards have more points on the PP than Miller over that stretch (McDavid, Drai, Rantanen, Huberdeau, McKinnon, P. Kane).

 

[bernmeister]

No bud, you are the most misinformed person on these boards and that's saying a lot.

The fact that I am right and you are wrong in this instance is confirmed by the fact that any and all overtures to acquire Sanderson, even if by overpay, are rejected by the base here at HFB, which suggests in this instance, they are in sync with club mgmt/ownership.

You can NOT put forth any counter narrative that Sens are open to any such trading of Sanderson.

Ergo, .... give it up. And while you are at it, admit defeat.

 

[Bettman Returnz]

This thread has gotten really pathetic… think this will be the last time I even browse it. Whole lot of nothing coming out of it lol.

 

[BatVader]

Not a bad deal, but why are Jets fans souring on Scheiele?

It’s a culture and leadership change thing.
PoMo, Wheeler, and Scheifele were the culture and leadership of the team and they’ve failed, so it’s time for a change.
PoMo is already gone and now Wheeler and Scheifele need to go.
Wheelers contract makes moving him difficult, so Scheifele is the obvious next choice.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

irrelevant
what he can actually bring back is established by several factors
one of which is supply and demand
so the first ?, before we consider who actually is available, is to look at who can potentially be made available.
He will NOT actually be made available, but theoretically since Rangers have Schneider he could be put on the table, even if only in theory not practice.
My point then is what clubs have a Schneider calibre guy. That is the first ?, then can they be considered available for trade, at all.
Rangers not making Schneider available Trouba's heir, etc etc.
Sens have Sanderson on the way, he is apparently not on the table even for a decent profit.

My pt remains: high quality D prospects can be found. Better still guys are likely not.
'nucks can look for such a guy, but are not likely to find, and still even less likely to find one available.

Instead of unrealistic Schneider, consider a Jones + type

Jones as in Seth Jones?

Miller not being a rental COMPLETELY relevant. Ignoring that is ridiculous. You talk about supply and demand and that is exactly why Miller would fetch the moon. There are zero players at his skill level, ability to play all 3 forward positions and special teams, salary, contract and drive. You’re really going to be surprised if he’s dealt, I just don’t see us moving him.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

Joe Pavelski absolutely is. You obviously haven't been watching him this year. He is the Dallas Stars offense.

Pavelski is not better than JT Miller nice try though Playing on a s*** offensive team will make him look that way though. Miller is 28…Pavelski is how old? Exactly

 

[Snowman]

Not a bad deal, but why are Jets fans souring on Scheiele?

Most aren't. The Jets wouldn't do that deal in reality.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

JT Miller isn’t a fit here and isn’t getting PP TOI over anyone and that’s where the majority of his offense comes from.

Pavelski literally plays both positions the team needs and can go on either PP or PK unit. He would also compliment both lines in the top-6 better.

Stop talking about the Rangers as if you actually watch them, because it’s clear as day that you don’t.

Actually it’s clear as day YOU haven’t watched a single Canucks game.

Miller plays every forward position and has been our best PP forward; not only that but you said “Pavelski plays both positions the team needs”. Miller literally plays Center and both wing positions so again another clueless comment. Hes a better PP option that Kreider but a long shot and better than Strome. It would make your PP2 that much stronger bumping Kreider there. He’s also one of the best faceoff men in the league and can play the PK. He can literally do it all. Saying he’s not a fit is ridiculous and considering numerous reports have come out saying the Rangers are seriously interested, your GM clearly thinks he’s a fit. We’ll gladly keep him though and you can spend assets on a one year aging rental in Pavelski

 

[Canuck Luck]

The fact that I am right and you are wrong in this instance is confirmed by the fact that any and all overtures to acquire Sanderson, even if by overpay, are rejected by the base here at HFB, which suggests in this instance, they are in sync with club mgmt/ownership.

You can NOT put forth any counter narrative that Sens are open to any such trading of Sanderson.

Ergo, .... give it up. And while you are at it, admit defeat.

This logic is so flawed. There’s 2 major issues with it.

1. Sens are a bottom team so their goal is to add young prospects not trade them
2.they 100% would trade him for an overpay. If they were offered. McDavid/drai/matthews/mackinnon/barkov etc they would 100 run him out of town for any of those guys

 

[bernmeister]

Jones as in Seth Jones?

Miller not being a rental COMPLETELY relevant. Ignoring that is ridiculous. You talk about supply and demand and that is exactly why Miller would fetch the moon. There are zero players at his skill level, ability to play all 3 forward positions and special teams, salary, contract and drive. You’re really going to be surprised if he’s dealt, I just don’t see us moving him.

your attempt to evade the point will not succeed
Yes, he can fetch the moon IF IF IF it is available at all to be put on the table
AND then somebody does that.
Schneider/his types pushing a unicorn mold are not available.
And you know which Jones. Feigning stupidity will not help here.

 

[bernmeister]

This logic is so flawed. There’s 2 major issues with it.

1. Sens are a bottom team so their goal is to add young prospects not trade them
2.they 100% would trade him for an overpay. If they were offered. McDavid/drai/matthews/mackinnon/barkov etc they would 100 run him out of town for any of those guys

Logic is not flawed. #1 supports my position.
#2 is fair, but you have no substance to back that up unless you go from a profitable overpay to a crazy too good an offer to turn down, which is an exception to the rule on what would be offered, not the rule

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Still think the Avs get him and are the best fit especially since they've made it public that Sakic has no intention on resigning Kadri this summer. Would rather have Miller anyways.

 

[LuLover96]

Fact is Miller would instantly become the third best skater behind Fox and Breadman, at 2.6, you take that and run.

 

[bernmeister]

Still think the Avs get him and are the best fit especially since they've made it public that Sakic has no intention on resigning Kadri this summer. Would rather have Miller anyways.

Avs are a great fit for that reason.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Avs are a great fit for that reason.

Sakic needs to make it happen after last years trade deadline blunders. Mackinnon needs support down the middle in the playoffs, he can't do it all himself.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Still think the Avs get him and are the best fit especially since they've made it public that Sakic has no intention on resigning Kadri this summer. Would rather have Miller anyways.

Sakic will more likely go after someone who costs less.

 

[Canuck Luck]

Logic is not flawed. #1 supports my position.
#2 is fair, but you have no substance to back that up unless you go from a profitable overpay to a crazy too good an offer to turn down, which is an exception to the rule on what would be offered, not the rule

how does #1 support your position? NYR are #2 in their division, 4th in their conference, 5th in the entire NHL. They are at this point a contender. The Sens however are 2nd last in their division, 2nd last in their conference, 3rd last in the entire NHL.

So how does the Sens making roster decisions based on being a bottom 3 team support how the Rangers, being a top 5 team, make their roster decisions?? I'm confused here Bern. Are you saying the are Rangers looking to tank down to bottom 5 like the Sens rather than go for a Stanley Cup run? Can you explain why the Rangers would be influenced by how the Senators would manage their roster instead of other top teams?

As to point 2, sure its a crazy too good offer, however your previous statement was and I quote " any and all overtures to acquire Sanderson, even if by overpay, are rejected by the base here at HFB. You can NOT put forth any counter narrative that Sens are open to any such trading of Sanderson."

Now you have admitted that the Senators would trade Sanderson since those offers I suggested fall under any and all.

So can we agree that we have established the fact that the Rangers are and should not be emulating or be influenced by how the Senators make roster decisions, and that yes the Sens would trade Sanderson if it made sense ergo Schneider can be had. Don't confuse that as me saying y'all have to trade him or will. Just that he's not an untouchable piece as you suggest.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Sakic will more likely go after someone who costs less.

You get what you pay for. All Cup winners over the past decade won with a very strong 1-2 punch down the middle.

And then when Newhook is ready to be their #2C, move Miller back to wing. Miller would be a very good mentor for someone like Newhook.

 

[One Winged Angel]

Now this thread has gone off the rails when we start saying Kessel is a more effective player. Wowzers.

For the Rangers? Yes.

I never said Kessel is a better player. I said Kessel would be more effective for the Rangers.

Read. It helps.

 

[One Winged Angel]

Actually it’s clear as day YOU haven’t watched a single Canucks game.

Miller plays every forward position and has been our best PP forward; not only that but you said “Pavelski plays both positions the team needs”. Miller literally plays Center and both wing positions so again another clueless comment. Hes a better PP option that Kreider but a long shot and better than Strome. It would make your PP2 that much stronger bumping Kreider there. He’s also one of the best faceoff men in the league and can play the PK. He can literally do it all. Saying he’s not a fit is ridiculous and considering numerous reports have come out saying the Rangers are seriously interested, your GM clearly thinks he’s a fit. We’ll gladly keep him though and you can spend assets on a one year aging rental in Pavelski

The fact that you think that they would move Strome off PP1 for Miller shows how clueless you actually are.

Then to boot, you’re naive enough to believe that Seravalli couldn’t be being fed something by a Vancouver staff member to drum up interest, which is a very common practice by teams and media.

Get lost.

 

[bernmeister]

Sakic needs to make it happen after last years trade deadline blunders. Mackinnon needs support down the middle in the playoffs, he can't do it all himself.

Any interest in expiring Strome as a rental? NY can't afford him at any # next year, smartest move is not self rent but go w/his mins to Chytil + Barron + later on Krav. Ideally seeking picks which = no cap. Can retain if nec. Not looking for overpay, just fair market value, which no retain or bad salary coming back, is a late 1st or equiv 2nd + in same yr, little more if pick(s) deferred. Give a good offer, will meet you more than half way if I can.

 

[bernmeister]

how does #1 support your position? NYR are #2 in their division, 4th in their conference, 5th in the entire NHL. They are at this point a contender. The Sens however are 2nd last in their division, 2nd last in their conference, 3rd last in the entire NHL.

So how does the Sens making roster decisions based on being a bottom 3 team support how the Rangers, being a top 5 team, make their roster decisions?? I'm confused here Bern. Are you saying the are Rangers looking to tank down to bottom 5 like the Sens rather than go for a Stanley Cup run? Can you explain why the Rangers would be influenced by how the Senators would manage their roster instead of other top teams?

As to point 2, sure its a crazy too good offer, however your previous statement was and I quote " any and all overtures to acquire Sanderson, even if by overpay, are rejected by the base here at HFB. You can NOT put forth any counter narrative that Sens are open to any such trading of Sanderson."

Now you have admitted that the Senators would trade Sanderson since those offers I suggested fall under any and all.

So can we agree that we have established the fact that the Rangers are and should not be emulating or be influenced by how the Senators make roster decisions, and that yes the Sens would trade Sanderson if it made sense ergo Schneider can be had. Don't confuse that as me saying y'all have to trade him or will. Just that he's not an untouchable piece as you suggest.

Let me extend a quick courtesy ans. as I'm a bit crushed atm.

A. How each team rolls is exclusive of the other.
B. point 1 was "Sens are a bottom team so their goal is to add young prospects not trade them"
I'm not sure how what I said is contrary to that. They DO want to add prospects, tho I think this is less a matter of position in the standings as it is composition of the roster.
You might think more than a dollar for a dollar + of acceptable product currency, ie good prospects would be considered. But since something like a core of Krav, Nils L, Jones with Strome as a throw in for Sanderson + an acceptable add has not been welcomed, let alone considered, to date, that means that yes, prospects are still on the radar but primo prospects are less likely to be available.

C point 2: Yes, you got me. I was technically wrong. Although the context of what I said supported my point, I did say as you quoted: "any and all overtures to acquire Sanderson, even if by overpay...". This is my own damn fault for being sloppy. "Any and all" = absolute language and only God is absolute. I should have added "Nearly" in front of it. That would have been sufficient while disclaiming for insane offers that are beyond regular overpay into massive crazy overpay
Thrust of my argument, language corrected, holds -- Sandy not being made available

 

[AHLdepth]

The fact that you think that they would move Strome off PP1 for Miller shows how clueless you actually are.

Then to boot, you’re naive enough to believe that Seravalli couldn’t be being fed something by a Vancouver staff member to drum up interest, which is a very common practice by teams and media.

Get lost.

Now I'm open to the idea that maybe Strome has some indescribable chemistry with someone on the Rangers that makes a powerplay click and it's not showing up on the statsheet, but those are pretty aggressive words to use given that.....Player Comparison: J.T. Miller vs. Ryan Strome | Stathead.com

Educate me a bit more on exactly why this was heresy against the ancient magic to suggest that Miller would have been an upgrade?

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

The fact that I am right and you are wrong in this instance is confirmed by the fact that any and all overtures to acquire Sanderson, even if by overpay, are rejected by the base here at HFB, which suggests in this instance, they are in sync with club mgmt/ownership.

You can NOT put forth any counter narrative that Sens are open to any such trading of Sanderson.

Ergo, .... give it up. And while you are at it, admit defeat.

I never once said that bud, pay attention, you compared the two teams situations and why each player was unavailable, if you can't understand that the difference in standings changes the context completely as to why the Sens wouldn't trade Sanderson given they are a basement dweller, and why the Rangers would trade a blue chipper given they are in 2nd in the division, I don't know what to tell you, again your misinformed or intentionally ignorant I can't tell which.

I'm not saying that the Rangers would give up anyone by the way, just that comparing the Sens to the Rangers given the outlook of each team is ridiculous. They are literally complete opposites.

 

[AHLdepth]

I did a summary on the Canes board comparing him to Necas, which is why I chose just last year and this year (trying to get close to 82ish games total). Here's the breakdown of his scoring (did this a few days ago so a couple more games may have been played since).

NOTE: I think if you go back to the first season he was in VAN, the 5v5 numbers look much better though per my discussion with another VAN fan. Anyhow, here it is for last season and this:

He's had 84 points in 91 games over the past 2 seasons broken down as follows:

Total: 84 points
5v5: 37 points: This total points ranks around 80th for NHL forwards over this stretch.
PP: 35 points: This ranks 7th best for NHL forwards over this stretch.
3v3: 4
PK. 1
W/EN: 2
A/EN: 4
4v4(?): 1

He most certainly has excelled on the PP last season and this. He is one of the top point producers in the NHL over that stretch. Only 6 forwards have more points on the PP than Miller over that stretch (McDavid, Drai, Rantanen, Huberdeau, McKinnon, P. Kane).

Man I genuinely appreciate the deep dive on his stats, thank you!

I'm not exactly sure what part of my response you are replying to specifically though lol. First glance it seems you would be trying to reference my point about "not getting his majority of points on the powerplay" by saying "look he actually DOES get many points in the powerplay", but I wasn't trying to refute that he is good on the powerplay, simply that he does not exclusively rely on the powerplay for points, as evidenced by your breakdown of (essentially) 35 points on the PP and 49 points elsewhere.