Speculation: Official JT Miller Trade Thread II - NEW Update (1/25/22) - Rangers Interest "Next Level"

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EP to Kuzmenko

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Dec 5, 2015
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@TomKosto

Look at the date in the thread title. On 1.25, NYR's interest was so "next level" that we're three weeks later and nothing has happened.

Do you still want to pretend that information isn't leaked to reporters for the purpose of manipulating the market/demand? Or maybe even for other purposes?
JR wasn't doing any trades until his GM and AGMs were in place to discuss the future of the team. They just got their last AGM like last week. Miller likely isn't dealt, if at all, until the first week of March.
 

John Johnson

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Apr 11, 2019
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Yeah, Miller is better than Toffoli, but Calgary effectively gave up a late 1st, a 5th, a mediocre bottom six prospect, and a nothing roster player. The gap between Miller and Toffoli doesn't increase that to a top prospect. It increases it to a B level prospect and an upgrade on the 5th round pick.
Yes it does. You are heavily underrating Miller here.
 

Ita

Registered User
Mar 11, 2019
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Not sure what this has to do with me but thanks for putting your opinion out there. It's real valuable.

Actually, after re-reading, your first sentence could be directed at and completely apply to many Canucks fans.

I guess you will just ignore that Miller is top 20 in the league in scoring since he joined the Canucks? The fact that you claimed " The gap between Miller and Toffoli doesn't increase that to a top prospect. " is already concrete proof that you can properly value a player. I am going to come back and quote you when the trade actually happens and see who's take is closer..
 
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Kranix

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Jun 27, 2012
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@TomKosto

Look at the date in the thread title. On 1.25, NYR's interest was so "next level" that we're three weeks later and nothing has happened.

Do you still want to pretend that information isn't leaked to reporters for the purpose of manipulating the market/demand? Or maybe even for other purposes?
Can't be stressed enough: Unless you see Dreger or Friedman say, "hearing today..." it's not happening soon and might be total bullshit. Not even Seravalli.
 

AHLdepth

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Feb 17, 2020
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Can't be stressed enough: Unless you see Dreger or Friedman or tsn/sportsnet guy super close to a team say, "hearing today..." it's not happening soon and might be total bullshit. Not even Seravalli.

It's definitely appearing that "Next level" is more likely "other teams have asked about availability, but the Rangers have possibly kicked the tires with the outline of an offer"
 

Nucklehead Supreme

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Jul 10, 2011
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Yeah, Miller is better than Toffoli, but Calgary effectively gave up a late 1st, a 5th, a mediocre bottom six prospect, and a nothing roster player. The gap between Miller and Toffoli doesn't increase that to a top prospect. It increases it to a B level prospect and an upgrade on the 5th round pick.


This is just an awful take
 

TheHelmet

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Feb 10, 2021
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Well the market is set

Miller is a better player than Toffoli
If Van retains........... that could be a hefty return.

not sure if they want to retain seeing as they have potentially Halak's bonuses, Virtanen's Buyout, Holtby's Buyout,

But Luongo recapture does end.
 
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TomKosto

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Oct 17, 2017
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@TomKosto

Look at the date in the thread title. On 1.25, NYR's interest was so "next level" that we're three weeks later and nothing has happened.

Do you still want to pretend that information isn't leaked to reporters for the purpose of manipulating the market/demand? Or maybe even for other purposes?
Sure they are and most of the time, it happen to be true, when reported by multiple source, like Lebrun. Look at Toffoli, he got a first+.
 

Nucklehead Supreme

Registered User
Jul 10, 2011
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Not sure what this has to do with me but thanks for putting your opinion out there. It's real valuable.

Actually, after re-reading, your first sentence could be directed at and completely apply to many Canucks fans.


No it has to do with you, I honestly don't think Miller get's a blue chipper like Schneider or Rossi etc. but to say the difference in value between Toffoli and Miller is a b prospect either means you have a gigantic bias against the canucks or your simply don't understand hockey.
 

John Mandalorian

2022 Avs: The First Dance
Nov 29, 2018
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Well the market is set

Miller is a better player than Toffoli
If Van retains........... that could be a hefty return.

not sure if they want to retain seeing as they have potentially Halak's bonuses, Virtanen's Buyout, Holtby's Buyout,

But Luongo recapture does end.

Is that really true? What if the teams in on Miller think Calgary paid entirely too much? The price is where the supply curve meets the demand curve, no?
 
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EP to Kuzmenko

Registered User
Dec 5, 2015
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Well the market is set

Miller is a better player than Toffoli
If Van retains........... that could be a hefty return.

not sure if they want to retain seeing as they have potentially Halak's bonuses, Virtanen's Buyout, Holtby's Buyout,

But Luongo recapture does end.
I doubt the Canucks go fishing for a high price UFA this year. Management has said we are retooling a likely 2 years away. Retaining for next season to increase value is likely on the table.
 

John Mandalorian

2022 Avs: The First Dance
Nov 29, 2018
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Then they can stop asking, and probably shouldn't bother checking in on guys like Giroux or Hertl since they obviously prefer dumpster diving.

OK. But if you wait a year, the home run you're after will likely turn into a double or a single.
 

BKarchitect

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Oct 12, 2017
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Kansas City, MO
Lol at all these hot takes that Toffoli deal has anything to do with Miller (in either direction). The Miller market today is exactly the same as it was yesterday. People reading way too much into a deal that has no bearing on what Vancouver does with Miller. It doesn’t “set the market” for Miller in any way shape or form.
 
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Canucks LB

My Favourite, Gone too soon, RIP Luc, We miss you
Oct 12, 2008
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I think these are two seperate topics.
First part about Zacha, and Second part maybe Washington interested in JT Miller?
 

Canucks LB

My Favourite, Gone too soon, RIP Luc, We miss you
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Yeah I think that pretty much solidifies that Miller isn't going to return the top blue chip prospect Canucks fans want.
JT Miller is better than Toffoli in basically every single fathomable way.
All this did was basically confirmed it's going to take a 1st + Top prospect minimum for JT
 

Big Daddy Cane

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I'm not suggesting Canucks fans are going to get everything they want here but I don't see the comparison.

Miller is an all-around play driving 1st liner while Toffoli is a good secondary scorer.

The difference in value here ought to be a good prospect, or the upgrade of a good prospect to a top prospect (at least).

I was arguing against a comparison being made here, not making one.

A subset of teams are in a competitive position to pursue a short-term rental. A subset of that subset even has a top tier young asset. Whether any team that meets that criteria has the willingness to move that type of asset remains to be seen. History is against it, but Miller could be uniquely good enough to render that irrelevant.

Playoff 1sts and equivalent prospects are more readily available. Toffoli went for an asset in that bucket.
 

BKarchitect

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Oct 12, 2017
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What? It doesn’t confirm anything. I absolutely agree Miller is a different level of player but that in and of itself should be evidence that linking these two deals is ridiculous.

The trade return for a player isn’t a chart that simply zooms up exponentially. Toffoli is a lesser player but the appetite for a greater number of teams to give up a late 1st and middling prospect is much, much larger. I find it extremely hard to believe that if the Rangers didn’t want to give up Schneider before that they are suddenly going to say “well, I guess Toffoli went for this amount so now we owe it to Vancouver to exponentially beat the Flames package for TT by “x” amount because Miller is “x” amount a better player.

That’s not to say Vancouver won’t and shouldn’t get a huge package. If the right team wants Miller, I expect the return to be impressive. But there’s no guarantee that right team, right package moment is going to occur by the trade deadline. And the TT deal has zero to do with it. If the Rangers end up giving up Schneider it’s because they were always willing to go there if that’s where negotiations went and they really wanted to add Miller. Not because Drury woke up and saw the return for Toffoli.
 
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