Speculation: Official JT Miller Trade Thread II - NEW Update (1/25/22) - Rangers Interest "Next Level"

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Take a guess.

Also, it depends on what you call a prospect.

Byram/Newhook is too much to give for JTM and Canucks fans won’t be happy with what’s left. The two teams aren’t good trade partners.

No team will give up a Byram/Newhook return for Miller, period.

Canucks fans really need to realize this.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Thats why Sakic needs to upgrade Newhook to Miller. I think Canucks would easily trade Miller for Newhook, 1st plus other pieces if NYR doesnt go for Miller. Not sure why Avs fans refuse to give up Newhook for a chance to win cups?

No.

 

[heisenbergsitti]

How about we stop overrating prospects?
Not the guy who’s over a PPG, Can play any forward position, any situation and is locked in at just over 5 for 2 more years

Yeah I am sure you know more than GM's. We didn't give up Rossi or Calen addison for eichel. Jt Miller being bashed by Boudreau and Canucks media saying he has a habit of not getting back to play since being there is a bad look for JT along with his contract ending in 1.5 years. He's not getting what Canucks fans think

 

[rangersfansince08]

No doubt they're hoping they can upgrade their roster as needed without needing to move him, thus theoretically actually *extending* their window (so long as Newhook grows as expected)

Given there are other options out there, I can't say I blame them.

No argument from me that a three headed Mackinnon/Miller/Kadri monster down the middle wouldn't be a force to be reckoned with however

They probably can't afford Kadri after this season so trading Newhook seems out of the question.

 

[bernmeister]

No team will give up a Byram/Newhook return for Miller, period.

Canucks fans really need to realize this.

if no adds, Newhook is too much and Byram is too risky, so concur

 

[DeltaSwede]

Yeah I am sure you know more than GM's. We didn't give up Rossi or Calen addison for eichel. Jt Miller being bashed by Boudreau and Canucks media saying he has a habit of not getting back to play since being there is a bad look for JT along with his contract ending in 1.5 years. He's not getting what Canucks fans think

And you didn't get Eichel. Way to prove a point.

 

[Canuck86]

if no adds, Newhook is too much and Byram is too risky, so concur

Haha...Newhook is too much on his own for JT...ya okay, a PPG all situation forward signed through next year is NOT worth a player like Newhook eh!!?!??

Have fun wasting another year of MacK and his team friendly contract, Colorado needs to add if they want to go far and adding costs a team assets.

Let me guess, Colorado will gladly give up a 1st, Jost and something else to get Giroux with retention from Philly and Arizona though right!?!?

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

Have fun wasting another year of MacK and his team friendly contract, Colorado needs to add if they want to go far and adding costs a team assets.

The irony of this coming from a Canucks fan.

 

[Bazeek]

And you didn't get Eichel. Way to prove a point.

I think the point is more that Guerin's shown himself to be pretty comfortable passing on "opportunities" to lose those prospects.

A big problem with Miller going to Minnesota is that Vancouver will rightfully see the extra year on his deal as adding a lot of value, but it's value that doesn't help Minnesota all that much with the escalating buyout cap hits. To fit Miller in we'd probably need retention on his already-low AAV, which would cost more on top of everything else. They'd be paying premium prices for things that they may not even want, under the circumstances.

Someone with an expiring deal probably makes more sense, in the end.

 

[bernmeister]

Haha...Newhook is too much on his own for JT...ya okay, a PPG all situation forward signed through next year is NOT worth a player like Newhook eh!!?!??

Have fun wasting another year of MacK and his team friendly contract, Colorado needs to add if they want to go far and adding costs a team assets.

Let me guess, Colorado will gladly give up a 1st, Jost and something else to get Giroux with retention from Philly and Arizona though right!?!?

since you asked...
productive player [prospect] w/longer term cost controlled > vet who is not

this ^ assumes projected if not actual production is ballpark close. In a vacuum, short term, Miller may be > than Newhook who may fall short, equal or surpass JT. But he is a good risk to be productive and the added years at cheaper cap are a signif factor.

 

[Horton Hears A Woo]

The irony of this coming from a Canucks fan.

People who are saying Miller isn’t worth NH that’s a joke. Miller is elite and you guys could only hope one day newhook becomes even close to Miller

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

People who are saying Miller isn’t worth NH that’s a joke. Miller is elite and you guys could only hope one day newhook becomes even close to Miller

1.5 years of Miller isnt work Newhook.

 

[NYVanfan]

1.5 years of Miller isnt work Newhook.

yeah, I'm a Canuck fan and I think Newhook is a special prospect that I would not expect them to give ...and would be over the moon if Miller landed him. I think we can both expect a big haul for Miller and not expect guys like Newhook or Lafreniene

 

[Bettman Returnz]

yeah, I'm a Canuck fan and I think Newhook is a special prospect that I would not expect them to give ...and would be over the moon if Miller landed him. I think we can both expect a big haul for Miller and not expect guys like Newhook or Lafreniene

Agreed! It’s not going to be their best prospects (that are in nhl now). It will likely be the tier below/ not quite nhl ready ones.

Ala lambos/ lysell/ Barron/ othmann types (if I were to make a guess). *and no not saying all these names are the same level/caliber just a general idea.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Yeah I am sure you know more than GM's. We didn't give up Rossi or Calen addison for eichel. Jt Miller being bashed by Boudreau and Canucks media saying he has a habit of not getting back to play since being there is a bad look for JT along with his contract ending in 1.5 years. He's not getting what Canucks fans think

Care to provide a source for this?

 

[John Johnson]

Honestly, these contending teams should just stand pat going into the playoffs. They don't need to add, its not like the previous 5-10 cup winners have all added at the deadline by paying decent assets to acquire players that put them over the top or anything.

 

[Paul Padovano]

Very well said. I’d love Miller. I can see why Nucks fans want Schneids. He’s a hell of a player already. But I’m not moving a cost controlled RHD Thats 20 and can do everything you’d want in a 6-2, 210 pound defender.

But Vancouver would accept Schneider as PART of a deal. Straight up, one for one, I say no.

 

[Canuck86]

The irony of this coming from a Canucks fan.

Canucks went all in when we were good, and recently when we stunk thanks to an inept GM giving up a top 10 pick for 6 more years of OEL screwing our cap up!

Colorado is my 2nd favourite team due to Burnaby Joe Sakic, but he needs to add to compete for the cup, what the TDL brings only he is in control of...us fans just discuss it to death on forums like this

 

[Canadian Canuck]

Yeah I am sure you know more than GM's. We didn't give up Rossi or Calen addison for eichel. Jt Miller being bashed by Boudreau and Canucks media saying he has a habit of not getting back to play since being there is a bad look for JT along with his contract ending in 1.5 years. He's not getting what Canucks fans think

Lil you and others still don’t get it hey? Miller has the same if not more value than Eichel did when he got traded. Eichel had very dangerous surgery and his career can end with just one more injury there. He’s also making double of what JT Miller is and specifically had a handful of places he wanted to go to. And your statement is simply not true. If Addison wasn’t available for Eichel then YIKES on Guerin. That’s brutal. Tuch+Krebs+1st is also literally a top 6 young powerforward a top prospect and a 1st. That’s a solid package almost identical to Rossi+Lambos+Addison. Not to mention only 2 teams had enough cap that were interested. Stop making this garbage comparison.

point 2: Way to overreact and blow it out of proportion. Bruce made a comment that he’d talk to Miller after an overtime effort. Nobody said he has a bad look of always not going back for the play

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Honestly, these contending teams should just stand pat going into the playoffs. They don't need to add, its not like the previous 5-10 cup winners have all added at the deadline by paying decent assets to acquire players that put them over the top or anything.

* some of the previous 5-10 cup winners

Post-lockout, it's been a mixed bag. Some teams have done major surgery (Boston, Tampa I). Others have done little to nothing (Anaheim, St. Louis). The bulk have made relatively minor moves, addressing the middle of the lineup in quality. Only L.A. stands out there as a team that paid a significant price for a significant player.

Year	Cup Winner	Notable Mid-season/Deadline Moves
05-06	Carolina	Recchi, Weight
06-07	Anaheim	May
07-08	Detroit	Stuart
08-09	Pittsburgh	Kunitz, Guerin
09-10	Chicago	Johnsson (Didn't play in the playoffs)
10-11	Boston	Kaberle, Kelly, Peverley
11-12	L.A.	Carter
13	Chicago	Handzus
13-14	L.A.	Gaborik
14-15	Chicago	Vermette, Desjardins
15-16	Pittsburgh	Daley, Hagelin, Schultz
16-17	Pittsburgh	Hainsey
17-18	Washington	Kempny
18-19	St. Louis	-
19-20	Tampa	Bogosion, Goodrow, Coleman
21	Tampa	Savard

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

1st for a rental in bold

 

[Bazeek]

Lil you and others still don’t get it hey? Miller has the same if not more value than Eichel did when he got traded. Eichel had very dangerous surgery and his career can end with just one more injury there. He’s also making double of what JT Miller is and specifically had a handful of places he wanted to go to. And your statement is simply not true. If Addison wasn’t available for Eichel then YIKES on Guerin. That’s brutal. Tuch+Krebs+1st is also literally a top 6 young powerforward a top prospect and a 1st. That’s a solid package almost identical to Rossi+Lambos+Addison. Not to mention only 2 teams had enough cap that were interested. Stop making this garbage comparison.

point 2: Way to overreact and blow it out of proportion. Bruce made a comment that he’d talk to Miller after an overtime effort. Nobody said he has a bad look of always not going back for the play

I get that Miller's very valuable and that if Vancouver trades him they should be asking for the moon.

I also get that the pieces you included in that deal are important parts of what Guerin set into motion with the Parise and Suter buyouts. He's not going to burn that down because of FOMO. Maybe some other GM will.

 

[seanlinden]

Lil you and others still don’t get it hey? Miller has the same if not more value than Eichel did when he got traded. Eichel had very dangerous surgery and his career can end with just one more injury there. He’s also making double of what JT Miller is and specifically had a handful of places he wanted to go to. And your statement is simply not true. If Addison wasn’t available for Eichel then YIKES on Guerin. That’s brutal. Tuch+Krebs+1st is also literally a top 6 young powerforward a top prospect and a 1st. That’s a solid package almost identical to Rossi+Lambos+Addison. Not to mention only 2 teams had enough cap that were interested. Stop making this garbage comparison.

point 2: Way to overreact and blow it out of proportion. Bruce made a comment that he’d talk to Miller after an overtime effort. Nobody said he has a bad look of always not going back for the play

Value is not in a vacuum. Eichel is a a franchise-altering #1C, who is 25 years old, and locked up for 4 full seasons. He likely has the potential to be the best player on the best team in the league. When getting Jack Eichel, teams are absolutely going to be willing to part with "franchise futures" (regardless of risky surgery) because he is and can be a cornerstone player for that franchise.

All due respect in the world to JT Miller, but he is not that, and never will be that. On a really good team, he should probably be the 3rd or 4th best forward. He's versatile enough that a ton of teams would love to add him at the deadline, but every year there are a couple of guys available at the deadline that can bring similar things to what he can.

Obviously, if the Canucks wait a year and he's playing just as well at the deadline next year, he'll get a 1st + pretty good prospect with them likely retaining 50% on the deal. Trading him this year, should be able to get a similar / slightly better package with no retention, as his contract is pretty good, or perhaps you can "double up" -- retain both years, and get packges that include a 1st rd pick plus a recent 1st, or a prospect who's taken some really positive steps towards becoming an NHLer since being drafted.

That being said... just because somebody might give you 2 1sts, or a 1st and a 1st-equivalent prospect; doesn't mean they're going to give you a guy they view as a likely top tier player for them (a la Rossi, Newhook, Byram)

 

[Ciao]

Honestly, these contending teams should just stand pat going into the playoffs. They don't need to add, its not like the previous 5-10 cup winners have all added at the deadline by paying decent assets to acquire players that put them over the top or anything.

That's probably not too far off.

I can think of Goodrow and Coleman going to Tampa, Antoine Vermette to Chicago and Jeff Carter to LA for high-end assets over the past ten years.

I'm not remembering any other blockbuster TDL deals to the eventual Cup champions in that frame of time. Am I missing something here?

 

[seanlinden]

I think the point is more that Guerin's shown himself to be pretty comfortable passing on "opportunities" to lose those prospects.

A big problem with Miller going to Minnesota is that Vancouver will rightfully see the extra year on his deal as adding a lot of value, but it's value that doesn't help Minnesota all that much with the escalating buyout cap hits. To fit Miller in we'd probably need retention on his already-low AAV, which would cost more on top of everything else. They'd be paying premium prices for things that they may not even want, under the circumstances.

Someone with an expiring deal probably makes more sense, in the end.

Was thinking this as well. If Vancouver retains on Miller, then it might really work for Minnesota; otherwise he's going to get in the way of a guy like Fiala (who they already have problems with).

In the end, I think Minnesota's #1 target should be Joe Pavelski -- or maybe Claude Giroux if he gets on board with that idea.

 

[John Johnson]

That's probably not too far off.

I can think of Goodrow and Coleman going to Tampa, Antoine Vermette to Chicago and Jeff Carter to LA for high-end assets over the past ten years.

I'm not remembering any other blockbuster TDL deals to the eventual Cup champions in that frame of time. Am I missing something here?

It doesn't have to be a blockbuster trade. Most of the previous cup winners have acquired some sort of roster player whether they're top of the lineup players or bottom of the lineup players. Point is most contending teams will need to add players to put themselves over the top, and teams have shown they will pay, even for 3rd liners. Don't see why now that the Canucks are in play with a good player that they should recieve equal or less than what 3rd liners have been bringing in the past few deadlines.