Off-Season Roster Thread #2 -- Nothing to do but wait

[WhereAreTheCookies]

Completely out of left field question and total video game idea-
What stops teams like us who have huge cap space from deals like the following:

Next offseason offer Tage and Cozens 1 year max contract (I think 16.5m?)
Negotiate a 9 (or 8/7/6 whatever) year deal with a handshake agreement that after year 1 the next deal would be an averaged out salary deducting the first year. Would this be considered cap circumvention? I know it's a bizarre scenario but if we have the cap space available while we don't need it, why not "front load" in this fashion to get their 8 year contracts down a significant amount. It's also not my money I'm spending so it's easy for me to say I'm just wondering if there is any precedent for something like this.

I don't see this as pissing off future signings on the team because these guys would still average out the same $$$ at the end of the deal, they're just doing it in an unconventional way.

If I'm not mistaken the Goligoski deal in Minnesota was done this way. They signed him to a 1 year 5 million dollar deal with the understanding he would take a less expensive 2 year deal the following season to help them with their cap situation due to the buyouts. Wild fans were actually talking about it last summer, and it turned out it happened exactly like some people were saying it would. Saved them a million against the cap the next 2 years while still giving Goligoski 9 million over 3 years.

 

[Fjordsen]

The only thing that confuses me about Subban is that he is not DFD, but I think he will be good as a defenseman of the third pair or #4.

 

[Der Jaeger]

The only thing that confuses me about Subban is that he is not DFD, but I think he will be good as a defenseman of the third pair or #4.

Why does it confuse you?

Samuelsson - Dahlin
Power - Jokiharju
Bryson - Subban

Seems like a really good role for an older, talented veteran.

 

[Chainshot]

Slew-ban has moved more toward being a defense-first player. He's spent a lot of time covering for Smith's complete lack of d-zone awareness in the recent season for example. Also, him with Power isn't a bad combo either since it gives Owen someone to lean on for advice and also someone who is a bit more combative in front than Joker has thus far shown.

 

[Jacob582]

Slew-ban has moved more toward being a defense-first player. He's spent a lot of time covering for Smith's complete lack of d-zone awareness in the recent season for example. Also, him with Power isn't a bad combo either since it gives Owen someone to lean on for advice and also someone who is a bit more combative in front than Joker has thus far shown.

He can fill in there, but I don't think he can play those minutes full time.

 

[Zman5778]

He can fill in there, but I don't think he can play those minutes full time.

For 1 year, while Power learns how to really play? Sure he can.

As long as he knows his role on the team (vet mentor, covering for mistakes)...it's not like he's out of shape or anything. He's still a strong skater who's a pain in the ass to play against in front of the net.

Let Dahlin/Sammy be the first pair, let Power get his 20 min between ES and PP....Subban gets ES and PK min, same as Jokiharju.

 

[Chainshot]

He can fill in there, but I don't think he can play those minutes full time.

Maybe. I haven't minded him in game viewing this year. Jersey kept his TOI below 20 minutes a night for all but like 2 of the last 40 games he played.

I'm more interested in if he could help them PK in more than name only. Can he be a penalty killer since that is something missing for them IMO.

 

[jmelm]

Ok, I have a new dream scenario. I never considered this before because the player sucks, but what if....

Toronto trades Mrazek to us with a significant sweetener (such as their 1st round pick) and then he goes on to win the Vezina for us and gets us into the playoffs.

And then we laugh while Leaf fans are bitching and crying.

 

[Chainshot]

Ok, I have a new dream scenario. I never considered this before because the player sucks, but what if....

Toronto trades Mrazek to us with a significant sweetener (such as their 1st round pick) and then he goes on to win the Vezina for us and gets us into the playoffs.

And then we laugh while Leaf fans are bitching and crying.

I have thought Campbell coming down to Buffalo would liven up the rivalry in a way we haven't seen in years.

 

[Jacob582]

If I'm not mistaken the Goligoski deal in Minnesota was done this way. They signed him to a 1 year 5 million dollar deal with the understanding he would take a less expensive 2 year deal the following season to help them with their cap situation due to the buyouts. Wild fans were actually talking about it last summer, and it turned out it happened exactly like some people were saying it would. Saved them a million against the cap the next 2 years while still giving Goligoski 9 million over 3 years.

That may be true, but the contract just needs to be realistic enough. $5M was close to what he made in his last contract. If they gave him $10M that would have sent up red flags.

 

[Jacob582]

Ok, I have a new dream scenario. I never considered this before because the player sucks, but what if....

Toronto trades Mrazek to us with a significant sweetener (such as their 1st round pick) and then he goes on to win the Vezina for us and gets us into the playoffs.

And then we laugh while Leaf fans are bitching and crying.

Lightweight. My dream includes Mrazek carrying us to a first round win against the Maple Loafs.

 

[Djp]

Dislike. A move like this is available in July if your FA plan doesn’t come off. Disagree with the idea that it’s a security blanket to not spend big in FA either. Inflated one or two year deals for actual NHL players wouldn’t be a backbreaker.

it can be a problem for journeymen players inflating arbitration and next contracts

Completely out of left field question and total video game idea-
What stops teams like us who have huge cap space from deals like the following:

Next offseason offer Tage and Cozens 1 year max contract (I think 16.5m?)
Negotiate a 9 (or 8/7/6 whatever) year deal with a handshake agreement that after year 1 the next deal would be an averaged out salary deducting the first year. Would this be considered cap circumvention? I know it's a bizarre scenario but if we have the cap space available while we don't need it, why not "front load" in this fashion to get their 8 year contracts down a significant amount. It's also not my money I'm spending so it's easy for me to say I'm just wondering if there is any precedent for something like this.

I don't see this as pissing off future signings on the team because these guys would still average out the same $$$ at the end of the deal, they're just doing it in an unconventional way.

its cap circumvention. It also could bite in arbitration and QOs

If I'm not mistaken the Goligoski deal in Minnesota was done this way. They signed him to a 1 year 5 million dollar deal with the understanding he would take a less expensive 2 year deal the following season to help them with their cap situation due to the buyouts. Wild fans were actually talking about it last summer, and it turned out it happened exactly like some people were saying it would. Saved them a million against the cap the next 2 years while still giving Goligoski 9 million over 3 years.

There likely is an investigation around this. He’s also a UFA which was a critical factor in this than an RFA and QO rules

 

[Chainshot]

I wonder if they'd consider stocking the farm team in Rochester with some AAAA type guys on 1-way deals around a million per? There will be a lot of openings for next season, might not be a bad thing to plug in a couple more guys who can provide at the AHL level.

 

[Gras]

Ok, I have a new dream scenario. I never considered this before because the player sucks, but what if....

Toronto trades Mrazek to us with a significant sweetener (such as their 1st round pick) and then he goes on to win the Vezina for us and gets us into the playoffs.

And then we laugh while Leaf fans are bitching and crying.

They only have 3 picks in this draft, doubt they want to give up another.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

Wasn't there rumors back at the deadline (i.e. before the Samuelsson-Dahlin pairing became a thing) that Adams had discussions about trading for a RHD (i.e. a "partner for Power) but the team wanted to keep them for the playoff run?

I still wonder if Adams doubles back to that. A guy like Gudbranson might still be on the menu. Maybe even a top 4 guy still, would allow them to slide Joker down to the third pair?

 

[Jacob582]

I wonder if they'd consider stocking the farm team in Rochester with some AAAA type guys on 1-way deals around a million per? There will be a lot of openings for next season, might not be a bad thing to plug in a couple more guys who can provide at the AHL level.

You know the answer to your question.

 

[Jacob582]

Wasn't there rumors back at the deadline (i.e. before the Samuelsson-Dahlin pairing became a thing) that Adams had discussions about trading for a RHD (i.e. a "partner for Power) but the team wanted to keep them for the playoff run?

I still wonder if Adams doubles back to that. A guy like Gudbranson might still be on the menu. Maybe even a top 4 guy still, would allow them to slide Joker down to the third pair?

They tried Joker there and are happy with the results. They can just sign a third pair guy now.

 

[Chainshot]

You know the answer to your question.

It's an option to get to the floor that doesn't overpay anyone.

 

[Jacob582]

It's an option to get to the floor that doesn't overpay anyone.

A million per will bury their cap hit.

I think they will end up spending $8-9M total on a defenseman and goalie and be above the lower limit.

I think it is more likely that our depth in Rochester is Janko, Hayden and Butcher if they don't get one way deals somewhere else.

 

[Chainshot]

A million per will bury their cap hit.

I think they will end up spending $8-9M total on a defenseman and goalie and be above the lower limit.

I think it is more likely that our depth in Rochester is Janko, Hayden and Butcher if they don't get one way deals somewhere else.

1.075 M is 375k per contract vs. the cap. Three of those round out the depth and bring things closer to the floor.

 

[SundherDome]

It's an option to get to the floor that doesn't overpay anyone.

My only concern is the contract slots.

 

[Chainshot]

My only concern is the contract slots.

Non-issue considering they are replacing guys like Jankowski, Prow, Schuldt. It's making the replacements on the Amerks better paid by finding better players than those. Hell, one like Pilut is easy enough to get that extra kick and have a guy for the 8th D option who has shown himself better than either Schuldt or Prow in the NHL.

 

[Jacob582]

1.075 M is 375k per contract vs. the cap. Three of those round out the depth and bring things closer to the floor.

I don't understand how that gets them closer to the lower limit.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

I don't understand how that gets them closer to the lower limit.

The entire cap hit no longer gets buried when it’s above a certain salary. They could theoretically send Skinner to Rochester and have an $8M cap hit for the season.

 

[Jacob582]

The entire cap hit no longer gets buried when it’s above a certain salary. They could theoretically send Skinner to Rochester and have an $8M cap hit for the season.

So how does having a million dollar player in Rochester increase our cap?