Blue Jays Discussion: Off-Season Madness the 13th: Report - Dickey extended, trade just pending physicals

[Giuseppe Sallo]

I don't want to jinx it but I don't think this trade will happen. Just my gut feeling.

Btw, I want AA to make this trade. So I'm not against it.

 

[donkeyy0]

We also have Drabek and Hutchinson.

I'm not sure I'm so confident that having Drabek coming back from his 2nd tommy john after he already had control issues and had his mental makeup questioned is going to have me comfortable trading Noah Syndergaard.

I'm nervous about giving him up. But he's so far away that...who knows. Like 2 years at least, probably 3. Lots can happen. He throws a billion mph too. Fireballers make me nervous.

I just love that while he's Jays property it's "because his secondary offerings are all weak, his most likely end point is a high leverage reliever." Now that he's maybe going to New York it's " Noah Syndergaard has an advanced feel for his three main pitches (fastball, curve, and changeup)."

It really is like reading about Leafs prospects. When in the Toronto system it just feels like these guys lose value, and the second they leave, it's nothing but blue skies ahead.

 

[Communal Blood]

I doubt drabek starts again.

I was just gonna ask if you guys still think Drabek will ever reach his full potential after having TJ surgery for a second time...

 

[Phaneuf is Phaneuf]

Its a little heartbreaking to lose D'Anraud and others but to be honest I think AA has built up the organization with good prospects to make this deal. We have a top pick again this year that will replenish the system and with AA and scouting staff there is no sense to not believe that they will do well like in past drafts.

That being said, if I were the Jays Dickey should be place between the 2 power and finese pitchers. This would be my rotation.

Morrow
Buerhle
Dickey
Johnson
Romero

Power, finnese, Knuckball, Power, Finnese

We would give teams fits with this rotation setup in a 3 or 4 game series.

In terms of the rotation, you get the same effect by putting Dickey at the front of the rotation, because he still comes after a finesse pitcher but before a power pitcher. Dickey-Johnson-Buerhle-Morrow-Romero would be my lineup.

 

[donkeyy0]

I doubt drabek starts again.

They'll at least give him a chance I hope.

Was he ever touted as a "frontline pitcher"? I don't know why I seem to remember reading scouting reports that seemed awfully similar to those of Chad Jenkins/Deck McGuire. Maybe a #3. Might be misremembering though. I seem to remember it was either Happ or Drabek being moved. And people were clamoring for Drabek.

We ended up with Happ anyways.

 

[Anthrax442]

I doubt drabek starts again.

Now, that we have a solid rotation, he can take his time re-habbing and going through the motions of the AAA. he is only 25, he can still take time.

I am more concerns with our bats. We addressed some, but I still feel that head to head with Detroit or Anaheim, we are lacking.

 

[Nick0930]

It'S too bad McGowan can't stay healthy. He had so much potential.

 

[Scoogs]

Another great aspect of our rotation now is that we can break Hutch and Drabek in nice and easy.

 

[donkeyy0]

Drabek's reports from early last season sound so awesome...I hate that he got hurt

 

[Anthrax442]

Drabek's reports from early last season sound so awesome...I hate that he got hurt

I think he was rushed + the pressure got to him.

 

[PaPaDee]

Seems like a lot of future to throw away for a 38 year old pitcher. But I suppose knuckleballers do play a little longer than most pitchers.

 

[mikebel111*]

I have full trust in AA, if he feels it's a good trade, than lets trust him guys

I hate losing TDA and synder, but AA has proved he can build a top farm system, I think we can even build to top again by this year
we hace 10th pick, that is pretty good, so we can get an elite propsect there, I personally feel lets build the pitching prospects,

With that said, I am still slightly hoping the deal breaks down, if it goes through, it hurts a bit but not as much as people on here say it will
in AA we trust

 

[RayzorIsDull]

AA turned one of the worst farm system's in the league into one of the best in just a couple years. He can easily replace all the prospects he's traded.

Does he have a Roy Halladay to deal right now?

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Seems like a lot of future to throw away for a 38 year old pitcher. But I suppose knuckleballers do play a little longer than most pitchers.

For what it's worth, Ed Coleman, the Mets play-by-play voice, isn't as sure as some others that he'll be able to pitch that deep into his forties. He was on the Fan this morning, and shot down Jeff Blair when he suggested that longevity shouldn't be a concern.

 

[donkeyy0]

For what it's worth, Ed Coleman, the Mets play-by-play voice, isn't as sure as some others that he'll be able to pitch that deep into his forties. He was on the Fan this morning, and shot down Jeff Blair when he suggested that longevity shouldn't be a concern.

He throws his knuckleball like 10mph faster than most previous knucklers. So we don't exactly know what's gonna happen.

But not having to worry about TJ is good.

 

[mikebel111*]

Now, that we have a solid rotation, he can take his time re-habbing and going through the motions of the AAA. he is only 25, he can still take time.

I am more concerns with our bats. We addressed some, but I still feel that head to head with Detroit or Anaheim, we are lacking.

it hurts losing, synder
but remember synder could be anywhere from a 2nd starter to a reliever, that is what I heard about him

plus,
we have
sanchez, ace potential
osuna, dominated as a 17 year old last year, ace potential
norris, has good stuff, top of rotation lefty
deck. struggled, but very high on him, middle starter
stroman, could be an elite reliever, almost major league ready
smoral, chance to be one of the better pitchers from 2012 draft class
cardona, needs time but has huge potential
stilson, potential to be a great reliever

he didn't give up huge potential in synder if it goes through

 

[EastCoastSensFan]

For what it's worth, Ed Coleman, the Mets play-by-play voice, isn't as sure as some others that he'll be able to pitch that deep into his forties. He was on the Fan this morning, and shot down Jeff Blair when he suggested that longevity shouldn't be a concern.

It seems to me that Dickey must have hurt the Mets feelings after saying no to their extension because all their writers, media guys etc went from praising him to criticizing every part of his game right after news they were going to trade him broke about 4 to 5 weeks ago.

 

[Leafsdude7]

Its a little heartbreaking to lose D'Anraud and others but to be honest I think AA has built up the organization with good prospects to make this deal. We have a top pick again this year that will replenish the system and with AA and scouting staff there is no sense to not believe that they will do well like in past drafts.

That being said, if I were the Jays Dickey should be place between the 2 power and finese pitchers. This would be my rotation.

Morrow
Buerhle
Dickey
Johnson
Romero

Power, finnese, Knuckball, Power, Finnese

We would give teams fits with this rotation setup in a 3 or 4 game series.

As per a few threads ago, this doesn't do the trick.

I'd rather see finesse, power, knuckleball, power, finesse, as if you go power, finesse, knuckleball, you're setting up that knuckleball for the opponents. Finesse pitchers rely less on speed (fast or slow) and more on location, so there's not really a huge need to split them up from each other or set them up with the previous day's pitcher. Imagine going through a series facing Romero one day, Morrow/Johnson the next and then Dickey for game 3. Nasty.

If this trade does go through, my rotation would be Morrow, Dickey, Johnson, Buehrle, Romero.

 

[Sokil]

If AA can build our current farm system in 3 years here, there's no reason to think he can't do it again over the next 3

 

[91Kadri91*]

Just an exercise- Ranking the projected best pitchers in the division for next season

1)Price
2)Sabathia
3)Dickey
4)Johnson
5)Hellickson
6)Morrow
7)Moore
8)Kuroda
9)Hammel
10)Buehrle
11)Tillman
12)Lester
13)Romero
14)Pettitte
15)Cobb

.... I recognize its highly subjective but thats probably order I would want them on my team for next season

Personally, I'd have Morrow and Moore above Hellickson, and I'd have Lester a lot higher; probably around 8th or so. That's just my opinion though.

 

[donkeyy0]

As per a few threads ago, this doesn't do the trick.

I'd rather see finesse, power, knuckleball, power, finesse, as if you go power, finesse, knuckleball, you're setting up that knuckleball for the opponents. Finesse pitchers rely less on speed (fast or slow) and more on location, so there's not really a huge need to split them up from each other or set them up with the previous day's pitcher. Imagine going through a series facing Romero one day, Morrow/Johnson the next and then Dickey for game 3. Nasty.

If this trade does go through, my rotation would be Morrow, Dickey, Johnson, Buehrle, Romero.

Isn't that rotation you listed Power, Knuckle, Power, Finesse, Finesse?

 

[Anthrax442]

it hurts losing, synder
but remember synder could be anywhere from a 2nd starter to a reliever, that is what I heard about him

plus,
we have
sanchez, ace potential
osuna, dominated as a 17 year old last year, ace potential
norris, has good stuff, top of rotation lefty
deck. struggled, but very high on him, middle starter
stroman, could be an elite reliever, almost major league ready
smoral, chance to be one of the better pitchers from 2012 draft class
cardona, needs time but has huge potential
stilson, potential to be a great reliever

he didn't give up huge potential in synder if it goes through

We have another good draft coming up. I think it's a big loss, but if the reward is World Series, it's more than worth it.

 

[Leafsdude7]

Isn't that rotation you listed Power, Knuckle, Power, Finesse, Finesse?

Sure, but after the first 4 pitchers, it's basically finesse, power, knuckle, power, finesse.

In the end, the point was it makes sense to go power, knuckle, power more than to go finesse, knuckle, power.

 

[topched]

Don't know if anyone saw this but as per Richard Griffin 10 minutes ago:

As reflected in his hands-on style, Jays' GM Alex Anthopoulos prefers to meet players face-to-face whenever an important crossroads arrives. Anthopoulos is believed to have met with Dickey at his home. Reportedly, the Jays have been able to agree on the extension with Dickey, likely for more than the $26 million, two years, he had been seeking from the Mets, but still a bargain for three years compared to recent free agents Anibal Sanchez, Zack Greinke and, assuming Dickey's higher expected return, than Ryan Dempster.


Sources are now saying that negotiations with Dickey have ended successfully at an affordable rate and that the next step before an announcement can be made is for Jays' medical staff to examine the righthander at their spring training headquarters in Florida.

 

[donkeyy0]

Sure, but after the first 4 pitchers, it's basically finesse, power, knuckle, power, finesse.

In the end, the point was it makes sense to go power, knuckle, power more than to go finesse, knuckle, power.

Why not Power, Knuckle, Finesse, Power, Finesse? That way you aren't seeing two finesse lefties back to back? I'm worried Romero/Buerhle back to back would be showing batters too much of the same thing.

So it's something like JJ, Dickey, Buerhle, Morrow, Romero.

Edit: Can we even call Romero a "finesse" pitcher? His walk rate is pretty high for that classification...