Blue Jays Discussion: Off-Season III: Ray/Semien out, Gausman in. Jays linked to everyone. Labor strife happening.

[jcollins]

Yeah, that's my bigger concern as well - the Mets are more likely to offer Pete a multiple on his salary to be their pitching coach rather than manager.

Since it's a lateral move, couldn't the Jays refuse?

 

[Bluelines]

Since it's a lateral move, couldn't the Jays refuse?

The can and they will.

Most sports franchises will allow their coaches/manages to break their contract if it is a upward move but lateral moves , that is rare, I cant remember the last time a sports team in any league allowed a coach/manager to move laterally to benefit a competitor?

 

[Bjindaho]

The can and they will.

Most sports franchises will allow their coaches/manages to break their contract if it is a upward move but lateral moves , that is rare, I cant remember the last time a sports team in any league allowed a coach/manager to move laterally to benefit a competitor?

Farrell for Aviles and Carpenter (who was about to be DFAd).

Aviles was later traded with Gomes (barf) for Esmil Rogers. Rogers was waived after 60 appearances.

 

[BlueForever75]

So it seems like the Jays were seriously involved in the Seager sweepstakes. Very surprising which in turn means you cannot keep them out of the Correa or Freeman sweepstakes. I guess Bo still is ok moving to 2nd if the right player is signed. But where does Freeman go with Guerrero there?

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

So it seems like the Jays were seriously involved in the Seager sweepstakes. Very surprising which in turn means you cannot keep them out of the Correa or Freeman sweepstakes. I guess Bo still is ok moving to 2nd if the right player is signed. But where does Freeman go with Guerrero there?

I would assume Guerrero would flip back to 3rd in this case.

If he works like he did last offseason and gains some more mobility, he could actually be decent there.

 

[BlueForever75]

Does Springer have any clout with swaying Correa to the Jays. Having him in our lineup would more than compensate on the loss of Semien.

Then make a deal with Oakland for Chapman and Mannea.

CF - Springer
SS - Correa
1B - Guerrero
2B - Bichette
RF - Hernandez
3B - Chapman
LF - Guriel
DH - Grichuk
C - Jansen\McGuire

Bench: TBD (depending on trade), Jansen/McGuire, Dyson (Re-Sign), Dickerson (Re-sign), Espinal

Sp1 - Gausman
Sp2 - Berrios
Sp3 - Mannea
Sp4 - Ryu
Sp5 - Manoah

Depth: Stripling, Pearson

Bullpen:

Cimber
Richards
Garcia
Romano
Stripling
Pearson

 

[Discoverer]

Farrell for Aviles and Carpenter (who was about to be DFAd).

Aviles was later traded with Gomes (barf) for Esmil Rogers. Rogers was waived after 60 appearances.

In a way, that's a good example of a team not allowing someone to leave for a lateral move since it only happened due to the compensation.

 

[Bjindaho]

So it seems like the Jays were seriously involved in the Seager sweepstakes. Very surprising which in turn means you cannot keep them out of the Correa or Freeman sweepstakes. I guess Bo still is ok moving to 2nd if the right player is signed. But where does Freeman go with Guerrero there?

Seagar isn't a SS. His D is worse than Bo's. He would have been playing 3B in that scenario.

Bo openly said that he would move for the right situation last year, but management said that they wouldn't even ask for a player on a 1 year deal. IMO, if Correa were willing to come here, we would ask Bo (because he's arguably the best defensive SS in baseball). It would literally be the A-Rod/Jeter situation (where A-Rod was an elite defensive SS and Jeter's arm made him average at the time).

 

[Kurtz]

Since it's a lateral move, couldn't the Jays refuse?

Sure, but if they offer to triple his salary and you tell him no you can't take it, you'll have a disgruntled employee on your hands.

 

[Bjindaho]

Sure, but if they offer to triple his salary and you tell him no you can't take it, you'll have a disgruntled employee on your hands.

They aren't allowed to discuss salary or any positions with him for a lateral transfer without explicit permission from Toronto. That would be tampering.

Toronto can technically block him from interviewing for a manager post, but it's practically unheard of to prevent a guy from interviewing for a promotion in MLB (I believe that it actually happened to the Mets already this offseason though during their other search).

 

[Kurtz]

They aren't allowed to discuss salary or any positions with him for a lateral transfer without explicit permission from Toronto. That would be tampering.

Toronto can technically block him from interviewing for a manager post, but it's practically unheard of to prevent a guy from interviewing for a promotion in MLB (I believe that it actually happened to the Mets already this offseason though during their other search).

 

[phillipmike]

To get fired, Walker would play on Montoyo's bongos.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[phillipmike]

The billion-dollar day: Inside the wildest 24 hours in MLB free- agency history

On the first night of the GM meetings, the Detroit Tigers told Boras that they were in. The next day, the Texas Rangers came to 6048 to say the same. The Toronto Blue Jays wanted to re-sign him. The San Francisco Giants loved him. So did the Seattle Mariners. The interested parties figured the bidding for Semien would wind up somewhere in the neighborhood of what the Blue Jays had given George Springer -- another 31-year-old, up-the-middle, big-power, good-makeup player -- a year earlier: six years, $150 million. If a team added a year or bumped the average annual value, perhaps that would compel Semien to jump the lockout.

After a few days off for Thanksgiving, Semien's market started to percolate, spurred by the Rangers, Blue Jays and Tigers. Determined to seal the deal, on the morning of Nov. 28, Texas played its trump card: a seventh year. The Rangers offered $175 million. At about 5 p.m., Semien accepted. It was the biggest deal handed out by the Rangers since Alex Rodriguez's historic 10-year, $252 million contract more than two decades earlier.

It was far from a sure bet -- the Los Angeles Dodgers, with whom Seager had spent his entire career and won a World Series, weren't going anywhere. And Toronto, which had also been in on Semien, was now primed to take a strong run at Seager. But first the Blue Jays had some other business to take care of. They were in a bidding war with the New York Mets.

The Blue Jays understood. A year earlier, they'd been down a tortuous path with Kevin Gausman. For a half decade since being selected with the fourth overall pick in the draft, Gausman was the epitome of an average pitcher. Then he went to San Francisco, where he pitched well enough during 2020 to warrant a one-year, $18.9 million qualifying offer for 2021 -- and accepted it, rather than sign a three-year offer in the $40 million range from Toronto. Gausman bet on himself and posted a 2.81 ERA in response. The fruits of that gamble were bountiful.

Gausman was impressed with Toronto -- not just the young, dynamic lineup and the daunting rotation, but also the plan outlined by GM Ross Atkins during a Zoom call. He was flattered by the sense that he was the Blue Jays' top priority -- which was saying something. Robbie Ray, who won the 2021 American League Cy Young Award with the Blue Jays, was also a free agent.

Toronto's final proposal was for $110 million over five years -- slightly less than the Mets were offering over the same term. Gausman had a decision to make -- and Cohen's money couldn't paper over the feeling that Toronto was the right place for him. About four hours after they lost out on Semien (and two weeks after they extended right-hander Jose Berrios for $130 million), the Blue Jays secured the best rotation in the AL East.

Even after 2021, enough teams weren't sold on the 30-year-old left-hander that he was seen as likely to wait until after the lockout to sign, hoping to leverage a pitching market that might have more teams -- or more desperation. But the Mariners saw what was happening. They weren't getting the front-line bats they wanted. By then, Chris Taylor, the super utility man whom the Mariners had traded only to see him thrive with the Dodgers, looked like he was going to re-sign in Los Angeles. Adjusting was rational, especially as the pitching supply dwindled. Gausman and Scherzer were gone. In between them, right-hander Jon Gray had agreed to a $56 million deal with Texas. The last thing Seattle needed was to find itself in a post-lockout bidding war against the financial leviathans -- the Dodgers, New York Yankees and Red Sox had mostly stayed quiet, awaiting the luxury-tax threshold in a new collective bargaining agreement -- that seemed to be sitting out the early rush.

Seattle jumping into the foray intrigued Ray. He liked the team's talent. He liked the outdoor lifestyle in Seattle. He enjoyed a four-hour Zoom call with GM Jerry Dipoto, assistant GM Justin Hollander and manager Scott Servais. And after Gausman set the market at $110 million, Ray's agents with VC Sports, Steve Veltman and Ed Cerulo, had a number to negotiate against.

The team added a year to its previous offer, bumped the money to $115 million over five years and included an opt-out following the third season. Ray agreed to terms around 2:50 p.m. It had been 22 hours since the start of a wild day of signings.

The biggest and best was still to come.

Sounds like no was offering Ray 5 years or anything close to what he got until the M's jumped in late after missing out on Semien and Gray.

The Rangers were willing to go 10 years and $325 million, a number that reflected the organization's need to pay top dollar to persuade players like Semien and Seager to join despite the fact that the expectations of winning in 2022 were slim. That figure was unlikely to be beat. As reverent as they are of Seager's bat, the Dodgers have sent him to the IL too many times to commit to that high of a yearly salary for a decade. The Blue Jays were the mystery entrant in the Seager sweepstakes, but they too were unwilling to match Texas' mega-offer.

Not relevant but...

The fit made enough sense. Chris Woodward, the Rangers' manager, knew Seager well, having been a coach with the Dodgers. The Rangers' attendance at Globe Life Field last season exceeded 2.1 million, the highest in the AL, and recent payroll cuts left them ready to spend. And it wasn't like Texas had been woebegone forever: The Rangers reached back-to-back World Series in 2010 and 2011 and won consecutive AL West titles in 2015 and 2016.

Wonder how those seasons ended.

If the Jays were after Semien and sounds like they were willing to go to 6 years, were in on Seager and possibly finished 2nd or 3rd, and signed Gausman with an offer to Ray - they must have money to spend.

Coming out of the lockout, perhaps one of Correra, Story, Freeman or Bryant is a Jay. The latter more possible than the first 2.

 

[TGB]

Not surprising given the team's current payroll is $30 mil lower than their most recent all-time high at $165 mil, and Rogers did well during the pandemic. At the very least they have $30 mil left to play with which is enough for one more big name and some relievers, not including trade potential. The Jays are in a good place financially.

 

[BlueForever75]

Signing Story on a 1-yr prove it deal to play 2nd as Semien did along with signing Seagar to play 3B would drastically improves the lineup. That should be easily done within the 30 million budget. Toss in trade potential having the likes of Kirk, Biggio and others to acquire another starter and bullpen help.

This team can easily be better.

 

[Discoverer]

Signing Story on a 1-yr prove it deal to play 2nd as Semien did along with signing Seagar to play 3B would drastically improves the lineup. That should be easily done within the 30 million budget. Toss in trade potential having the likes of Kirk, Biggio and others to acquire another starter and bullpen help.

This team can easily be better.

You think they could sign Story and Seager for $30 million next year?

Story isn't going to do the one-year deal thing, but if he did he alone would get more than $30 million.

 

[Kurtz]

Signing Story on a 1-yr prove it deal to play 2nd as Semien did along with signing Seagar to play 3B would drastically improves the lineup. That should be easily done within the 30 million budget. Toss in trade potential having the likes of Kirk, Biggio and others to acquire another starter and bullpen help.

This team can easily be better.

So if I'm Story the last thing I wanna do is sign a 1-year prove it deal outside of Colorado. The guy has a career OPS of .972 in Colorado and .752 OPS outside of Colorado. He should cash the f*** in right now.

 

[BlueForever75]

First off I dont think that 165 million is the budget the Jays will spend to. Its been mentioned across many insiders that the Jays payroll has the blessing of Rogers to go up to 175-180 million in the right scenario. This would explain why they were in on Seagar and Semien along with Ray and Gausman.

They weren't willing to go to the extent the Rangers did for Seager and Semien. But it doesnt mean that they still cant go out an sign the "right player" like a Correa, Story, Bryant or trade for Ramirez or Chapman.

I personally believe that they have the prospects and blessing from Rogers to go out and spend what they need to. Im not saying that we become fiscally irresponsible like other teams. But we can spend up to 175 million easily.

 

[Discoverer]

First off I dont think that 165 million is the budget the Jays will spend to. Its been mentioned across many insiders that the Jays payroll has the blessing of Rogers to go up to 175-180 million in the right scenario. This would explain why they were in on Seagar and Semien along with Ray and Gausman.

They weren't willing to go to the extent the Rangers did for Seager and Semien. But it doesnt mean that they still cant go out an sign the "right player" like a Correa, Story, Bryant or trade for Ramirez or Chapman.

I personally believe that they have the prospects and blessing from Rogers to go out and spend what they need to. Im not saying that we become fiscally irresponsible like other teams. But we can spend up to 175 million easily.

Well yeah, I agree they can probably go higher... but that's a lot different than "they can easily sign Story and Seager within a $30 million budget".

 

[hockeywiz542]

Blue Jays Nearly Signed Noah Syndergaard - Sports Illustrated

The Toronto Blue Jays nearly brought Noah Syndergaard back to where it all began.

The 29-year-old right-hander was reportedly "really close" to signing with the Blue Jays prior to inking a one-year, $21 million deal with the Los Angeles Angels, ESPN's Jeff Passan told Sportsnet's Tim & Friends.

Syndergaard started his career with Toronto, the 28th pick in the 2010 MLB Draft. He quickly rose up the ranks to a top 100 prospect before the Blue Jays flipped him to the New York Mets in 2012 as the centerpiece of the trade for R.A. Dickey.

Toronto battle for Syndergaard this winter with the Angels reportedly came down right to the end. Whoever bumped their offer by $1 million first was going to land the former All-Star, Passan said.

"The Angels did it and Syndergaard went there. But Syndergaard came away from his meeting with the Blue Jays really impressed," Passan added.

The sense throughout baseball is the Blue Jays are a desirable team to play for, Passan said. It wasn't just Kevin Gausman and Syndergaard who came away impressed by Toronto, former Los Angeles Dodgers shortstop Corey Seager also nearly signed with the Blue Jays, per ESPN.

 

[Amadeus]

Blue Jays Nearly Signed Noah Syndergaard - Sports Illustrated

The Toronto Blue Jays nearly brought Noah Syndergaard back to where it all began.

The 29-year-old right-hander was reportedly "really close" to signing with the Blue Jays prior to inking a one-year, $21 million deal with the Los Angeles Angels, ESPN's Jeff Passan told Sportsnet's Tim & Friends.

Syndergaard started his career with Toronto, the 28th pick in the 2010 MLB Draft. He quickly rose up the ranks to a top 100 prospect before the Blue Jays flipped him to the New York Mets in 2012 as the centerpiece of the trade for R.A. Dickey.

Toronto battle for Syndergaard this winter with the Angels reportedly came down right to the end. Whoever bumped their offer by $1 million first was going to land the former All-Star, Passan said.

"The Angels did it and Syndergaard went there. But Syndergaard came away from his meeting with the Blue Jays really impressed," Passan added.

The sense throughout baseball is the Blue Jays are a desirable team to play for, Passan said. It wasn't just Kevin Gausman and Syndergaard who came away impressed by Toronto, former Los Angeles Dodgers shortstop Corey Seager also nearly signed with the Blue Jays, per ESPN.

How exciting would that have been?

Is it that far fetched that were not onto Correa?

 

[ShaneFalco]

Blue Jays Nearly Signed Noah Syndergaard - Sports Illustrated

The Toronto Blue Jays nearly brought Noah Syndergaard back to where it all began.

The 29-year-old right-hander was reportedly "really close" to signing with the Blue Jays prior to inking a one-year, $21 million deal with the Los Angeles Angels, ESPN's Jeff Passan told Sportsnet's Tim & Friends.

Syndergaard started his career with Toronto, the 28th pick in the 2010 MLB Draft. He quickly rose up the ranks to a top 100 prospect before the Blue Jays flipped him to the New York Mets in 2012 as the centerpiece of the trade for R.A. Dickey.

Toronto battle for Syndergaard this winter with the Angels reportedly came down right to the end. Whoever bumped their offer by $1 million first was going to land the former All-Star, Passan said.

"The Angels did it and Syndergaard went there. But Syndergaard came away from his meeting with the Blue Jays really impressed," Passan added.

The sense throughout baseball is the Blue Jays are a desirable team to play for, Passan said. It wasn't just Kevin Gausman and Syndergaard who came away impressed by Toronto, former Los Angeles Dodgers shortstop Corey Seager also nearly signed with the Blue Jays, per ESPN.

Thor left us for a million?

 

[Avilaj07]

With news now coming out that we were finalists for Thor and Seager, I can't wait for this lockout to end. Clearly the Jays have money to spend. Question is, who do they get? Correa? Freeman? Bryant? The fact they were after Seagar makes me believe you might so Correa being the signing.

 

[phillipmike]

Blue Jays Nearly Signed Noah Syndergaard - Sports Illustrated

The Toronto Blue Jays nearly brought Noah Syndergaard back to where it all began.

The 29-year-old right-hander was reportedly "really close" to signing with the Blue Jays prior to inking a one-year, $21 million deal with the Los Angeles Angels, ESPN's Jeff Passan told Sportsnet's Tim & Friends.

Syndergaard started his career with Toronto, the 28th pick in the 2010 MLB Draft. He quickly rose up the ranks to a top 100 prospect before the Blue Jays flipped him to the New York Mets in 2012 as the centerpiece of the trade for R.A. Dickey.

Toronto battle for Syndergaard this winter with the Angels reportedly came down right to the end. Whoever bumped their offer by $1 million first was going to land the former All-Star, Passan said.

"The Angels did it and Syndergaard went there. But Syndergaard came away from his meeting with the Blue Jays really impressed," Passan added.

The sense throughout baseball is the Blue Jays are a desirable team to play for, Passan said. It wasn't just Kevin Gausman and Syndergaard who came away impressed by Toronto, former Los Angeles Dodgers shortstop Corey Seager also nearly signed with the Blue Jays, per ESPN.

Seems strange the Jays would pay $20M for a player but not $21M. I wonder if they were lukewarm on him because of the loss of pick.

Same goes for Thor. Is seriously $1M the difference of going to the Jays who are on the cusp or a team that has underperformed for years.

Masai really going the distance to find that centre.