Blue Jays Discussion: Off-season Edition 5.0 - The Winter Meeting Chronicles

[Leaftors]

Im wondering where djq is for this... probably just igoring

 

[AllDay28]

hes busy doing real life work that apparently sounds like a pretty serious/responsible job.. but he dont know more than ppl on this other forum who watched baseball pre-2015 "lmfao"

 

[ChampsSince67]

hes busy doing real life work that apparently sounds like a pretty serious/responsible job.. but he dont know more than ppl on this other forum who watched baseball pre-2015 "lmfao"

where did I ever say that about him?
Since you have literally provided nothing to this, would you say Stroman lands you Goldschmidt, Turner, Correa etc?

How about you ignore the sarcastic response for once on this?

 

[Canada4Gold]

Red Sox giving the big **** you to Josh Rutledge



Guy elects free agency from Boston, then signs somewhere else and Boston takes him back

 

[ChampsSince67]

Im wondering where djq is for this... probably just igoring

so him being a long time poster on this one site makes me wrong? Gotcha.

HFBoards isn't the only forum on the internet.

Also in no way did I attack him. If he knows baseball, I'd love to talk with him. Just because I didn't agree with his opinion, doesn't make me not know what I'm talking about.

 

[Bjindaho]

where did I ever say that about him?
Since you have literally provided nothing to this, would you say Stroman lands you Goldschmidt, Turner, Correa etc?

How about you ignore the sarcastic response for once on this?

Yes, he should net you Goldschmidt. The other two should have been on the untouchable list.

 

[AllDay28]

where did I ever say that about him?
Since you have literally provided nothing to this, would you say Stroman lands you Goldschmidt, Turner, Correa etc?

How about you ignore the sarcastic response for once on this?

How have I provided nothing to this when I explained to you how FIP changes yr to yr so the avg/above avg titles change, and I also said his WAR, FIP, and xFIP and told u where they were amongst all pitchers. What have YOU provided? anything of importance other than flip flopping your opinion from 3 to 2?

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

...... Seriously?

Listen, I'm sorry I'm not sorry, ok? I'm a cocksman!

 

[ChampsSince67]

Yes, he should net you Goldschmidt. The other two should have been on the untouchable list.

I'd strongly disagree. His contract is a steal and he has been one of the most valuable offensive players since 2012.

 

[phillipmike]

Red Sox giving the big **** you to Josh Rutledge



Guy elects free agency from Boston, then signs somewhere else and Boston takes him back

Probably left because he had Panda, Moncada, Shaw, and Devers in front of him at 3B. With Moncada and Shaw gone he is pretty certain to get a bench spot now backing up Panda and Panda could be Panda and Rutledge might get more playing time. At lot has changed since he left in November as the Sox traded Shaw and Moncada in one day.

 

[ChampsSince67]

How have I provided nothing to this when I explained to you how FIP changes yr to yr so the avg/above avg titles change, and I also said his WAR, FIP, and xFIP and told u where they were amongst all pitchers. What have YOU provided? anything of importance other than flip flopping your opinion from 3 to 2?

I'm not flip flopping at all. I said he's a number 3, but can accept that people view him as a number 2?

Also answer my question about his value for Correa.

 

[one77]

Yes, he should net you Goldschmidt. The other two should have been on the untouchable list.

Stroman nets us Goldschmidt? If so, this trade should have been done yesterday

 

[Loosie]

so him being a long time poster on this one site makes me wrong? Gotcha.

HFBoards isn't the only forum on the internet.

Also in no way did I attack him. If he knows baseball, I'd love to talk with him. Just because I didn't agree with his opinion, doesn't make me not know what I'm talking about.

You don't say.

 

[AllDay28]

I'm not flip flopping at all. I said he's a number 3, but can accept that people view him as a number 2?

Also answer my question about his value for Correa.

what does correa have to do with anything ive said? I never brought him up ...

 

[Canada4Gold]

You don't say.

MTF is pretty good too

 

[Bjindaho]

I'd strongly disagree. His contract is a steal and he has been one of the most valuable offensive players since 2012.

And while you are entitled to disagree, Stroman was higher in WAR relative to other starters than Goldschmidt was to other hitters

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.as...type=8&season=2016&month=0&season1=2016&ind=0

Goldschmidt put up roughly the same numbers as Edwin, while also being a 1B.

Only Dave Stewart wouldn't make that deal (given that Stroman is likely to trend up while Goldschmidt is likely to trend down) if offered Stroman.

 

[ChampsSince67]

what does correa have to do with anything ive said? I never brought him up ...

I asked you, since it had to do with what I originally argued from the other poster's post.

 

[zeke]

Career as SP:

Stroman (25): 56gs, 6.3ip/gs, 91era-, 82fip-, 81xfip-, 7.1fwar, 6.6ra9war, 3.9war/32gs

So far, overall, he's been a good #2 SP.

Though at this point he's actually looked more like a #1 for most of the time, with one crazy stretch of awfulness in the middle of this season bringing down his numbers.

Career as SP by age 25:

Sale: 85gs, 6.8ip/gs, 69era-, 74fip-, 76xfip-, 14.8fwar, 17.2ra9war, 6.0war/32gs
Sanchez: 41gs, 6.3ip/gs, 74era-, 94fip-, 95xfip-, 3.8fwar, 6.9ra9war, 4.2war/32gs
Stroman: 56gs, 6.3ip/gs, 91era-, 82fip-, 81xfip-, 7.1fwar, 6.6ra9war, 3.9war/32gs
Price: 89gs, 6.4ip/gs, 85era-, 89fip-, 90xfip-, 10.9fwar, 9.9ra9war, 3.7war/32gs
Buchholz: 62gs, 5.8ip/gs, 82era-, 97fip-, 95xfip-, 4.7fwar, 7.8ra9war, 3.2war/32gs
Liriano: 58gs, 5.6ip/gs, 97era, 91fip-, 84xfip-, 5.6fwar, 5.2ra9war, 3.0war/32gs
Rodriguez: 41gs, 5.6ip/gs, 98era-, 101fip-, 105xfip-, 3.0fwar, 3.4ra92ar, 2.5war/32gs
Porcello: 180gs, 5.9ip/gs, 104era-, 98fip-, 95xfip-, 13.7fwar, 11.0ra9war, 2.2war/32gs
Pomeranz: 40gs, 4.6ip/gs, 105era-, 112fip-, 112xfip-, 1.5fwar, 1.7ra9war, 1.3war/32gs

don't ask me why I used boston I just did.

Asterisk - Porcello gets screwed in this comp because he started way younger than the others and logged heavy innings while much younger.

 

[Loosie]

MTF is pretty good too

They're all mugs there though...especially the mod team

 

[Canada4Gold]

So you can accept people view him as a #2 but you feel the need to continuously ***** with everyone all at the same time anyway?

Most of us didn't call him an ace, if you're ok with people calling him a #2(because he is one) then why did this argument occur in the first place.

I also 'ed at the "being a #3 isn't a bad thing", ok then, lets call Clayton Kershaw a #3 and then when people laugh at us just tell them it's not a bad thing. It isn't a bad thing, but it's also nice to be accurate in our judgements, and not fallback on a stat(FIP) that ranks him 21st as a means to argue that he's a #3.

And no before you ***** some more I'm not saying Stroman is Clayton Kershaw it's a damn example. I'm done, looking forward to not reading your next 4 replies.

 

[ChampsSince67]

And while you are entitled to disagree, Stroman was higher in WAR relative to other starters than Goldschmidt was to other hitters

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.as...type=8&season=2016&month=0&season1=2016&ind=0

Goldschmidt put up roughly the same numbers as Edwin, while also being a 1B.

Only Dave Stewart wouldn't make that deal (given that Stroman is likely to trend up while Goldschmidt is likely to trend down) if offered Stroman.

Stroman doesn't get you Goldschmidt. Goldscmidt is one of the most valuable players in the league.

Goldschmidt is also the superior player to EE. He provides base running value and has had superior offensive value to EE every year since being in the league.

 

[Seath The Scaleless]

Stroman nets us Goldschmidt? If so, this trade should have been done yesterday

I think he is assuming that Dbacks management would be under the influence like during the Shelby Miller trade

 

[Bjindaho]

Stroman nets us Goldschmidt? If so, this trade should have been done yesterday

Dave Stewart is Arizona's GM. To say that he does things differently is putting things mildly.

Any sane GM would take Stroman for Goldschmidt because of the ages and the likely output. It would be a deal that likely helps both teams right now.

 

[ChampsSince67]

So you can accept people view him as a #2 but you feel the need to continuously ***** with everyone all at the same time anyway?

Most of us didn't call him an ace, if you're ok with people calling him a #2(because he is one) then why did this argument occur in the first place.

I also 'ed at the "being a #3 isn't a bad thing", ok then, lets call Clayton Kershaw a #3 and then when people laugh at us just tell them it's not a bad thing. It isn't a bad thing, but it's also nice to be accurate in our judgements, and not fallback on a stat(FIP) that ranks him 21st as a means to argue that he's a #3.

And no before you ***** some more I'm not saying Stroman is Clayton Kershaw it's a damn example. I'm done, looking forward to not reading your next 4 replies.

so i'm not allowed an opinion and I am actually mature enough to accept someone else's opinion?

 

[AllDay28]

I think he is assuming that Dbacks management would be under the influence like during the Shelby Miller trade

or maybe people around here overrate other talent and underrate ours? Unless you think a 29 yr old 1B whos WRC+ went from 150, 160, 150 to 134, with negative defense, and is a 1B, i cant stress this enough.. over a top 20 young controlled SP? then sure theyre drunk..

but I'd think the Jays would be the drunk ones here