Blue Jays Discussion: Off-season discussion: Two signings. Rinse, Repeat add 1.

[dredeye]

Newlywed Blue Jays starter Manoah credits nutritionist wife for healthy transformation

Anyone for some vintage Alek Manoah from over the past couple of days

torontosun.com

This article I think tells how divided he is from the team. Only praise his wife and brother. No mention of input from the jays. It’s great he’s in better shape and maybe he’s owning his last off season a little but this sounds like a player on his own path

 

[dredeye]

Bowden Francis? Unless im missing someone

That one caught me off guard as well. Hopefully, Bassett is a great talent evaluator lol.

 

[The Nemesis]

Whoa now. I like Bowden Francis and think he has a future, but suggesting there's a version of reality where he comes up in an emergency and becomes the team's best pitcher? Let's not say things we can't take back.

That’s some high praise there.

What’s the story this spring with big Nate? Projected role?

As was suggested by others, he probably comes into spring as a longshot "maybe if you absolutely dominate" chance to be in the Jays' pen, but more likely ends up starting the year in Buffalo's pen with an eye on establishing consistency and command that has dogged him when he's been called up to the bigs. I think we're at the point where the starter ship has sailed but there's still a potential back-end reliever to be found. But time is running out on that too because:

Still has options? If so….crazy….feels like it’s been do or die for years.
Electric arm still. Fingers crossed. Give up the ‘starting’ dream.

Pretty sure he still has options, yes.

Fangraphs says he has 1 option year left. So this is probably put up or shut up time for him.

That seems like a reasonable avv, guess Toronto didn't want to give term.

Giants Sign Jorge Soler

The Giants have agreed to a three-year contract with free agent designated hitter/outfielder Jorge Soler. Read more at MLB Trade Rumors.

www.mlbtraderumors.com

Or it might be that he didn't want to come to Toronto. It's always tempting to look at a contract and assume that any other team could've matched it and made a strong case for the player's services instead but there are always a million more factors in play. Maybe he wants to play in the OF more and the Jays were against that (and to be fair he's kind of a trash outfielder). Maybe they decided that a low-average guy who strikes out a ton was too much of a hindrance to be offset by his power totals. Maybe he didn't want to go to a northeastern city and preferred to stay somewhere warm. Who knows.

Why hasn't Shatkins cut this putz yet? I mean, for the love of all that is holy, the guy might be the worst pitcher in the whole system, and yet he's still on the 40 man roster? Does he have film of the two of them gettin' jiggy with a duck...or at a Trump rally or something? Jebuz...let's just cut our losses and move on.

White? He went nuts in the back half of last season in Buffalo and flashed the kind of potential that has had people giving him chances all along. Maybe it's a mirage and he flounders again but the team would be stupid not to see if there's something there in a stakes-free opportunity like spring training. If it doesn't work out he's out of options and someone will likely claim him. And if they don't then the team has a guy who can start in Buffalo and fill space when other pitchers get called up.

This article I think tells how divided he is from the team. Only praise his wife and brother. No mention of input from the jays. It’s great he’s in better shape and maybe he’s owning his last off season a little but this sounds like a player on his own path

I think that's reading way too much into one article. Let's see how he handles spring training before we decide the he's off on an island not listening to what the team says or wants.

 

[phillipmike]

Some of these pitchers pan out or return to form, Jays will be in good shape for the foreseeable future;

Gausman (3 more years)
Bassitt (2)
Berrios (3+2)
Kikuchi (1)
Manoah (4)
Rodriguez (5)
Tiedemann (6 or 7)
Francis (6)
White (4)

Next year Kikcuhi is a free agent and the year after it is Bassitt. Having Manoah return to form and Tiedemann and Yariel pan out would be huge. Barriera too. Lots of cheap pitching under control that could free up money to take a run at Soto or Bregman.

 

[dredeye]

I think that's reading way too much into one article. Let's see how he handles spring training before we decide the he's off on an island not listening to what the team says or wants.

Very likely that I am. I just think of stuff like Donaldson who did he own thing outside of what the staff wanted. Either way I’m glad he’s made a change that’s obviously for the better for him. That has to bode well for us. I will say I see no scenario where he’s here long term but again I hope I’m wrong(given he gets back to his old self)

Some of these pitchers pan out or return to form, Jays will be in good shape for the foreseeable future;

Gausman (3 more years)
Bassitt (2)
Berrios (3+2)
Kikuchi (1)
Manoah (4)
Rodriguez (5)
Tiedemann (6 or 7)
Francis (6)
White (4)

Next year Kikcuhi is a free agent and the year after it is Bassitt. Having Manoah return to form and Tiedemann and Yariel pan out would be huge. Barriera too. Lots of cheap pitching under control that could free up money to take a run at Soto or Bregman.

I didn’t realize we had four years of control left on Manoah.

 

[trellaine201]

Justin Turner complaining about lack of signings for the remaining free agents lol. Get a grip. You would think he understands how the market works at his ancient age. These remaining free agents obviously asking for too much money .

 

[Discoverer]

Justin Turner complaining about lack of signings for the remaining free agents lol. Get a grip. You would think he understands how the market works at his ancient age. These remaining free agents obviously asking for too much money .

Or maybe the teams aren't offering enough money.

 

[canucksfan]

Also, there are potential red flags with the remaining FAs. Bellinger came off two brutal years and last year his exit velo was low. Chapman plays good 3B but his bat sucked after April.

 

[Puckstuff]

Some of these pitchers pan out or return to form, Jays will be in good shape for the foreseeable future;

Gausman (3 more years)
Bassitt (2)
Berrios (3+2)
Kikuchi (1)
Manoah (4)
Rodriguez (5)
Tiedemann (6 or 7)
Francis (6)
White (4)

Next year Kikcuhi is a free agent and the year after it is Bassitt. Having Manoah return to form and Tiedemann and Yariel pan out would be huge. Barriera too. Lots of cheap pitching under control that could free up money to take a run at Soto or Bregman.

Out pitching depth is ridiculous

 

[canucksfan]

Are there any spots available on the roster or is it pretty much set excluding any injuries/trades?

 

[Ale Brew]

Are there any spots available on the roster or is it pretty much set excluding any injuries/trades?

As it stands it looks like before any injuries it’s down to Voglebach vs Horwitz for the last bench spot with Yariel Rodriguez likely starting in AAA.

Of course there is bound to be an injury or two in spring, and lots of rumours of Espinal possibly being moved. That could open a spot for Escobar or hopefully an additional OF.

 

[canucksfan]

As it stands it looks like before any injuries it’s down to Voglebach vs Horwitz for the last bench spot with Yariel Rodriguez likely starting in AAA.

Of course there is bound to be an injury or two in spring, and lots of rumours of Espinal possibly being moved. That could open a spot for Escobar or hopefully an additional OF.

I would be pissed if Vogelbach beats out Horwitz. Horwitz can play positions, is younger, and likely hits better than Vogelbach.

 

[stats1]

If Tiedemann/Francis are in the rotation in a few years with all that money coming off the books, you would have to assume the Jays would be able to sign literally anyone in free agency. But in saying that Bo and Vladdy both need extensions

 

[Killer Orcas]

What if Springer bounces back, Kirk bounces back, Vlad bounces back, Jansen has a huge season in a contract year, and Schneider becomes the next Brandon Lowe? If just some of these things play out they could be top 10 in offence, and I think they will be a top 5 defensive team.

What if I win the Lotto 649 I mean sure it's possible but wouldn't count on it. That's a lot to go right plus the pitching asking for too much in my opinion but heh hopefully I'm wrong and your right.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[Suntouchable13]

What if I win the Lotto 649 I mean sure it's possible but wouldn't count on it. That's a lot to go right plus the pitching asking for too much in my opinion but heh hopefully I'm wrong and your right.

Well, if you looked at the TB Rays lineup last season you wouldn’t think that team would win 99 games and mash 200 homers. But they did. Anyway, let’s watch and see what happens.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Buster Olney: Toronto Blue Jays' off-season was a 'disappointment,' but there is hope | TSN

The Toronto Blue Jays' off-season opened with excitement, as rumours swirled about two of the sport's biggest names, but with Spring Training officially underway, it has ended quietly, with ESPN's Buster Olney describing it as a "disappointment."

www.tsn.ca

"I don't think there's any way to look at their off-season as anything other than a disappointment," said ESPN's Buster Olney, speaking on First Up on TSN1050 on Tuesday.

"Last season ended, and there were questions about the offence and why it went downhill," he said. "Taking a run at Ohtani, looking at other options in the free agent market, [they landed on] basically the same group of guys."

 

[Woodman19]

As much as I wanted in on the Ohtani or Soto excitement, once we missed out on it we were right to stay away from fools gold and just build up the depth and rely on the tier 2 specs liem Schneider and Horwitz to produce vs. paying $200 million for most likely similar production.

 

[Ciao]

I think a few free agents might have overplayed their hand. Boras' clients.

 

[Puckstuff]

I think a few free agents might have overplayed their hand. Boras' clients.

Toronto exiting the Bellinger/Chapman race probably effected their market value, as the Jays were linked to both.

 

[Ale Brew]

Toronto exiting the Bellinger/Chapman race probably effected their market value, as the Jays were linked to both.

Jim Bowden reporting the Jays are making a push for Chapman.

He could just be being used by Boras to “create a market”.

Hard to tell what (if anything) we’re up to.

 

[Puckstuff]

Jim Bowden reporting the Jays are making a push for Chapman.

He could just be being used by Boras to “create a market”.

Hard to tell what (if anything) we’re up to.

Do you want him?

I feel like we could squeeze 2-3 WAR out of Turner, IKF, Martinez and Biggio at third.

Chapman is probably 1 WAR better but I'd only want him on a cheap 1 year deal.

 

[Brock Boeser Laser Show]

I think a few free agents might have overplayed their hand. Boras' clients.

They want term and money but they aren't the kind of players you want to hand out long term contracts to.

Maybe if Bellinger has another strong year he can command a big contract but those bad years are still fresh in the minds of GM's

Chapman is a seriously flawed. The defense will drop off eventually and that is where most of his value lies. If you strike out 30%
Of at bats you better bring some power and injuries seem to have zapped the power that Chapman once had.

 

[Ale Brew]

Do you want him?

I feel like we could squeeze 2-3 WAR out of Turner, IKF, Martinez and Biggio at third.

Chapman is probably 1 WAR better but I'd only want him on a cheap 1 year deal.

Not really. Not on a big contract that impacts what we can do down the road. I’d be happy to take him on a year deal though as I think he makes us better than we are today.

Would prefer Bellinger.

 

[canucksfan]

I would take Chapman on a one-year and possibly two-year deal.

He had a wRC of 84 from May to the end of the year. I really think his bat is cooked.