Proposal: [NYR - MTL] Lundkvist for Lehkonen

[5cotland]

Sorry, where did i got wrong..?

 

[TGWL]

Look at usage, ice time, and zone starts. Play the match game. Who is who below?

* 14 min a game vs 16 min a game
* 4 total min vs 15 total min on the PK
* 30.5 total min vs 1.5 total min on the PP
* 41% vs 57% of D zone starts.

How does bullet 2 and 3 support your ridiculous post about plus minus in the AHL?

 

[admiralcadillac]

.5 x 82 = 41

I understand the math, but it’s hardly indicative of some outlier of a season and I think you’re both well aware of that.

He’s headed for a season of 19 goals and 22 assists, or 9 points above his previous best.

In his rookie season he was on pace for 20 goals and 11 assists for 31 points… in 2019 he was on pace for 15 goals 17 assists for 32 points. He was again on pace for 15 goals in 2017.

It was presented as some Kadri level outlier of a season while his pace and play are consistent with the last couple years. He’s a great depth piece who can chip in 15-20 goals.

 

[Habs Halifax]

How does bullet 2 and 3 support your ridiculous post about plus minus in the AHL?

You can think about it more. You asked a question and gave you really good context into it. You already have your mind made up so not sure why you even asked the question. That's the ridiculous part.

Usage and ice time is your answer. Ignore as you wish. Lundkvist is not putting up offensive numbers and he's not a trusted option defensively. Reality. It's the reason why he was demoted and they gave the chance to Schneider where they can rely on him more in a defensive role and he might put up the same production offensively as Lundkvist did where he got more offensive zone usage.

 

[TGWL]

Lehkonen for Will Cuylle + a 2nd?

I'm going to have to say no. Rangers made a lot of offseason trade for toughness that I feel backfired. Sure we're tougher than before, but we ended up with Reeves in the lineup, Goodrow, and a smaller, slugish player Hunt trying to play bigger than he can. Cuylle is basically everything they tried to bring to the line-up this season, if he pans out. His tries to play similar to Benn/Wilson and I think it would be a mistake to trade him this early, considering I don't think these moves Drury made are going to last here.

 

[Benstheman]

Sorry, where did i got wrong..?

Basically everything.

 

[Goldenhands]

I'm going to have to say no. Rangers made a lot of offseason trade for toughness that I feel backfired. Sure we're tougher than before, but we ended up with Reeves in the lineup, Goodrow, and a smaller, slugish player Hunt trying to play bigger than he can. Cuylle is basically everything they tried to bring to the line-up this season, if he pans out. His tries to play similar to Benn/Wilson and I think it would be a mistake to trade him this early, considering I don't think these moves Drury made are going to last here.

So, you guys dont really want Lehkonen right?

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

How does bullet 2 and 3 support your ridiculous post about plus minus in the AHL?

Careful she'll block you for pointing out the truth.

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

So, you guys dont really want Lehkonen right?

Not for what you think he's valued at.

 

[Rullailija]

Is this really emptying the cupboard? We have Schneider on the 3rd pair right now. We have Jones who can play RD. I'd hardly calling trading Lundkvist emptying the cupboard when you consider NYR have used a lot of draft picks recently and aren't in the early stages or rebuilding. Whether you like Lehkonen enough to make the trade is another point.

Weeell, yeah I get what you're saying but trading a good D-prospect for a third liner just because we have an abundance is not good asset management. I feel that 3rd and 4th lines can be built without sacrificing any key assets. Keeping Lundkvist in the mix would be preferable if/when a player of Drury's liking shakes loose during the summer. Solely trading Lundkvist wouldn't empty the cupboards of course, but it would hurt when looking to make larger moves after the season when teams are more open to moving bigger-time players.

 

[Goldenhands]

Not for what you think he's valued at.

Unfortunately, we are no charity. We will keep him no problem.

 

[Habs10025]

The NYR are set at RD long term with Trouba, Fox and Schneider. They need quality players in their bottom 6 for the playoffs.

Montreal are sellers and lack RHD in their system.

The trade:

NYR gets: Lehkonen, 5th round pick in 2022.

Montreal gets: Lundkvist, 2nd round pick in 2022 (lowest between NYR's and St-Louis's)

Fair?

Unlikely Montreal trade Lehkonen.

 

[5cotland]

Basically everything.

Can you please elaborate?

 

[Mersss]

Sorry, where did i got wrong..?

Smashing the AHL?
@ 5'10 180, knowing he's terrible defensivelly, not physical at all, you're actually hoping he'd be near ppg in the AHL.

He isn't

 

[Frank Drebin]

lol that is really funny now considering that the guy who picked him is your Executive VP?

No it's not funny. I hope to God we don't repeat nyr recent history with high first rounders.

4 top 10 picks and you're left with a couple of 30 point players.

That would really suck, if it happened to us. I would hate it.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Kravtsov for Lehkonen

missing a first pick from NY

 

[TGWL]

Weeell, yeah I get what you're saying but trading a good D-prospect for a third liner just because we have an abundance is not good asset management. I feel that 3rd and 4th lines can be built without sacrificing any key assets. Keeping Lundkvist in the mix would be preferable if/when a player of Drury's liking shakes loose during the summer. Solely trading Lundkvist wouldn't empty the cupboards of course, but it would hurt when looking to make larger moves after the season when teams are more open to moving bigger-time players.

I kinda' feel like that ended a few years ago. Scoring is very high in the NHL these days. I think its almost expected that your top 6 better perform well with goals, but we're starting to see how important it is to have a solid 3rd line, and teams are paying a higher price than expected to make sure they go into playoffs with a 3rd line that either chip in, or play very well against other teams tops lines to slow them down.

 

[TGWL]

So, you guys dont really want Lehkonen right?

? I like Lehkonen, a lot, actually. I'm not saying Cuylle holds more value or is a top prospect here. I'm saying given the direction the team wanted to go in and how some of that has already backfired, we have a player in the system that completely fits that mold if he pans out.

You can think about it more. You asked a question and gave you really good context into it. You already have your mind made up so not sure why you even asked the question. That's the ridiculous part.

Usage and ice time is your answer. Ignore as you wish. Lundkvist is not putting up offensive numbers and he's not a trusted option defensively. Reality. It's the reason why he was demoted and they gave the chance to Schneider where they can rely on him more in a defensive role and he might put up the same production offensively as Lundkvist did where he got more offensive zone usage.

You didn't provide good context. You originally opened with +/- in the AHL and when asked how asked how that was a relevant point when the NHL +/- was different, you then went ahead and gave me time on ice numbers for the NHL, including powerplay and penalty kill minutes. I never said Lundkvist was better than Schneider. I said your +/- AHL talk was ridiculous.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

I kinda' feel like that ended a few years ago. Scoring is very high in the NHL these days. I think its almost expected that your top 6 better perform well with goals, but we're starting to see how important it is to have a solid 3rd line, and teams are paying a higher price than expected to make sure they go into playoffs with a 3rd line that either chip in, or play very well against other teams tops lines to slow them down.

and Lehkonen was great for us last playoffs shutting down the other teams top players,obviously he wasnt alone he had Danault also but Lehks is a great 3rd liner to have,now for hes value im not really sure what it is but personally if the best one we get is a 2nd round pick i rather keep him but for a 1st round pick if a GM is willing to pay that i make the trade and im sure the team that gets him will be very happy with him

 

[5cotland]

Smashing the AHL?
@ 5'10 180, knowing he's terrible defensivelly, not physical at all, you're actually hoping he'd be near ppg in the AHL.

He isn't

Terrible defensively and not physical.....

So that right there is proof that you dont watch Lundkvist at all. He doesnt exactly through big hits but is strong and his defensive game is decent. Not Elite but nowhere near bad.

1/4 of season in NHL and he goes from Blue Chip prospect to B-Level prospect because he struggle for a couple of months.

@Amazing Kreiderman educate this guy please

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Terrible defensively and not physical.....

So that right there is proof that you dont watch Lundkvist at all. He doesnt exactly through big hits but is strong and his defensive game is decent. Not Elite but nowhere near bad.

1/4 of season in NHL and he goes from Blue Chip prospect to B-Level prospect because he struggle for a couple of months.

@Amazing Kreiderman educate this guy please

Lundkvist is a 2-way defenseman, not an offensive defenseman. Defense was always the first thing he excelled at. And every time he moved up to the next level, he simplified his game to adjust. He focused on defense first and the offense came later.

It happened from u18 to u20, from u20 to SHL and now we see the same with his move to North America. Lundkvist is a highly disciplined defenseman who can use his lateral movement and skating to cover a lot of ice.

He's also quite physical. Him being 5'11" doesn't mean he's weak. He absorbs hits really well, which he has already shown in the NHL and doesn't shy away from pushing players off the puck. "But he's 5'11 so he must not be physical" is the most North American way of thinking ever in hockey but hey... Go for it.

I wouldn't trade Lundkvist for Lehkonen for what it's worth. Trade him for a prospect of the same age who fills a need in a different position.

And yes, going from a bluechip prospect to a throw-in, in a few months is TYPICAL HF Boards

 

[cwede]

NYR just got a 10 goals scored (68 over last 3-1/2) depth F for a 4th

They wont be paying inflated-seller-pricing for a middle-6 W, OP won't happen

somebody may pay all that, but most likely not NYR

 

[cwede]

duplicate

 

[Rullailija]

I kinda' feel like that ended a few years ago. Scoring is very high in the NHL these days. I think its almost expected that your top 6 better perform well with goals, but we're starting to see how important it is to have a solid 3rd line, and teams are paying a higher price than expected to make sure they go into playoffs with a 3rd line that either chip in, or play very well against other teams tops lines to slow them down.

Good point! I still think that including Lundkvist in a package for Lehkonen would come back to bite us, but I can see the logic in why someone would like to do so. I just feel that acquiring elite, cost-controlled 3rd liners at high costs (Like Goodrow, Coleman in Tampa) is something that should be done as the last push for the cup as a contending team, rather than in the first competitive year for a young team. Let’s see how this one shakes out.

 

[Rullailija]

I kinda' feel like that ended a few years ago. Scoring is very high in the NHL these days. I think its almost expected that your top 6 better perform well with goals, but we're starting to see how important it is to have a solid 3rd line, and teams are paying a higher price than expected to make sure they go into playoffs with a 3rd line that either chip in, or play very well against other teams tops

Double