You said "if M&M are both going to try to get every penny they can and not give up even a little bit in order to help the team win, what's the motivation for Willie to take less to stay here? I said, to summarize "Take less than what? $10.5M? If he thinks $9.5M is a discount number for his body of work he is mistaken."
Would you have a link to where either Mathew's or Marners camps have said they are not willing to give up even a little bit? Or what number Willie is willing to come down to? No sarcasm, if it exists I haven't seen it.
"We" aren't giving Matthews anything. The club already knows he is in a range they can gag down. They will dicker but they have no leverage except that this is his home franchise so he won't jump to leave it. It won't be an arbitrated agreement based on facts but they will argue he has won a Rocket and an MVP so eventually you either pay what he wants or bid against the market next summer. The NM gives up any leverage for a truly appropriate deal.
They have 22 places to trade Willie with the worst case being they only get rental return but it will be a full season rental to a club who isn't in his bottom 10 so there will be a resigning provision attached. His move will allow them to afford Matthews and Marner. They don't really have any other choice except to can hope they don't get beat up too badly on these other deals.
I suggest you stop. You and I disagree on so much, what's the point? I'm not going to take the time to pick through another lengthy ramble so I'll just address the most obvious - re. the bolded, I'm pretty sure I never said that so why are you asking me for a link?
Make no mistake, as it stands today, Matthews (and his pending contract) is the most important piece to resetting the culture of this team and putting the club in a position to build a legit Cup contender.
If he takes less and commits to the Leafs long-term it will set the tone others to follow his lead. If he leverages the Leafs to pay him close to max cap it will set the tone for others to follow his lead.
What is less? I'd say legit less is a long-term deal @ 12.25 per. However, 12.6 would be a win-win for both parties as it places Matthews next to MacKinnon as the highest paid player in NHL history until McDavid does his next deal, rightfully so. It also gives the Leafs resources (especially down the line once Tavares is up) to surround Matthews with better talent.
Exactly. Matty is the face of the team, if he's going get every penny he can then no reason to expect anyone else to do any different. If however he shows he can be reasonable, there's hope that others will follow.
12.6 would be good, and to me so much better than 12.7 because it shows that feeding his ego isn't crucial to him. Of course Mac took an 8 year deal so it Matthews takes 12.6 on a 3 year term or WE, that's different but 12.6 on an 8 year deal, that's the best we can hope for. Based on everything that's happened and what the rumours are, I don't think it's likely to happen (like near zero hope), but we'll see.
Goals aren't worth more than assists its something that became more Common when OV declined from being a contender for best player in the world
Also used for Matthews when his fans try to prop him up because hes a medicore point producer and cant generate assists like Drai/Mcdavid/Mack/Kuch
Marner has been much ahead of Nylander in production for like 4 out if last 5 tears
Per 82 games:
18-19: 94 pts vs 41 pts
19-20: 93 pts vs 71 pts
20-21: 100 pts vs 68 pts
21-22: 109 pts vs 81 pts
22-23: 101 pts vs 87 pts
Marner has been much further ahead 4 of the 5 years despite being a main stay on the PK and having more defensive responsibilities
Debatable. IMHO they're obviously worth more, it's just a question of how much more. Certainly not twice as much more but ... more.
Of course Marner is better than Nylander, goals being worth more than assists doesn't change a thing in that regard.
Nylander is making less than 7 mil and Marner is almost at 11. Is Marner that much better than Nylander? Absolutely not. In a perfect world the Leafs would have a salary reset that is fair and realistic which looks something like:
Nylander - 8.75 mil x 8 (Meier deal)
Marner - 9.5 mil x 8 (Tkachuk deal)
Matthews - 12.6 x 8 (MacKinnon deal)
Nylander deserves more than his 6.8, Marner less than his 10.8, and Matthews max should be MacKinnon's 12.6.
The gap between Marner and Nylander is bigger than that IMO. Maybe something like this:
Nylander - 9x8 - Meier deal with a bit added on to cover inflation.
Marner - 11x8 - As much as I've hated on him for regressing in the playoffs, this seems about right and a pay cut is hoping for too much.
Matthews - 12.6x8 - Not worth more because of health issues, can't really expect him to take less so that's fine.
I doubt any of this will actually happen, interesting thought exercise though and I think I got the gaps between the three about right. So much talent there, it's a damn shame they could never put it all together in the playoffs. Doesn't feel like that's in our future either, we'll see.
