Nylander contract discussion - New Poll

[notDatsyuk]

If we are to contend this year we need a way better defense.
Gio too old
Lilly still learning
Reilly needs that physical defensive dman to flourish
Benoit just a 7/8
Klingberg not a top 4
McCabe just ok
Brodie looking like too many hard miles

Realistically speaking we can’t trade matthews
Marner or Tavares even if we should
So that leaves Willy to trade for some defensive help.

Trading the player who is the most productive in the tough going seems to be short-sighted. Who do you realistically think we could get for Nylander?

 

[ToneDog]

Trading the player who is the most productive in the tough going seems to be short-sighted. Who do you realistically think we could get for Nylander?

If Nylander > PLD. We should be able to get a better package than what Winny got for PLD.

• 2023-Jun-27 Traded from Winnipeg Jets to Los Angeles Kings for Gabriel Vilardi, Alex Iafallo, Rasmus Kupari and round 2 pick in the 2024 draft

 

[notDatsyuk]

If Nylander > PLD. We should be able to get a better package than what Winny got for PLD.

• 2023-Jun-27 Traded from Winnipeg Jets to Los Angeles Kings for Gabriel Vilardi, Alex Iafallo, Rasmus Kupari and round 2 pick in the 2024 draft

Those three in a combined 188 games last year produced about what Nylander did himself. That would be a brutal return for him.

And which of those is the superstar defenceman we need to win the cup?

 

[ToneDog]

Those three in a combined 188 games last year produced about what Nylander did himself. That would be a brutal return for him.

And which of those is the superstar defenceman we need to win the cup?

Willie is not going to return the dman we need to win the cup. Hell you are probably not getting even value in a 1 for 1 trade. I'd settle for a top 10 1st and two bonifide 25+ goal scorers for Willie if there are no better offers out there and we cannot or decide we do not want to sign him. Those two 25+ goal scorers might put up 30+ goals here.

 

[Menzinger]

Willie is not going to return the dman we need to win the cup. Hell you are probably not getting even value in a 1 for 1 trade. I'd settle for a top 10 1st and two bonifide 25+ goal scorers for Willie if there are no better offers out there and we cannot or decide we do not want to sign him. Those two 25+ goal scorers might put up 30+ goals here.

Teams that are interested in Nylander likely don't have any interest of giving up assets that will hurt their ability to win now. They're not going to be interested in adding Nylander to their goal scoring group, not subtracting a piece for him

Which is imo one of the reasons why Nylander trade won't happen. It weakens the Leafs chances to try and win now for only getting futures in return.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Willie is not going to return the dman we need to win the cup. Hell you are probably not getting even value in a 1 for 1 trade. I'd settle for a top 10 1st and two bonifide 25+ goal scorers for Willie if there are no better offers out there and we cannot or decide we do not want to sign him. Those two 25+ goal scorers might put up 30+ goals here.

I agree we won't get that Dman, and aren't likely a win a trade for him, and even this proposal is a lot better than what Winnipeg got.

But the post I was responding to said to trade him for the D we need to win, which is why my response to you was what it was.

 

[ToneDog]

Teams that are interested in Nylander likely don't have any interest of giving up assets that will hurt their ability to win now. They're not going to be interested in adding Nylander to their goal scoring group, not subtracting a piece for him

Which is imo one of the reasons why Nylander trade won't happen. It weakens the Leafs chances to try and win now for only getting futures in return.

You make sense. Problem is do you want to let him walk for nothing which would be painful.

 

[Menzinger]

You make sense. Problem is do you want to let him walk for nothing which would be painful.

I think Leafs management will likely do that and circle back to extension talks after the playoffs if they don't get an extension locked in and don't see any trade offers they can't pass on.

It would be a very bad look for Shanny and Tre if the team didn't at least match what they did last season/playoffs, especially with how chaotic the offseason has been

Imo my prediction is Nylander is extended by the tdl. But obviously that's just pure speculation on my part

 

[kevsh]

I still think it would be wrong to trade the one of the four who performs best in the playoffs, who's still playing this year for under $7

I know and that's the unfortunate part of the Leafs dilemma here.

The real issue with Willie is off the ice - and that is he is going to not sign until he gets every single dollar he feels he's entitled to. And whatever his ask is, it's going to be more than the Leafs can afford if they want to build a championship roster (starting with the blue line) around their stars before Tavares is off the books.

Basically, the central issue that both Dubas and now Treliving seem to refuse to believe they have to deal with by trading someone.

The sad math is, one has to go or we just waste away another two years of these guys until Johnny walks - which isn't even 100% guaranteed, though if he does stay it will obviously be at considerably less than $11M.

 

[hullsy47]

Trading the player who is the most productive in the tough going seems to be short-sighted. Who do you realistically think we could get for Nylander?

U gotta give up something to get something

 

[thewave]

Willie is not going to return the dman we need to win the cup. Hell you are probably not getting even value in a 1 for 1 trade. I'd settle for a top 10 1st and two bonifide 25+ goal scorers for Willie if there are no better offers out there and we cannot or decide we do not want to sign him. Those two 25+ goal scorers might put up 30+ goals here.

Well according to some posters here we just need to move on from Nylander but it doesn't matter. Marner and his future 13m contract will make any old 5m player a 30 goal scorer. That's the beauty of having the most amazing playmaker in the NHL since Gretzky (apparently) lol

 

[rielledup]

What level of dman do you think you get in return for Nylander? Do you think we could get a good #2/lower end number 1?

 

[thewave]

What level of dman do you think you get in return for Nylander? Do you think we could get a good #2/lower end number 1?

We need to get him signed and move on from JT.

 

[notdoneyet]

Trading the player who is the most productive in the tough going seems to be short-sighted. Who do you realistically think we could get for Nylander?

Your agenda with this most productive narrative in the playoffs has to stop

This year in 11 games he had 10 points with 4 on the powerplay and finished with an-4 which means he was on the ice for 10 goals against. He had 3 hits in 11 games .

Willy and Tavares get all the easy matchups. They play against the other teams 3/4 dman and 2nd lines. Matthews marner get the 1/2 matchup every game.

Willy is expendable for a decent dman. I’ll leave bit up to trevling to make that trade.

 

[Menzinger]

Your agenda with this most productive narrative in the playoffs has to stop

This year in 11 games he had 10 points with 4 on the powerplay and finished with an-4 which means he was on the ice for 10 goals against. He had 3 hits in 11 games .

Willy and Tavares get all the easy matchups. They play against the other teams 3/4 dman and 2nd lines. Matthews marner get the 1/2 matchup every game.

Willy is expendable for a decent dman. I’ll leave bit up to trevling to make that trade.

The #1 problem the team has had in the postseason has been goal scoring. I'm not sure making the team worse at that is going to help things. Tavares is already being shifted towards being a secondary piece. If the team moves on from Nylander it's betting everything on Marner and Matthews being able to carry an even bigger load than they haven't been able to do so far

 

[kb]

The #1 problem the team has had in the postseason has been goal scoring. I'm not sure making the team worse at that is going to help things. Tavares is already being shifted towards being a secondary piece. If the team moves on from Nylander it's betting everything on Marner and Matthews being able to carry an even bigger load than they haven't been able to do so far

It's only the ones who listen to the talking heads (thinking that they have even an ounce of intelligence to offer) who keep saying D, or G instead of what has actually killed them. Lack of secondary (and timely) scoring in the playoffs.

 

[Menzinger]

It's only the ones who listen to the talking heads (thinking that they have even an ounce of intelligence) to offer who keep saying D, or G instead of what has actually killed them. Lack of secondary (and timely) scoring in the playoffs.

Imo too often the default response is make trades more so than looking internally for how things could be done differently/more effectively. Separating Nylander and JT, like Keefe seems to be experimenting with could potentially offer than solution depending on how things go

 

[rumman]

You make sense. Problem is do you want to let him walk for nothing which would be painful.

Hopefully the sting of losing Johnny Hockey for squat hasn’t left Tree……..

 

[notDatsyuk]

I know and that's the unfortunate part of the Leafs dilemma here.

The real issue with Willie is off the ice - and that is he is going to not sign until he gets every single dollar he feels he's entitled to. And whatever his ask is, it's going to be more than the Leafs can afford if they want to build a championship roster (starting with the blue line) around their stars before Tavares is off the books.

Basically, the central issue that both Dubas and now Treliving seem to refuse to believe they have to deal with by trading someone.

The sad math is, one has to go or we just waste away another two years of these guys until Johnny walks - which isn't even 100% guaranteed, though if he does stay it will obviously be at considerably less than $11M.

If his initial ask was $10, he'll likely settle for less, hopefully around $9.5. We should be able to accommodate that amount for the one year until JT's contract expires.

The sad truth is that even if we trade Willy and get a good return, it may fix the balance a bit but it won't improve the team much if at all. Whether we trade him or not, we probably "just waste away another two years of these guys until Johnny walks".

Basically, that signing ruined our chances for seven years.

 

[Racer88]

If his initial ask was $10, he'll likely settle for less, hopefully around $9.5. We should be able to accommodate that amount for the one year until JT's contract expires.

The sad truth is that even if we trade Willy and get a good return, it may fix the balance a bit but it won't improve the team much if at all. Whether we trade him or not, we probably "just waste away another two years of these guys until Johnny walks".

Basically, that signing ruined our chances for seven years.

Yup. Dubas killed this teams chance with Tavares move for sure

 

[notDatsyuk]

U gotta give up something to get something

True, but the post I responded to seems to think we can trade him for the stud D that will carry us to Nirvana. Hence my question.

It's easy to say "trade him for a stud D". It's a lot harder to actually come up with a reasonable scenario.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Your agenda with this most productive narrative in the playoffs has to stop

This year in 11 games he had 10 points with 4 on the powerplay and finished with an-4 which means he was on the ice for 10 goals against. He had 3 hits in 11 games .

Willy and Tavares get all the easy matchups. They play against the other teams 3/4 dman and 2nd lines. Matthews marner get the 1/2 matchup every game.

Willy is expendable for a decent dman. I’ll leave bit up to trevling to make that trade.

Your agenda with ignoring the significant part of the statement has to end.

Don't pass the buck to avoid a reasonable response - who's the decent defenceman?

 

[Gary Nylund]

Your agenda with this most productive narrative in the playoffs has to stop

This year in 11 games he had 10 points with 4 on the powerplay and finished with an-4 which means he was on the ice for 10 goals against. He had 3 hits in 11 games .

Willy and Tavares get all the easy matchups. They play against the other teams 3/4 dman and 2nd lines. Matthews marner get the 1/2 matchup every game.

Willy is expendable for a decent dman. I’ll leave bit up to trevling to make that trade.

Facts are facts. Doesn't mean Nylander is more valuable then the guys he's out-producing, but it's still impressive. It's actually very impressive when you consider he gets less ice time than M&M, plus the coach in his infinite wisdom took him off PP1.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

It's only the ones who listen to the talking heads (thinking that they have even an ounce of intelligence to offer) who keep saying D, or G instead of what has actually killed them. Lack of secondary (and timely) scoring in the playoffs.

The leafs star players doing far worse offensively in elimination games or even later in a series definitely is the big issue i think. The team hasn't been constructed to really have secondary scoring so i dont expect it too much. The cap isn't there for that. If the top 6 dries up the team is f***ed. Requires a lot of consistency and is more risky as a result.

 

[Bluebear]

Nylander might get the stud D man everyone wants, but it would be in the form of a prospect that is a few years away from championship form. Everyone wants to win now, and i get that, but keeping Nylander and busting out of the playoffs again could easily happen. I think trading him for prospects bringing in some secondary scoring with the cap space could allow the window of competitiveness to be extended even if it hurts the chances short term