Nylander contract discussion - New Poll

[Rare Jewel]

They aren't moving him - He resigns or he walks.

That's silly, particularly given the state of D.

 

[Apotheosis]

That's silly, particularly given the state of D.

No your statement was silly considering Nylander has been the Leaf's best player all season so far.

 

[notDatsyuk]

No. I understood my point about what age the players mentioned will be during their contracts. I get you're trying to derail the conversation but the point stands.

I understood that - they are the same age but Pastrnak signed a year earlier, so Nylander should get more because of the higher salary cap.

But why did you confute that with Tkachuk who's younger, and maybe should get more (although his style of play is not as conducive to longevity)?

 

[Rare Jewel]

No your statement was silly considering Nylander has been the Leaf's best player all season so far.

Ok, but if becomes more clear that isn't signing, letting him walk will supersede that.

The "own rental" idea only sounds reasonable until the season is over, particularly if it's after the 1st round again.

 

[Buds17]

That's silly, particularly given the state of D.

The suggestion seems difficult to accomplish as it appears to require a three-way trade or two separate trades since any team interested in acquiring pending UFA Nylander isn't likely to have an expendable d-man/quality piece for the present to offer in return.

 

[Budz]

I will say if Willy walks for nothing - I’m done with the Leafs.

 

[ToneDog]

I will say if Willy walks for nothing - I’m done with the Leafs.

Says he want to stay but if he decides to move on instead?

 

[Americanadian]

I understood that - they are the same age but Pastrnak signed a year earlier, so Nylander should get more because of the higher salary cap.

But why did you confute that with Tkachuk who's younger, and maybe should get more (although his style of play is not as conducive to longevity)?

Tkachuk, like Pastrnak, is starting his contract at an earlier age than Nylander - thus he will end his contract earlier in his 30s. It sounds like you don't understand what I am saying.

 

[Rare Jewel]

The suggestion seems difficult to accomplish as it appears to require a three-way trade or two separate trades since any team interested in acquiring pending UFA Nylander isn't likely to have an expendable d-man/quality piece for the present to offer in return.

It's a good point, and I would like to keep him, but letting him walk IMO isn't the best option..

 

[PROUD PAPA]

I will say if Willy walks for nothing - I’m done with the Leafs.

While I agree it would be poor asset management at least it might be a sign that management finally realizes the team is terribly constructed and it's time to move on. Now that's not saying they wouldn't try another all skill/no will model but at least there's a chance they put more emphasis on heart next time.

 

[Budz]

While I agree it would be poor asset management at least it might be a sign that management finally realizes the team is terribly constructed and it's time to move on. Now that's not saying they wouldn't try another all skill/no will model but at least there's a chance they put more emphasis on heart next time.

Then trade him at the deadline. We are not winning the cup.

He walks for nothing is beyond stupid.

 

[Buds17]

It's a good point, and I would like to keep him, but letting him walk IMO isn't the best option..

It very well may not be the best course of action to take (especially if the team falls below expectations in the playoffs, as you've alluded to previously). OTOH, I can also see the difficulty associated with subtracting from a potentially promising present in exchange for only having the hope of bolstering a future iteration of the team

 

[Budz]

It’s really simple:

1. You offer your max for Willy prior to deadline in hopes he signs.
2. If he chooses to pass - you deal him for futures.
3. If he declines and we trade him - You tell Willy you will revisit his contract on July 1.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Tkachuk, like Pastrnak, is starting his contract at an earlier age than Nylander - thus he will end his contract earlier in his 30s. It sounds like you don't understand what I am saying.

So they both signed earlier when the cap was lower, so if Willy gets the same amount it will be a lower cap percentage, which will benefit Toronto. Good to know.

By the way, since we don't know how long Willy will sign for, we don't know that the contracts of either Tkachuk or Pastrnak will end at an earlier age.

It actually sounds more like you don't understand.

 

[Leaf Fans]

I don't care if they trade him.

 

[thewave]

It’s really simple:

1. You offer your max for Willy prior to deadline in hopes he signs.
2. If he chooses to pass - you deal him for futures.
3. If he declines and we trade him - You tell Willy you will revisit his contract on July 1.

That's essentially how I would have approached the "own rentals" all these years. Leafs don't know how to save money or assets (or manage asset values). The teams too wealthy and throw money around and figure we can always just buy our way out of a jam. It doesn't work like that in a cap system.

I don't care if they trade him.

As you shouldn't.

You should only care when we lose assets for nothing, make bad trades and don't achieve playoff success.

 

[Menzinger]

Ok, but if becomes more clear that isn't signing, letting him walk will supersede that.

The "own rental" idea only sounds reasonable until the season is over, particularly if it's after the 1st round again.

Teams trying to be competitive (like the Leafs) aren't going to trade a star mid season (especially if the likely return is futures).

They'll keep him and then gamble they can still extend him by July in the meantime.

I can't think of a single team in recent history in a similar position as the Leafs who sold a ufa star mid season

 

[Evilhomer]

Then trade him at the deadline. We are not winning the cup.

He walks for nothing is beyond stupid.

It will never get to that point. Toronto will sign him because there is no scenario under which the Leafs will not pay more than any other team. This is no different than Matthews. It's just a matter of what the number ends up being, but it will unquestionably be Toronto paying that number.

 

[Evilhomer]

That's essentially how I would have approached the "own rentals" all these years. Leafs don't know how to save money or assets (or manage asset values). The teams too wealthy and throw money around and figure we can always just buy our way out of a jam. It doesn't work like that in a cap system.

I'm pretty sure it works exactly like this in a cap system. The Leafs, and other wealthy teams, pretty much always buy their way out of jams.

 

[Rare Jewel]

Teams trying to be competitive (like the Leafs) aren't going to trade a star mid season (especially if the likely return is futures).

They'll keep him and then gamble they can still extend him by July in the meantime.

I can't think of a single team in recent history in a similar position as the Leafs who sold a ufa star mid season

That doesn't necessarily mean it's the right move, though. If we're sitting here in May without Willy signed and another 1st round exit, then the team isn't going to be in the best spot. Willy also, if he gets that far will be tempted to test free agency,

What I'm saying is to set a date he needs to be signed by or move him. As another poster said, it could very well involve another (3rd team) team because competing teams aren't likely to move too much off their current roster, but losing him for nothing really needs to be avoided.

 

[Racer88]

Teams trying to be competitive (like the Leafs) aren't going to trade a star mid season (especially if the likely return is futures).

They'll keep him and then gamble they can still extend him by July in the meantime.

I can't think of a single team in recent history in a similar position as the Leafs who sold a ufa star mid season

There is also no team in history that has 50% of its cap tied up in 4 similar forwards so the Leafs are already in uncharted territory. I would guess that nothing is beyond them

 

[Americanadian]

So they both signed earlier when the cap was lower, so if Willy gets the same amount it will be a lower cap percentage, which will benefit Toronto. Good to know.

By the way, since we don't know how long Willy will sign for, we don't know that the contracts of either Tkachuk or Pastrnak will end at an earlier age.

It actually sounds more like you don't understand.

The point has gone over you head. No point in discussing it further.

 

[Bomber0104]

Teams trying to be competitive (like the Leafs) aren't going to trade a star mid season (especially if the likely return is futures).

They'll keep him and then gamble they can still extend him by July in the meantime.

I can't think of a single team in recent history in a similar position as the Leafs who sold a ufa star mid season

Interesting, well maybe the Leafs should be the ones to break the stereotypical mold instead of losing a very valuable, tradeable asset for nothing by walking him right to the off-season as a UFA, free to negotiate with 30 other teams.

The options before us are overpay, walk to UFA, or reclaim assets back in a trade.

I hear we need a defenceman.

 

[ULF_55]

Then trade him at the deadline. We are not winning the cup.

He walks for nothing is beyond stupid.

Lightning let Stamkos walk for nothing.

He re-signed there because he wanted to stay there.

Leafs would have the cap space to chase the best UFA's less than $11mm.

Players leave teams all the time and the teams don't fold.

 

[hullsy47]

Lightning let Stamkos walk for nothing.

He re-signed there because he wanted to stay there.

Leafs would have the cap space to chase the best UFA's less than $11mm.

Players leave teams all the time and the teams don't fold.

The best thing to happen is for MSLE to tell Shanahan to give nylanders camp a firm date
After that the fan base can decide if he's going to be theit own rental or deal him
Its serious not to lose players for nothing
Leafs aren't a dynasty with him anyways