Confirmed Signing with Link: [NYI] Ryan Pulock signs extension with the Islanders (8 years, $6.15M AAV)

[TBF1972]

Common practice that becomes a big issue down the line which is what I'm alluding too.

was this the same reaction you had, when crosby, malkin and letang signed their long term contracts?

 

[denis5]

I see a very similar path by Lou as Lombardi in LA, Rutherford in PIT, and Bowman in CHI. The obsession with a successful roster and extension of what has happened versus what will moving forward.

Boston seems to be one of the few franchises that is cutthroat when it comes to that stuff. Lou used to be in the 90s. But as I alluded to he did some weird stuff since the 2012 Devils run.

Moving forward toward what, exactly? The Islanders' window is now, and windows only stay open so long, no matter the team, in a salary cap world. Right now, the team is better positioned to keep it's window open longer than most as there's not a single double digit contract on the books, a number of contracts are scheduled to come off the books in the next few years, the prospect pool is being rebuilt, and Dobson (who will be an RFA) and Barzal are the only major deals to be negotiated in the foreseeable future.

Anyway, cutting ties with a top defenseman still in his prime isn't the way to build today, or tomorrow. What Ryan signed was very team-friendly. On the open market, given what's gone down with upper tier (and some not-so-upper-tier) D signings in the recent past, a 7 year, 8M+ deal would have been in reach.

 

[Disgraced Cosmonaut]

The condition of the modern great-to-exceptional athlete is fascinating. It is no longer a stretch to think that the best can play at a reasonably high level into the first half of their thirties. The very best can go beyond that. Pelech and Pulock are strong, heady players. Maybe the last two years of these deals won’t be ideal, but the cap hit should be manageable for a second pairing during those same years.
Right now, I love these deals.

 

[Gurglesons]

was this the same reaction you had, when crosby, malkin and letang signed their long term contracts?

I don’t see any players on the Isles roster that are comparable to those three when those contracts were signed.

They also had been to back to back finals when they signed those contracts and all had won personal trophies outside of Letang.

 

[Gurglesons]

Moving forward toward what, exactly? The Islanders' window is now, and windows only stay open so long, no matter the team, in a salary cap world. Right now, the team is better positioned to keep it's window open longer than most as there's not a single double digit contract on the books, a number of contracts are scheduled to come off the books in the next few years, the prospect pool is being rebuilt, and Dobson (who will be an RFA) and Barzal are the only major deals to be negotiated in the foreseeable future.

Anyway, cutting ties with a top defenseman still in his prime isn't the way to build today, or tomorrow. What Ryan signed was very team-friendly. On the open market, given what's gone down with upper tier (and some not-so-upper-tier) D signings in the recent past, a 7 year, 8M+ deal would have been in reach.

For the 100th time. Pulock and Pelech are not the deals I’m addressing.

What I’m addressing is Lou giving out high term deals.

 

[hunter7isles]

I don’t see any players on the Isles roster that are comparable to those three when those contracts were signed.

They also had been to back to back finals when they signed those contracts and all had won personal trophies outside of Letang.

Moving back to the real conversation at hand here, so would your plan to be to sacrifice the present for the future and sign these guys to shorter term, bigger money deals (or any of the longer term deals that they have)? Because you can't have it both ways. They could have signed Pelech and Pulcok to 5-6 year deals for significantly higher cap ($7.5m to $9M each) and skipped out on Palmieri and left themselves in bad shape for Dobson and Barzal conracts in a couple of years. Would that be preferred for you? Should he have let one of them walk?

What Lou did was extend our window longer. Could that hurt 5 years from now? Sure, but by then they may be in partial to full rebuild anyway. That is the nature of the beast. How many teams can you name that have not had it eventually all fall apart due to cap? It is the nature of the beast. Your expectations are extraordinarily unrealistic for how contending teams should operate in a salary-cap era.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I don’t see any players on the Isles roster that are comparable to those three when those contracts were signed.

Same here. I don't see the players you are continually harping in this thread have any correlation to a 27 year old first pairing D man signing a team friendly contract for 8 years. Which is what this thread is focusing on.

 

[Konk]

I think Pulock breaks out offensively this year. He's already rock solid defensively and with the confidence built from last season along with the security of this deal, I think his comfort level will facilitate his offense coming around. All of the tools are there and his shooting percentage isn't going to stay at 1% forever. Law of averages.

 

[slurpee addict]

For the 100th time. Pulock and Pelech are not the deals I’m addressing.

What I’m addressing is Lou giving out high term deals.

OK. I'll play your game. Let's address the two deals you are referring to vis-à-vis the high term aspect for those contracts. Would you rather sign them for a shorter term (say five years) (even if the AAV is slightly lower) and then have these top pair defensemen suddenly hit UFA status at age 32 - essentially in their prime? What then - do you think they will suddenly want a three year term on their next contract? Of course they won't - they'll want another five years at least. I'm not sure how that is better, because then you will be paying for an age period for both that is really a more risky contract for the team, or you let a top defenseman or two walk at age 32 with no return.

4D chess.

 

[Gurglesons]

Moving back to the real conversation at hand here, so would your plan to be to sacrifice the present for the future and sign these guys to shorter term, bigger money deals (or any of the longer term deals that they have)? Because you can't have it both ways. They could have signed Pelech and Pulcok to 5-6 year deals for significantly higher cap ($7.5m to $9M each) and skipped out on Palmieri and left themselves in bad shape for Dobson and Barzal conracts in a couple of years. Would that be preferred for you? Should he have let one of them walk?

What Lou did was extend our window longer. Could that hurt 5 years from now? Sure, but by then they may be in partial to full rebuild anyway. That is the nature of the beast. How many teams can you name that have not had it eventually all fall apart due to cap? It is the nature of the beast. Your expectations are extraordinarily unrealistic for how contending teams should operate in a salary-cap era.

My original post was this:

It is good now. At the same time the Isles are setting up to be New Jersey circa 2013 - 2020 in a few years with their cap situation.

I guess if Raty and Dobson add up that helps them out, but lots of money to players that are great right now, but not necessarily on the best aging curves.

That is all my point has ever been.

 

[boredmale]

OK. I'll play your game. Let's address the two deals you are referring to vis-à-vis the high term aspect for those contracts. Would you rather sign them for a shorter term (say five years) (even if the AAV is slightly lower)

Odds are if it's shorter term given Pulock would be a UFA next season, the AVV would be higher on a 5 year deal. When you sign for 8 generally you give up money for security

 

[Gurglesons]

Same here. I don't see the players you are continually harping in this thread have any correlation to a 27 year old first pairing D man signing a team friendly contract for 8 years. Which is what this thread is focusing on.

I didn’t bring up Sid and Malkin did I?

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I didn’t bring up Sid and Malkin did I?

You are bringing up players with contracts signed under different circumstances, and issuing a false narrative of the implication that they will age badly when those players are not the same player or in the same circumstance of a 27 year old #1 pairing D man on a successful team that just got extended. Isles are in a win in 5 year window. Pulock's signing allows the Isles to keep this window open. In year 6, if the Isles want to retool, with the Cap up and Pulock at age 32, he will be a friendly cap hit to move if the Isles find themselves in this position. There is nothing not to like about this deal, not unless you are Sid Crosby who has been shut down twice in the playoffs against The Pulock and Pelech pairing.

 

[Gurglesons]

You are bringing up players with contracts signed under different circumstances, and issuing a false narrative of the implication that they will age badly when those players are not the same player or in the same circumstance of a 27 year old #1 pairing D man on a successful team that just got extended. Isles are in a win in 5 year window. Pulock's signing allows the Isles to keep this window open. In year 6, if the Isles want to retool, with the Cap up and Pulock at age 32, he will be a friendly cap hit to move if the Isles find themselves in this position. There is nothing not to like about this deal, not unless you are Sid Crosby who has been shut down twice in the playoffs against The Pulock and Pelech pairing.

Once again, I made a comment on the first page and you took it and ran.

This deal is fine.

 

[hunter7isles]

My original post was this:

It is good now. At the same time the Isles are setting up to be New Jersey circa 2013 - 2020 in a few years with their cap situation.

I guess if Raty and Dobson add up that helps them out, but lots of money to players that are great right now, but not necessarily on the best aging curves.

That is all my point has ever been.

It has been your point in several threads. When you repeat things over and over again, you give the perception of having a grudge you are carrying. Again, name me a successful team that has not had a drop like those Devils teams. Lou is not unique in this way. All teams eventually have to rebuild other than teams that are happy to perpetually be a 6-10 seed who get knocked out of the 1st round every year in the best case scenario.

The bottom line is, if you have a chance to win it all, you go for it. You don't sign shorter term high $ contracts which screws you from keeping your roster together. Do I have to list off the teams with similar paths in the past not named Lou's Devils? Blackhawks? Sharks? Rangers? Kings? Red Wings!!!??? As Islanders fans, your 2013-2020 Devils example is laughable. Try 1989-2018 without much at all to cheer for. 2013-2020? If we get a championship, we will happily take a down period like that. We know what suffering is like as fans and will gladly suffer again if it means we get a cup again.

 

[Nucker101]

Wow Lou came through big

 

[Gurglesons]

It has been your point in several threads. When you repeat things over and over again, you give the perception of having a grudge you are carrying. Again, name me a successful team that has not had a drop like those Devils teams. Lou is not unique in this way. All teams eventually have to rebuild other than teams that are happy to perpetually be a 6-10 seed who get knocked out of the 1st round every year in the best case scenario.

The bottom line is, if you have a chance to win it all, you go for it. You don't sign shorter term high $ contracts which screws you from keeping your roster together. Do I have to list off the teams with similar paths in the past not named Lou's Devils? Blackhawks? Sharks? Rangers? Kings? Red Wings!!!??? As Islanders fans, your 2013-2020 Devils example is laughable. Try 1989-2018 without much at all to cheer for. 2013-2020? If we get a championship, we will happily take a down period like that. We know what suffering is like as fans and will gladly suffer again if it means we get a cup again.

Why would I have a grudge? All I said was Lou’s cap situation is solid for the next couple years and then it’s going to cause trouble.

 

[slurpee addict]

Completely

Odds are if it's shorter term given Pulock would be a UFA next season, the AVV would be higher on a 5 year deal. When you sign for 8 generally you give up money for security

Totally agree. I used a lower AAV to emphasis the inconsistency in the argument that signing a high/long term deal at 27 is dumb. As you suggest, it's not dumb from a money perspective, just as the term for Pulock and Pelech isn't dumb either. Smart by Lou on both counts.

 

[Foppberg]

Lol Gurglesons with grade A trolling.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Good deal for Isles. They will be good for a while.

 

[surixon]

That is pretty darn good value especially in ligh of the other defenseman contracts this offseason.

 

[hunter7isles]

Why would I have a grudge? All I said was Lou’s cap situation is solid for the next couple years and then it’s going to cause trouble.

Basically every top team will run into cap trouble (with many long-term deals on the books) if they are not already there. Again, Lou is not doing anything unique. You tell me why you would have a grudge against Lou? Who is your team?

 

[Beacon Isles]

Why would I have a grudge? All I said was Lou’s cap situation is solid for the next couple years and then it’s going to cause trouble.

Maybe because you blame Lou for leaving your team in "cap hell" when he left, and the next guy couldn't get out of it?

 

[hunter7isles]

Maybe because you blame Lou for leaving your team in "cap hell" when he left, and the next guy couldn't get out of it?

Ding ding ding

 

[Chardo]

This fits with Lou's model of building a deep and balanced team instead of a top-heavy one. That will probably get tossed out when he has to sign Barzal, but enjoy it for now. Of course, the way Lou is going, he might sign Barzal at a reasonable number. You never know.