Blue Jays Discussion: No More AA, Everyone is very Sad (and by Sad, I mean Mad)

[10coach*]

Understand that the majority of baseball presidents deal primarily in the business of the radio deals, advertising, ballpark ops, etc and very rarely have input into the mob roster. They do sometimes have a say in the draft but not much in trades unless it's a money issue.

 

[Jatt]

How has that worked out for the Raptors to date?

Are you joking?

 

[Muston Atthews]

And in the process lost one of Baseball's best young minds.

I don't see why fans should be happy with losing the baseball guy to appease the business types of the organization.

AA is essentially choosing unelploymenr for a full year (at least not being to work as a manager) rather than having five years worth of job security.

This tells me something is seriously rotten in the Blue Jays management/ownership structure.

Or that AA's ego got to him.

Why do you trust him? Consistent .400 seasons from 2008-2010 as a GM after a successful ALCS run? How about the consistent .500/.400 seasons with only 1 Wild Card appearance in 2013 (in a game that they LOST, so technically they didn't even make the postseason) before ******** the bed again with .400 season after season as the President?

Boy, I'd definitely trust him with such a riveting track record.

In what world does Shapiro have a better track record?

I trust him because, a) he hasn't even started yet, and Im always willing to give people a chance b) from reports around baseball, Shapiro is one of the sharpest minds in baseball. I never said he had a better track record than AA, but IIRC correctly the Indians and the Jays have a near identical record in the same time frame.

Because he wasnt offered HIS job. He was essentially offered to be Shapiro's assistant as Shapiro would have all final say.

An executive winning the award of the best executive on a day he leaves because his replacement was hired months before?

That's so 'Toronto Sports' it's not even funny. Actually it is funny, because if you couldn't find humor in this mess you'd be pretty depressed.

If you're going by that line of thinking, AA was Beeston's assistant. So really, the only thing that would change is Beeston to Shapiro and the trust not being there from the get go.

 

[theaub]

But he only had full control because Beeston gave it to him, not Rogers. From Rogers point of view, Beeston ran the team and AA worked for him.

I agree with that, but it would be ignorant from Rogers end to avoid the reality of the situation and think that AA would be OK with that change.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

You mean this season.

I dunno who's worse: Casey or gibbons! Raps will have to make past the 2nd round or else well see another rebuild. Bye bye demar!

 

[Tundra]

This team could be at a major crossroads after 2016. I don't mind this move at all.

 

[theaub]

Casey makes Gibbons look like Toe Blake

 

[BlueForever]

Gibby will be the next domino to fall with Francona being the replacement. Shapiro wants to bring in some of his own management level staff to work with AA

AA didn't want to make the moves to employees and hires of his. Decided to step away and let Shapiro do it on his own mission.

 

[Neil Patrick Harris]

you guys are so mad, yet shapiro has a much better track record

In that his team made the playoffs twice under his tenure as GM, rather than the once under ours.

A better track record doesn't necessarily mean a good track record.

 

[Gargyn]

Oh no?

Denver finished 57-25 that year, good for 2nd in the West, and then lost in the playoffs because they were a few pieces away.

Blue Jays finish at 93-69, good for second in the AL, and then lost in the playoffs because they're still a few pieces away.

I have no reason to trust Shapiro given how Cleveland has done **** all outside of one trip to the ALCS and a wild card in a 10 year span.

Edit: It should also be noted that Denver's new GM canned the reigning coach of the year. Something the new brass will likely repeat in dumping a solid manager in Gibbons.

So Shapiro had an alcs trip and a wild card showing, that's all...but AA had one alcs trip and yet he has shown more? Weird but OK.

 

[BlueForever]

In that his team made the playoffs twice under his tenure as GM, rather than the once under ours.

A better track record doesn't necessarily mean a good track record.

He's also won Executive of the year two times.

 

[Stand Witness]

Rogers should seriously take a step back from sports. They manage to ruin everything they touch.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Two first round exits. Next year will be a huge test for Masai but I'll give him credit for building a winner, unlike BC, who was garbage.

I wouldn't call the Raptors line up a winner. I love the Raptors and I'll admit I'm somewhat of a bandwagon fan. I got into it early into 2 seasons ago. But they've really proved nothing other than that they can choke with the best of them. Game 7 was an absolute joke on the officiating side so I'll give them that.

Are you joking?

What is there to joke about? Someone brought up Denver losing the Executive of the Year, who became the GM of the Raptors. Raptors have done **** all.

 

[BlueForever]

And Gibbons is not a solid manager. Give me a break.

 

[10coach*]

Shapiro did an excellent job of drafting for the Indians in the 90s

 

[Blitzkrug]

So Shapiro had an alcs trip and a wild card showing, that's all...but AA had one alcs trip and yet he has shown more? Weird but OK.

Wild Card game shouldn't even count. I'm sure the 98 win Pirates are happy with their "playoff" run

 

[Gargyn]

He's also won Executive of the year two times.

But...but...but I have a picture of Alex in my bedroom...geez people acting like we hired a nobody. Bunch of babies.

 

[Muston Atthews]

But he only had full control because Beeston gave it to him, not Rogers. From Rogers point of view, Beeston ran the team and AA worked for him.

Thankfully someone else gets this. The sky is falling routine is getting old.

 

[Epictetus]

Any good articles on Shapiro? I'd like to know more about he conducts trades, his baseball philosophy, the kinds of players he likes to target, track record, what others have to say, etc.

I only know he has spent an eternity with Cleveland and then decided to come to Toronto (still not sure why exactly).

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

Gibby will be the next domino to fall with Francona being the replacement. Shapiro wants to bring in some of his own management level staff to work with AA

AA didn't want to make the moves to employees and hires of his. Decided to step away and let Shapiro do it on his own mission.

Francona was the guy I've always wanted.

 

[Gargyn]

Wild Card game shouldn't even count. I'm sure the 98 win Pirates are happy with their "playoff" run

Still more than the blue jays did since 93 before this year.

 

[JS19]

I trust him because, a) he hasn't even started yet, and Im always willing to give people a chance b) from reports around baseball, Shapiro is one of the sharpest minds in baseball. I never said he had a better track record than AA, but IIRC correctly the Indians and the Jays have a near identical record in the same time frame.

a) So what? b) people get chances if their record proves they can do a high quality job, Shapiro has proven he can't at both the GM and President level, c) Just because people say he's the sharpest mind, doesn't mean it's true. The track record doesn't prove that at all. I never said that you said that Shapiro had better track record than AA, that comment was directed at someone else.

 

[Mad Brills*]

this thread is a gong show

 

[Muston Atthews]

Wild Card game shouldn't even count. I'm sure the 98 win Pirates are happy with their "playoff" run

That's your opinion, there's a lot of people in baseball and around here that would disagree with you. It's only "not the playoffs" when you're looking to discredit it and looking for negatives.

 

[Neil Patrick Harris]

So Shapiro had an alcs trip and a wild card showing, that's all...but AA had one alcs trip and yet he has shown more? Weird but OK.

That ALCS trip also came two years before AA was made GM, but that's besides the point I suppose.

He's also won Executive of the year two times.

Yeah, one of them a decade ago, and one of them nearly a decade ago.

Again, it's not hard to have a "better track record" when you've had far more time to work with.