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Prospect Info: Nils Lundkvist: Part II

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wolfgaze said:
???

Again, please point out where I said Fox was 'not good' defensively...

I would characterize the defensemen in the league who excel and are known for their defensive game (without the puck) as having a 'strong' defensive game... Am I ready to place Fox in his rookie year in the same category as the defensemen in the league who are known for and sought after for their defensive abilities? No... Not at this time... Where's the issue here exactly?

Do people think there are only two ways to categorize a player's game? Either they excel at something or are not good (weak/below average)? Dualistic (Black & White) type thinking?

I don't operate with that mindset...
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You're arguing semantics bud. I think most people will see "not strong defensively" and think "not good defensively", considering they're essentially synonyms in this particular statement. I certainly did, and I highly doubt I'm the only one.
 
aufheben said:
Leave 'em. DeAngelo-Trouba 2nd pair next year, make Lindgren-Fox the full-time first-pair.

I mean they can either shuffle the D, roll 7 defensemen, or trade the kid.
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Do we know if there were any practice reports from this season indicating that the coaching staff was experimenting with ADA on the left side? It would be real interesting to find out how seriously they have explored this option up until this point... If they haven't really given it a chance - then there is reason to be open minded about this potentially being a feasible (workable) outcome/solution to the log jam on the right side... However if they've already done some substantial experimenting with this during practices and didn't like what they observed or ADA didn't look nearly as comfortable and effective as he is when on the right side - then that paints a different picture moving forward...

I also suspect that the Rangers brass has a sense as to how 'smoothly' contract negotiations are likely to do with the aforementioned player and his agent. Not just for the next contract but also long term and approaching UFA...

If they can't move Trouba before his NTC kicks in (unlikely), and if there's little/no indication that moving one of ADA/Trouba to their off side is going to be feasible over the long haul - then this is only going to pave the way for ADA to be utilized as a trade chip to address other areas of the roster and organizational depth...

If the Rangers play hardball during the contract negotiations - I think that's our indication that they plan to pursue the trade route... If that's the plan, it would obviously be smart to keep his cap hit as low as possible, and to ensure that any team acquiring him will have the opportunity to re-negotiate another contract before he reaches UFA...
 
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wolfgaze said:
Do we know if there were any practice reports from this season indicating that the coaching staff was experimenting with ADA on the left side? It would be real interesting to find out how seriously they have explored this option up until this point... If they haven't really given it a chance - then there is reason to be open minded about this potentially being a feasible (workable) outcome/solution to the log jam on the right side... However if they've already done some substantial experimenting with this during practices and didn't like what they observed or ADA didn't look nearly as comfortable and effective as he is when on the right side - then that paints a different picture moving forward...

I also suspect that the Rangers brass has a sense as to how 'smoothly' contract negotiations are likely to do with the aforementioned player and his agent. Not just for the next contract but also long term and approaching UFA...

If they can't move Trouba before his NTC kicks in (unlikely), and if there's little/no indication that moving one of ADA/Trouba to their off side is going to be feasible over the long haul - then this is only going to pave the way for ADA to be utilized as a trade chip to address other areas of the roster and organizational depth...

If the Rangers play hardball during the contract negotiations - I think that's our indication that they plan to pursue the trade route... If that's the plan, it would obviously be smart to keep his cap hit as low as possible, and to ensure that any team acquiring him will have the opportunity to re-negotiate another contract before he reaches UFA...
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Well, right now there's no reason to do it. This is just in the future. I say if the players are fine with it, rock 'n' roll. Play 6 RHD for all I care.
 
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UnSandvich said:
You're arguing semantics bud. I think most people will see "not strong defensively" and think "not good defensively", considering they're essentially synonyms in this particular statement. I certainly did, and I highly doubt I'm the only one.
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I'm not arguing semantics, I'm telling/informing YOU how I actually used that word and what my actual intention was behind it.... Who knows better about my intention behind that post, you, or me? I said in the very next post I thought Fox was above average defensively.... Tell me why I would knowingly and intentionally contradict myself in back-to-back posts and without editing either post? I wouldn't....

Fox is not a defenseman (at this point) I would intentionally match up against other teams top forwards in a playoff environment and WHILE playing him with another offensive defenseman .... There's a reason why Fox pairs so well with Lindgren (not simply because of their limited playing time outside of the NHL), and why gifted offensive defensemen traditionally pair well with more defensive minded partners.... If you'd like to make the argument that a team should take their two most talented offensive defensemen and play them on the same pairing while requiring one to play his off-side and breaking up a previous pairing that had excellent chemistry - have at it, I'd be happy to have that debate with you...
 
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aufheben said:
Well, right now there's no reason to do it. This is just in the future. I say if the players are fine with it, rock 'n' roll. Play 6 RHD for all I care.
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But it's not just a matter of the players being willing to switch sides... They have to be as effective on their off-side as they are on their natural side... If they were to re-up ADA with any longer term contract, you're paying him for the production/performance/potential you observed when he was playing his natural side... If shifting him to LD reduces his effectiveness - then that's not a feasible work-around/solution and would reduce his trade value in any potential trade scenario... Same with Trouba, they are going to be paying him an AAV of $8 mil a year and we can't afford to play him in any role/position that's going to diminish/reduce his play or effectiveness...

Sure next year we can pretty much do whatever - but that won't be the case in subsequent years... Rangers brass may opt to strike while the iron is hot, and ADA's trade value likely couldn't be any higher...

If Lundkvist makes the team out of camp and quickly demonstrates he's able to play/think the game at this level - then I think we'll see this sorted out in the near future and before next season concludes...
 
wolfgaze said:
Issue: Neither are strong defensively and Fox has very good chemistry with Lindgren (why break that up?)....
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Fox is better defensively than DeAngelo. I’ll argue that point all day.

I’m not so sure I see a need to move anyone on the right side. Acquire a decent LD (e.g. Dillon or Scandella) better than Staal and Smith and preferably one who could be exposed a year from now in the expansion draft. Lundkvist can apprentice for a year in Hartford. Take another year to sort things out.
 
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bobbop said:
Fox is better defensively than DeAngelo. I’ll argue that point all day.

I’m not so sure I see a need to move anyone on the right side. Acquire a decent LD (e.g. Dillon or Scandella) better than Staal and Smith and preferably one who could be exposed a year from now in the expansion draft. Lundkvist can apprentice for a year in Hartford. Take another year to sort things out.
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Fox is going to be as good as McDonagh ever was within a year or two. Fox, Kakko, Shesterkin are the cornerstones.
 
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wolfgaze said:
Please find the post where I claimed Fox was 'not good defensively'? You can't, because I never made any such claim...




And this couldn't possibly have anything to do with the amazing chemistry that Fox and Lindgren have and with the play of Ryan Lindgren, could it? Nahh.... So we should take Lindgren off that pairing and put an offensive defenseman on that pairing who isn't very good in his own end... And this benefits the team how?



BS cop out? Is this your first year watching professional hockey? Matchups don't matter? Teams never give up goals late in the game when they've iced the puck after a long shift and the other team sends fresh players out on the ice?

Why are you even making this argument? Do you actually think it's a wise idea to take the team's two best offensive defensemen and play them together, when one has to play the off side, all while breaking up our defensive pairing that has displayed the best chemistry all season? Bizarro world...
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So you've gone from saying that Fox isn't a guy who can handle top line matchups to Fox is only crushing top line matchups because of his amazing chemistry with Lindgren. At least you're moving in the right direction...

You know Fox's numbers with DeAngelo are better than his ones with Lindgren right? If there is "amazing chemistry" with Lindgren and Fox, the hell do we call it with TDA and Fox?

Regardless, I'm not opposed to keeping Lindgren and Fox together and trying DeAngelo out on the left side with Trouba, but Lindgren is the type of player that Trouba needs playing with him more so than DeAngelo is.

Just take the L dude.
 
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TDA has looked better physically recently in the D zone. He’s always been shifty shaking off forecheckers with his skating and smarts and quick short passing. He’s started also taking the body more, bracing for hits in the corners while still managing to keep the puck moving to another Ranger player. He knows if he can finalize his D zone play only marginally more we’re talking Norris potential here and he’s really made a focus on it. No need to discuss his play in the O zone, it’s almost immaculate.

I’m excited for Nils to play in Hartford and get a cup of coffee with the big club some point next season due to injury. I think he’s got excellent 2 way potential and can eventually utilize that accurate bomb from the point on PP2 instead of Trouba’s ready-fire-aim howitzer
 
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haveandare said:
Has Trouba ever played the left? He has a big right shot he could use more from there and isn’t quite the breakout passer TDA or Fox is.
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I’m not comfortable with a shutdown defenseman playing his off-side. Figure he needs an easy way to clear the zone / get pucks without having to turn around. That’s partly why Staal on left and Girardi on the right worked so well.
 
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CasusBelli said:
I’m not comfortable with a shutdown defenseman playing his off-side. Figure he needs an easy way to clear the zone / get pucks without having to turn around. That’s partly why Staal on left and Girardi on the right worked so well.
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Yeah that’s a good point. Appealed to me mostly because it’d let him shoot more and his shot is underutilized.
 
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romba said:
TDA has looked better physically recently in the D zone. He’s always been shifty shaking off forecheckers with his skating and smarts and quick short passing. He’s started also taking the body more, bracing for hits in the corners while still managing to keep the puck moving to another Ranger player. He knows if he can finalize his D zone play only marginally more we’re talking Norris potential here and he’s really made a focus on it. No need to discuss his play in the O zone, it’s almost immaculate.

I’m excited for Nils to play in Hartford and get a cup of coffee with the big club some point next season due to injury. I think he’s got excellent 2 way potential and can eventually utilize that accurate bomb from the point on PP2 instead of Trouba’s ready-fire-aim howitzer
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Tony has done a great job refining his game and breaking out as an offensive star,

That said, the closest he will get to a Norris is visiting Fox’s house.
 
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haveandare said:
Yeah that’s a good point. Appealed to me mostly because it’d let him shoot more and his shot is underutilized.
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That one timer from the left point or left circle would be sick. Too bad he’d likely Buch the puck around the boards. :laugh:

He needs to work on his accuracy for sure.
 
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Leetch3 said:
I can see that preventing him from signing a PTO to come over to hartford this year but the ELC would start next year, not doubting that you are right just odd
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For a player to sign any contract that would have him transfer to another country, he needs written approval from the current national association (i.e. Sweden). The information below was sent to me by my contact in Luleå. The IIHF's transfer agreement which the NHL signed is enforced by the IIHF.

§206; “Players who wish to move from one country, irrespective of whether or not they are registered with the member national association of that country, to the member national association of another country are required to have a valid IIHF international transfer card (ITC). The ITC must be signed by the player, by the member national association of that country, by the new member national association and confirmed by the IIHF. The transfer becomes valid on the date it has been confirmed by the IIHF.”
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Amazing Kreiderman said:
For a player to sign any contract that would have him transfer to another country, he needs written approval from the current national association (i.e. Sweden). The information below was sent to me by my contact in Luleå. The IIHF's transfer agreement which the NHL signed is enforced by the IIHF.
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Yup, and as a rule, Svenska Ishockeyförbundet won't approve such a request before the national team coach has confirmed that a player will not be selected for the WCHs.

Also, one little tweak, this rule applies to the right to use a player in games. Its not forbidden per se to sign a contract. I know of a few examples when a player signed a contract and then pressured to get his ITC but it wasn't approved.
 
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