Proposal: Nils Hoglander for Brayden Schneider. Van/NYR

[elitepete]

I think with the Rangers looking for secondary scoring and Canucks RHD prospects both teams can help each other out. Hoglander is 20 and on his ELC. Schneider is a shutdown RHD Prospect that is tracking well.

Absolutely not.

 

[NYVanfan]

delete

 

[5cotland]

Lol give me a break Owen Power is being compared to Hedman. Hoglander is only 1 year older then the big rangers dman who was a mid 1st and is trending as expected. Hoglander has far exceeded expectations.

Schneider is progressing very nicely and is projecting to be a very solid NHL defensive if he keeps to his current trajectory. But can I ask you to look at NYR's right side and choose where Schneider could have slotted in this season? No reason to rush him.

Lundkvist has played well, took some time to settle but has been more comfortable and consistent over the last month or so.

As for Hoglander, he was a projected late 1st / early 2nd round pick with a middle 6 upside in the NHL. He is at this level so is on track and has done very well to hit this mark so soon but just needs to maintain it and look to improve on it. He has had this opportunity as the Nucks dont really have anyone who would really challenge him for a middle 6 spot.

Hoglander has done very well so far and Schnieder brewing nicely in his development. Both will be likely strong players in the leqgue at some point but you putting down Schnieder because he doesnt play in NHL is a bit of a poor take.

 

[5cotland]

Serious question but why are VAN fans so high on Schneider? I think he is a good prospect but I didn't think he was considered to be that good.

You need to look into him a little more ma guy. NYR love him and his current development. He is one of the top defensive prospects in the league atm.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

I’d still rather keep Hog and look to move one or more of the vets for something involving a young RH’ed d-man. I think part of why we could afford to move Miller/Boeser is because of Hogland and Podkolzin. I guess failing that this could be a fall back option.

It’s so hard with the cap and usually the teams who want the vets are contenders. Hoglander is like found gold for a team that has a good defensive prospect pool

 

[M2Beezy]

I think with the Rangers looking for secondary scoring and Canucks RHD prospects both teams can help each other out. Hoglander is 20 and on his ELC. Schneider is a shutdown RHD Prospect that is tracking well.

And Jim Rutherford laughs and IMMEDIATELY hangs up on this offer

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

id like Miller for Schneider & 1st, but dunno if NYR down

That isn’t enough value in my mind with his contract. The contract is worth more than the player. Same with Hogs

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

And Jim Rutherford laughs and IMMEDIATELY hangs up on this offer

No he doesn’t. It’s almost fair value only one has got to play due to a weaker roster.

 

[mriswith]

No from Canucks. We should be trading Miller and Horvat because we're not going to be contenders for the rest of their cheap years and primes.

If we trade Miller and Horvat then it doesn't make sense to also trade Hog.

Both will be likely strong players in the leqgue at some point but you putting down Schnieder because he doesnt play in NHL is a bit of a poor take.

I mean, most decent prospects look great in junior and everyone goes gaga over them in their D+1's.

It's when they go pro that you really see separation and prospect ceiling, and a substantial thinning of the herd.

This trade would need a significant plus coming to Van to compensate precisely for this. Hog is already a top 6 forward, his even strength scoring last season was among the best on the team and his point totals only don't look more garish because he wasn't on PP1 under Green.

Schneider, if he hits, will be a top 4 dman. That's an equitable player but you have to pay for the gap between proven vs potential. Either the potential has to be significantly higher than the proven player, or there has to be a significant plus.

 

[Peter Griffin]

It’s so hard with the cap and usually the teams who want the vets are contenders. Hoglander is like found gold for a team that has a good defensive prospect pool

Miller’s contract is very reasonable and if the Canucks were willing to retain there should be no team in the league that couldn’t fit him. Contract isn’t an issue in this case.

The Canucks have Miller, Horvat and Boeser who are all less than 2 seasons away from UFA. They likely can’t afford to retain all 3. That makes keeping Hoglander even more crucial.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Sign of a good trade. Nobody is happy on both ends.

 

[5cotland]

No from Canucks. We should be trading Miller and Horvat because we're not going to be contenders for the rest of their cheap years and primes.

If we trade Miller and Horvat then it doesn't make sense to also trade Hog.

I mean, most decent prospects look great in junior and everyone goes gaga over them in their D+1's.

It's when they go pro that you really see separation and prospect ceiling, and a substantial thinning of the herd.

This trade would need a significant plus coming to Van to compensate precisely for this. Hog is already a top 6 forward, his even strength scoring last season was among the best on the team and his point totals only don't look more garish because he wasn't on PP1 under Green.

Schneider, if he hits, will be a top 4 dman. That's an equitable player but you have to pay for the gap between proven vs potential. Either the potential has to be significantly higher than the proven player, or there has to be a significant plus.

Schneider is playing pro and has been excellent this season for Hartford. Like I said, his development has been great and will become a decent NHLr.

When it comes to players like Hoglander, he is not proven. He had a good rookie season and this season he has been OK. You see it all the time with young players, they have strong rookie years then they have OKish few years after that or they have a breakout year after 2/3 years in the league then they just settle and stagnate as middle 6 forwards.

Hoglander still young enough where there is plenty of time for him become proven but he is not at that stage where he would command a haul if he was traded.

 

[lawrence]

Hmmm can’t see both sides agreeing.

hogs is a nhl player already.

Schneider will be one.

Canucks needs is really beyond a right shot dman.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Hmmm can’t see both sides agreeing.

hogs is a nhl player already.

Schneider will be one.

Canucks needs is really beyond a right shot dman.

One step at a time. You always deal from a point of strength. NYR are deep on RHD and Van are deep on wingers. Easier to to fill a need with established Prospects/Players

 

[RangersFan1994]

Hog lander for Lundkvist?

Rangers call up Jones and Schneider to replace the 3rd pair.

 

[lawrence]

One step at a time. You always deal from a point of strength. NYR are deep on RHD and Van are deep on wingers. Easier to to fill a need with established Prospects/Players

hmmm deep on 3rd line plugs if ya know what i mean

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

hmmm deep on 3rd line plugs if ya know what i mean

Canucks have Boeser/Miller/Garland/Pettersson/ Hoglander on the wings on any given night. Far from garbage

 

[bernmeister]

No.
Hog is nice, but we have no one like Schneider anywhere else in our system with size/mobility/skill and nasty.
He likely breaks in on 3rd pair next season and hopefully takes over Trouba’s duties year or 2 after that.
Rangers will likely trade Lundkvist before Schneider seeing as Fox is here long term and we have Jones/Miller on the left side.
I’m pretty sure Drury considers Schneider a future cornerstone piece who will be cheap for a while. He had a solid camp as a kid, and if we weren’t flush with D prospects could have started this season with NYR.
Jones-Schneider are getting heavy 1st pair minutes in Hartford now and playing well.

Agree w/every word of this except
- hoping/guestimating NY can deal Trouba next season or one after in advance of his nmc ending
- at this pt Jones gets dealt before either of Nils or Schneider

Big, young, mobile RHD with upside. We don't have anything like that on our team, or in our pool. He is a good fit.

With Fox and Trouba signed for the the next 5+ years at $17+mil, Some feel that for the right price Schnieder may be available.

Hoglander has been very good in the NHL so far, and has a ton of upside. He is better than most who just stat watch would assume, he impacts most shifts he is on the ice positively, and rarely seems to make a bad play. Not sure he is quite enough to get this done though from a Rangers POV, and not sure I'd do it from a Canucks POV either, we need more guys like Hogs, not less.

Solid Post though OP.

kudos OP on legit value and good offer
just not a fit for NY

like bern says:
almost without exception, yes we have bluest blue chip elcs but only enuf for internal needs, not surplus available for trade.

id like Miller for Schneider & 1st, but dunno if NYR down

NO.
we discussed this other threads
1. We want our youth, no vet for youth rental splurge
2. Even if we want to have an open mind WE DO NOT HAVE ROOM for anyone next year after Zib + Fox raises.
3. The ONLY workaround for above item is something like Strome and small add for Miller [which we understand VAN can top, so no offer there] and then after the season we flip Miller just like we should be flipping Strome now.
However, if for any reason we are holding the bag, cap consequences will not be pretty so no, reward is not worth the risk.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Miller at 50% for Laff straight up work? I think NYR and Van make great trading partners on so many different levels

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

All in all I think and have preached that RHD first rounders pay their weight in gold. Schneider went 19th? Correct me Ranger fans

 

[jay from jersey]

Miller at 50% for Laff straight up work? I think NYR and Van make great trading partners on so many different levels

Rangers dont really want Miller back here. He’s seemed to have grown up more since we dealt him. The talent was always there, he had some good 50 plus pt years with us, but he had trouble being a pro according to AV.
I don’t know if it was the NY night life or just being too immature in general. Many of us had high hopes for miller when we drafted him and all thought we should have got more of a return when he was dealt as a 2nd piece.
Now that he’s older, 2 years from needing a nice raise, no one including our GM would likely pay the price for him to return, or at least the price nucks fans would want.
Who knows, maybe if he’s not traded to Tampa, he doesn’t get his head on straight. It might have been the best outcome for both, because the rangers weren’t giving him that contract he got here in the rebuild.
All are too important or will be too important to the team and have no other type of players in the system that possess their skill sets.
In Schneider’s case, I see the rangers trading Lundkvist, Robertson, Even Miller over him because he’s cost controlled huge mean and mobile and his offense is still an unknown. He moves the puck very well for a perceived stay at home D man with a mean streak.
You don’t trade a guy like him unless it’s gross overpayment. Especially when the only other player with similar size/skill/nasty is making 8 mill a year in trouba.
Hogs is a nice piece but NYR have Cuylle/Othmann/and Berard in the system already that could possibly make a similar impact in the future. No one to replace Schneider.

 

[mrmovies779]

Miller at 50% for Laff straight up work? I think NYR and Van make great trading partners on so many different levels

Lol serious?? Lol

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Rangers dont really want Miller back here. He’s seemed to have grown up more since we dealt him. The talent was always there, he had some good 50 plus pt years with us, but he had trouble being a pro according to AV.
I don’t know if it was the NY night life or just being too immature in general. Many of us had high hopes for miller when we drafted him and all thought we should have got more of a return when he was dealt as a 2nd piece.
Now that he’s older, 2 years from needing a nice raise, no one including our GM would likely pay the price for him to return, or at least the price nucks fans would want.
Who knows, maybe if he’s not traded to Tampa, he doesn’t get his head on straight. It might have been the best outcome for both, because the rangers weren’t giving him that contract he got here in the rebuild.
All are too important or will be too important to the team and have no other type of players in the system that possess their skill sets.
In Schneider’s case, I see the rangers trading Lundkvist, Robertson, Even Miller over him because he’s cost controlled huge mean and mobile and his offense is still an unknown. He moves the puck very well for a perceived stay at home D man with a mean streak.

He’s a different player. He wouldn’t have even signed his contract if he knew the outcome. He’s a top 5 skilled power forward on one of the best contracts in the league. Top 20’scorer and a playoff beast. Being tainted is the wrong approach

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Lol serious?? Lol

Is it? Would you trade 2 firsts and a second for him? Miller with his contract especially if we retain will get that all day. You think Laff is worth 3 firsts?

 

[jay from jersey]

He’s a different player. He wouldn’t have even signed his contract if he knew the outcome. He’s a top 5 skilled power forward on one of the best contracts in the league. Top 20’scorer and a playoff beast. Being tainted is the wrong approach

It’s just the reality of the situation. I don’t know how he and NYR parted ways, but they aren’t going to overpay to bring him back with him needing a new deal in 2 years time when we’re already against the cap.
If anything, I think you’d see Horvat to NYR before Miller at this point.
But that is going to run in to similar cap issues as well.