League News: NHL Talk - (News n' Scores n' Stuff) - 2022-23 season, Vol. 4, Off-season Edition
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CapitalsCupReality
It’s Go Time!!
- Feb 27, 2002
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Ovechkins Wodka
Registered User
I would be tempted to claim with all our injuries. Sounds like Carlson is done untill the playoffs atleast.
Alexander the Gr8
Registered User
I don’t think it’s a good idea based on his history with Lavi. They clearly didn’t see eye to eye, I don’t think he would rebound here.
He’s certainly been better than Vrana
Jakub Vrana Clears Waivers
Jan 4: The Red Wings' gamble has paid off, as Vrana cleared waivers and has been assigned to the Grand Rapids …www.prohockeyrumors.com
Mantha has been fine for us? Really?
For the system that Lavi is employing, yes. He was injured and had some poor puck luck which has suppressed his production and he certainly has games where you wonder if he and Greenie were on the marijuanas before puck drop but he’s been a solid middle six winger here. Not as good as Vrana offensively but he’s a better two-way player.Jakub Vrana Clears Waivers
Jan 4: The Red Wings' gamble has paid off, as Vrana cleared waivers and has been assigned to the Grand Rapids …
Mantha has been fine for us? Really?
Vrana is undoubtedly the more explosive and dynamic player but there’s something he seems to be battling. He was kicked off the Czech national team and the coach publicly lit him up with his comments as he threw him out the door, he was scratched and fell out of favor with all of Trotz, Rierden, and Lavi, and now he’s been placed on waivers by Detroit. I hope Jake can figure it out because he seems like a good kid and he’s a ton of fun to watch on the ice but he’s running out of chances to get his career going on the right path.
No chance. He’s scheduled to make $5.7M this and next year, they already have too many NHL forwards on the roster, BMac had some not so nice things to say about his attitude when discussing why he traded him, he’s played 30 games over the past two years, and if there isn’t some kind of handshake agreement among the other GMs not to claim him, some team like Chicago or Arizona could claim him and either get a top six forward for free or flip him for assets this or next season. Washington is 22nd in the waiver order — no shot he makes it to them.
I understand the temptation, he's still got great potential. For that reason I suspect a rebuilding team will grab him.
However I'd rather the Caps use the space to address something else. We don't need anymore wingers.
Not to add to the speculation, but Jake scrubbed his social media of anything Red Wings, so there may be something messy going on over there...
PlushMinus
Registered User
- Nov 18, 2021
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If I was the Hawks I'm not sure I'd want to spend 5.7 mill on a guy who hasn't played at the NHL level for a while, and who may have any number of personal issues that caused him to be on the player assistance program in the first place. And it's really 3 times that since he's got 3 years left on his deal I believe?
If it was a million bucks then yeah, they might roll the dice. But 5.7 is a lot of dough.
I saw that as well but apparently he did that when he entered player assistance program (as opposed to after being put on waivers). So it might not be quite so "messy". Too bad we can't get some inside goss on what the hell is going on tho!
CapitalsCupReality
It’s Go Time!!
- Feb 27, 2002
- 67,762
- 22,980
Jags
Mildly Disturbed
Speculation over something like this is kinda dodgy, but I'm gonna float this out there because I kinda hope that this is what's going on...
Remember right before Jake went full-time with us, maybe the last time we sent him down to Hershey, and there was some kind of dustup where he left in the middle of a game or something like that? I don't remember clearly, but he definitely seemed pissed that he'd been sent down and did some acting out.
Remember back when Yzerman was with Tampa and had that showdown with Drouin? Sent him to Syracuse, he refused to report thinking Stevie would cave, and Yzerman basically told him to GTFO then?
So we know that Jake has a specific history of going nuclear when he's not given the NHL spot he thinks he deserves and that Yzerman has a specific history of telling a guy that does that to f*** himself.
I'll leave it at that. I hope it's something behavioral like that. 26 is old to still be acting that kind of immature, but at least there's a cure for being a shithead. Some of the other things it might be are tougher demons to slay, and that'd be a real shame.
Remember right before Jake went full-time with us, maybe the last time we sent him down to Hershey, and there was some kind of dustup where he left in the middle of a game or something like that? I don't remember clearly, but he definitely seemed pissed that he'd been sent down and did some acting out.
Remember back when Yzerman was with Tampa and had that showdown with Drouin? Sent him to Syracuse, he refused to report thinking Stevie would cave, and Yzerman basically told him to GTFO then?
So we know that Jake has a specific history of going nuclear when he's not given the NHL spot he thinks he deserves and that Yzerman has a specific history of telling a guy that does that to f*** himself.
I'll leave it at that. I hope it's something behavioral like that. 26 is old to still be acting that kind of immature, but at least there's a cure for being a shithead. Some of the other things it might be are tougher demons to slay, and that'd be a real shame.
Hivemind
We're Touched
Vrana reported to Grand Rapids and played in all 3 conditioning stint games. Doesn't seem to fit the pattern you're suggesting with the Drouin comparison.
Jags
Mildly Disturbed
Except he's playing like shit, lotsa chatter about him dogging it. What I said was in no way a comparison between Vrana and Drouin. Him dogging his AHL assignment is just like him dogging that stint in Hershey. And Yzerman kicking him to the curb is at least somewhat akin to Yzerman handling Drouin the way he did.
No one compared Vrana to Drouin.
Hivemind
We're Touched
What "chatter" about him "dogging it?" From random fans? Nobody in the know (which seems to be about zero people who are willing to talk publicly) has said anything of the sort. He hasn't played hockey since October, did you expect him to immediately return and dominate (although he did tally seven shots in his latest AHL game, so things were beginning to turn around)?
All we know are these two short quotes from Lalonde, very little of which aligns with the speculation you're putting forth.
Per that quote, Yzerman asked Vrana what he wanted to do, and Vrana said he wanted to get more touches in the AHL. Which is the opposite of what you're saying.
Until a reporter comes forth with more information regarding why Vrana entered the Player Assistance Program, it's useless to speculate. And given that it's now resulted in NHL roster changes, it's only a matter of time before something comes to light.
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Pretty crappy night on the out of town scoreboard. The Rangers beat Carolina, the Islanders beat Vancouver, Florida beat Arizona, and Ottawa beat Columbus. The loser point helped but every other team in the Eastern playoff hunt got two points.
Jags
Mildly Disturbed
So you just kinda felt like arguing last night, huh?
I speculated, pointing to something else it could be that would be far less tragic than some of the alternatives. I made it clear that the only reason I brought it up is that I hope it's something behavioral and not something more insidious. "Hey, wouldn't it be good if these two just don't get along and maybe Jake's okay otherwise?" That kind of thing.
I didn't say that was definitely what was going on. And despite the peachy quotes, they waived him the next day with zero cap concerns and plenty of other ways to fit Fabbri back in. All I'm saying is that there's definitely something else going on there, and I hope it's something other than Jake being sick. Maybe ease up a bit.
CapitalsCupReality
It’s Go Time!!
- Feb 27, 2002
- 67,762
- 22,980
Lol….from our friends in Detroit….
Hivemind
We're Touched
Nah man, you aren't the only one I've pushed back against regarding speculation here. Speculation doesn't help anyone. Nor do I really buy the "I was doing it because I hope he's not sick" angle, considering your alternative theory is that he's an entitled brat who willingly self-destructed his comeback attempt in a pissing match with a general manager. You see how a "hey guys, it might not be that illness with heavy social stigma you're thinking of, he might just be a complete asshole" response doesn't exactly read as sympathetic or controlling the speculation?
Once again, the NHLPA PAP can be for any number of issues. To use a player that was already brought up in this conversation, Jonathan Drouin was in the PAP for insomnia in 2021. All we know now is that Vrana refused to comment on why he was in PAP when asked after a Wings practice, and that Lalonde today repeatedly used phrases like "private" and "personal" today when discussing it. Until a reporter digs up more, speculation only adds fuel to the fire.
Jags
Mildly Disturbed
I wasn't trying to be sympathetic, and the only speculation I was controlling was my own. Your morality policing doesn't move me.
If some facts turn up and they're sad, I'll have all the sympathy for him that I can muster. I'm not into schadenfreude, and have said since he was traded that I hope things work out for him. I still feel that way.
A thought occurred to me and I shared it. You misread it, chastised me for being wrong, reread it once your error was pointed out to you, then chastised me for being mean. I'm sorry that my stating some facts to cite current similarities offended your sensibilities.
If you personally don't want to speculate, don't. But you're burning a lot of calories pointing out that it could be anything else; that it need not be any of these terrible or mean things. He might just be sleepy. And you're right. He might be. That would be nice. That's all speculative, mind you, but I guess I made you do it, so shame on me.
However, your insistence that everyone else throw out their own reason and etiquette and use yours instead is a little presumptuous. I stand by what I said. Sorry if it bugs you.
Hivemind
We're Touched
I wasn't wrong, nor was I calling you mean. You went out there with some hot bullshit speculation that didn't even come close to matching what had been said publicly. I called you out on that, the same way I've called out other posters for speculation on the mains and the same way I prefaced this whole conversation yesterday by reminding folks that the PAP can be used for a wide variety of reasons.
Pointing out other historical uses of PAP is not speculation. It's demonstrating that the PAP program is used for a large number of different types of situations, beyond the couple that are most frequently associated with it in the public's eye.
The mods over at HFWings had the best sentiment back when Vrana disappeared from the roster in October. Essentially "you can speculate, but keep it to yourself." Just because you have a thought doesn't mean you need to share it.
Czechia tied it with 30 seconds left in regulation then won it with less than a minute left in OT. Another brutal medal round loss for the Swedes.
US all over Canada early and they have a deserved 1-0 lead. Maybe this PP will spark the home team.
US all over Canada early and they have a deserved 1-0 lead. Maybe this PP will spark the home team.
Canada storms back with four unanswered but the US got completely and totally f***ed. They tied it up 3-3 but it was overturned on a joke of a goaltender interference review.
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