NHL.com Trophy Tracker - Hart Trophy

[authentic]

A division with Florida, Tampa, Toronto and Boston is much, much better than whatever division the Oilers played in.

He dunked on McDavid because 60 goals in 73 games is more impressive than ANYTHING McDavid has done this year.

Leafs didn't have the best goaltending this year in huge stretches, so that's why Matthews was on for more goals against, but just look at their defensive metrics.

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On top of this Matthews stats against the best teams and head to head with McDavid are better than McDavid’s dating back to last season. It’s actually McDavid that feasted on all the worst opponents last year then had a goose egg in 3 head to head games with Matthews.

 

[X66]

60 goals in 73 games

That slaps anything McDavid has done this year right in the face.

Get that through your head everyone.

Then you add that Matthews is an elite defensive center.

Then you add his team finished much higher than the Oilers.

McDavid is about to get dunked on for the Hart.

 

[CokenoPepsi]

LOL. No.

Lol, yes.

Oilers barely made the playoffs this year while the Leafs have been in the whole time.

Leafs are farrr more stacked it not close.

If it were a true MVP award it McDavid and not close...but voters generally don't vote that way.

 

[authentic]

Take Matthews off Leafs they are a playoff team.

Take McDavid off Oilers they are fighting for 1st overall

The award doesn’t go to the player on the worst team though

 

[Perfect_Drug]

Lol, yes.

Oilers barely made the playoffs this year while the Leafs have been in the whole time.

Leafs are farrr more stacked it not close.

If it were a true MVP award it McDavid and not close...but voters generally don't vote that way.

That's one narrative yes.

The other is that the Oilers have 100 points, comfortably sitting in 2nd.

And the East just has 8 atrocious teams to compile wins against.



Don't get me wrong, IMHO Matthews is the runaway favorite to win the Hart, but the hyperbole is really strange to read, considering most Oiler fans agree this was a pedestrian year for McDavid by his own standards.


"Ho-hum, feeling cute, I think I might go and win another Art Ross or something".

 

[Arpeggio]

lol leagues need to come up with some concrete criteria for MVP trophies. We have fans in this thread shitting all over their own teams to try to justify that their player is the MVP. Quality of team shouldn't matter, if you want to eliminate players that don't make the playoffs, fine. Put a value on goals, a value on assists, add them up and call it a day.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

That's one narrative yes.

The other is that the Oilers have 100 points, comfortably sitting in 2nd.

And the East just has 8 atrocious teams to compile wins and goals with.



Don't get me wrong, IMHO Matthews is the runaway favorite to win the Hart, but the hyperbole is really strange to read, considering most Oiler fans agree this was a pedestrian year for McDavid by his own standards.


"Ho-hum, feeling cute, I think I might go and win another Art Ross or something".

Tough crowd if McDavid setting his career highs in goals, assists and points this year = "pedestrian"

 

[Perfect_Drug]

Tough crowd if McDavid setting his career highs in goals, assists and points this year = "pedestrian"

Yeah. Strange how we're seeing him get points, but not really control the games.
He's been invisible a lot of games this year, even went through several slumps.

Considering how we've had a massive influx of 100-point players this year, it's like they all narrowed the gap on him, rather than him blowing the lid off of a more offense-oriented league.


Maybe we were expecting him to flirt with 150, so 122 is sorta meh. He's beating the 2nd place player by 7 points, whereas last year the non-Draisaitl highest point getter was 36 points behind him in 56 games.

We were expecting a continuation of that super-nova McDavid.

 

[Future]

What amazes me about part of his defensive play is Matthews actually leads the ENTIRE NHL in takeaways with 92 (in just 73 games, nonetheless).

Among just forwards, he has a whopping 20 takeaways more than the next leading forward.

Why people gloss over this stat as a key defensive metric blows my mind. Takeaways are effectively steals in Basketball, which are enormously valuable. Any time you can force a turnover and a change of possession you’re making an impact. To my mind, outside of some of the more advanced stats, this is the most important defensive metric.

 

[Oscar The Grouch]

Then you add that Matthews is an elite defensive center.

That narrative was Dec 2021. It's obsolete. Remember? It was replaced by the Hart narrative.

I've watched Matthews blow his coverage on enough big goals to not believe it.

It seems like the end goal is for the Leafs to get an award this year. Lots of players have huge years and don't win the Hart. There is a massive sense of entitlement in the Toronto market which seems to assume that if a Leaf had a huge year, he must get an award.

 

[TheDoldrums]

It seems like the end goal is for the Leafs to get an award this year. Lots of players have huge years and don't win the Hart. There is a massive sense of entitlement in the Toronto market which seems to assume that if a Leaf had a huge year, he must get an award.

username checks out.

Matthews had a huge year last year btw. He finished 2nd for the Hart. I don't remember any entitlement or expectation he would win.

 

[onetweasy]

Hate to break it to the Oilers fans here, and feel free to bump this if it's proven wrong...

But Matthews dunked on McDavid this year. That's not to say he's a better player, he was just better this year.

This is what the voters will look at...

Where the teams finished, the Leafs had a way better record in much tougher division.

50 goals in 50 games

60 goals in a season

Better even strength production, similar overall production. I think pro-rated Matthews would have 10 less points than McDavid, despite playing way less minutes, and that's where the 60 goals factor in bigger.

And obviously, lets not even mention defensive play, where Matthews crushes him.

Again, this is only for this season, obviously McDavid is the best player starting again next year, but this year it's easily Matthews.

Sorry but saying he got "dunked on" and then spending the your post talking about pro-rated production stats and your opinion about the defensive side of their games is a pretty shitty dunk....

Also this defensive juggernaut myth really needs to stop. Unless people really want to believe takeaways is more important than goals against......

 

[Holymakinaw]

Lol, yes.

Oilers barely made the playoffs this year while the Leafs have been in the whole time.

Leafs are farrr more stacked it not close.

If it were a true MVP award it McDavid and not close...but voters generally don't vote that way.

Again, no. You can 'say' anything you like, but that don't make it the truth. Over the long haul, Toronto would be in crap shape without Matthews. But we'll never know for sure because even though I 'say that', there's no way to know for sure, as it didn't happen for either Toronto or Edmonton.

Besides, if we're basing the award strictly on most valuable to their team.......which the Hart Trophy hasn't been based on for a good decade now.......then Gaudreau or Josi beats McDavid & Matthews easily anyway.

 

[Frank the Tank]

The 2021-22 NHLPA Players Poll is a rout for McDavid. It's probably the best indicator of Lindsay Award voting we have at this point.

 

[The90]

Well said. I would add that his numbers don't tell the whole story with regard to his defensive play. This won't be a popular opinion around here, but just watch Matthews actually play in his own end - inside his own blue line - and you'll see a player that consistently has lapses and missed assignments, and is rarely the first forward back....all of which are even worse given that he is a center. His takeaways mostly happen in the neutral zone, but rarely inside his own blue line, as he is often late back and chasing the play.

He's having a heck of a year offensively and I have no issues with him winning the Hart, as he has been such a dominant force offensively. But this narrative that he is a 200 foot player is, in my opinion, misleading and misguided. He is a fantastic 130 ft player.

Your description of Matthews play in the defensive zone and back checking is…. Bad, at best. It literally proves that you don’t and I use your own words ‘just watch Matthews actually play’. He’s a hound on the puck offensively and defensively. He strips more pucks catching people on the backcheck than just about any player in the league. Really bizarre takes here.

 

[The90]

You have absolutely no clue what you’re talking about. None.

I’ve watched just about every game this year and your characterization of his game couldn’t be more false.

I had to reread his post to make sure it wasn’t sarcasm lol

 

[CokenoPepsi]

Again, no. You can 'say' anything you like, but that don't make it the truth. Over the long haul, Toronto would be in crap shape without Matthews. But we'll never know for sure because even though I 'say that', there's no way to know for sure, as it didn't happen for either Toronto or Edmonton.

Besides, if we're basing the award strictly on most valuable to their team.......which the Hart Trophy hasn't been based on for a good decade now.......then Gaudreau or Josi beats McDavid & Matthews easily anyway.

Yes that I agree with, there are quite a few more players deserving of the Hart over Matthews

 

[Morbo]

Well said. I would add that his numbers don't tell the whole story with regard to his defensive play. This won't be a popular opinion around here, but just watch Matthews actually play in his own end - inside his own blue line - and you'll see a player that consistently has lapses and missed assignments, and is rarely the first forward back....all of which are even worse given that he is a center. His takeaways mostly happen in the neutral zone, but rarely inside his own blue line, as he is often late back and chasing the play.

I mean, this is just a flat out lie.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

60 goals in 73 games

That slaps anything McDavid has done this year right in the face.

Get that through your head everyone.

Then you add that Matthews is an elite defensive center.

Then you add his team finished much higher than the Oilers.

McDavid is about to get dunked on for the Hart.

when Stamkos hit 60, he didn't win the Hart

someone who's 37th in the league in assists should not be a Hart winner

McDavid is in the top 10 for both goals and assists

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Hart incoming for mvpapi whoooohoooooo

 

[authentic]

Why people gloss over this stat as a key defensive metric blows my mind. Takeaways are effectively steals in Basketball, which are enormously valuable. Any time you can force a turnover and a change of possession you’re making an impact. To my mind, outside of some of the more advanced stats, this is the most important defensive metric.

Also it's his takeaway to giveaway ratio that stands out which is the most important part.

At 5v5

Matthews - 80 takeaways 39 giveaways 53 blocked shots 70.77 xGF 39.96xGA 193 HDCA .885oiSV%

McDavid - 65 takeaways 47 giveaways 25 blocked shots 76.73xGF 52.65xGA 243 HDCA .923oiSV%

It's pretty obvious who the better two-way player is even if McDavid has improved the defensive part of his game this season.

 

[AgeIess]

The 2021-22 NHLPA Players Poll is a rout for McDavid. It's probably the best indicator of Lindsay Award voting we have at this point.

I found this interesting considering it's coming from the players themselves. Matthews not even top 5 in their "complete player" opinions despite what Leaf fans have been rambling about.

 

[The90]

Yeah but it's not a real 50 in 50, it's a hot stretch

Lets look at the last time someone scored 60...2012

Stamkos scored 60, winning the Rocket by 10 over Malkin. He was 12 pts behind Malkin in the Ross race (109 vs 97). Pretty much the same set up as Matthews and McDavid this year.

Malkin ran away with the Hart with 144 1st place votes to Stamkos's 1. Obviously you have to factor in the "Malkin carried Pitt with Crosby out" narrative, so this year is certainly more of a coin flip.

He did score 50 real goals over a real 50 game stretch in the season though, correct?

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

I found this interesting considering it's coming from the players themselves. No sign of Matthews despite what Leaf fans have been rambling about.

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But but....Matthews' takeaways!

the players know who's better and it's always been McDavid

 

[X66]

when Stamkos hit 60, he didn't win the Hart

someone who's 37th in the league in assists should not be a Hart winner

McDavid is in the top 10 for both goals and assists

What was the Lightning's record when he hit 60?