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NHL.com Trophy Tracker - Hart Trophy

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McFlash97 said:
He blows your boy away... it sucks to have a 60 goal scorer and still look up to greatness.

It's ok bud.
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Buddy McDavid doesn’t even know you exist or give a shit about you. Your life literally revolves defending another man online and trashing another.

There’s arguments for both players. Get real.
 
McFlash97 said:
He blows your boy away... it sucks to have a 60 goal scorer and still look up to greatness.

It's ok bud.
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Enjoy the copium man. Your boy McDavid is not going to win the Hart or Lindsay this year. It will be better to accept it now. Whether it's voter fatigue, narratives or Matthews generational goal scoring year. McDavid is not winning the hart or lindsay this year.
 
Spawn said:
Who cares when the actual numbers show that Matthews "elite defensive play" isn't actually contributing to preventing GA?
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Lol maybe if you understand what goaltending is..

matthews is one of the very best defensive players in the world
 
Subbanned said:
Sorry honey, wouldn't change the fact that McDavid gets significantly more ice than Matthews. P/60, time on PP etc illustrates quite clearly....Matthews MVP AINEC

Matthews
Gaudreau
Huberdeau/McDavid/Shesterkin (goalies are hard to value unfort, works against Igor)
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Does this not then immediately mean in the spirit of the Hart criteria, McDavid should get it? I mean, the most valuable player to his team would likely be more heavily leveraged, no?

Think you should pick a new argument.
 
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wetcoast said:
Yes everyone knows the answer because he simply had an off down year and it was his second such performance in a row, heck the entire Flames team was a huge question mark going into this season.
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It's almost like having to carry around two 4th line players is detrimental to a player's production.
 
CantHaveTkachev said:
LOL
maybe if Matthews was elite he'd get more secondary assists
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People seem to forget there is more to potting goals someone else usually did most of the work to get.

That said, both McDavid and Matthews are deserving....but this is getting ridiculous lol
 
allhaildraisaitl said:
Saying Matthews is elite defensively is like saying a 50 point scorer is elite offensively because advanced stats say so.
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Matthews is not elite defensively but he is above average and better than both McDavid and Draisatl defensively. He is a master at takeaways and sticklifts, good at blocking shots and okay at defensive positioning.
 
IPS said:
Lol maybe if you understand what goaltending is..

matthews is one of the very best defensive players in the world
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How can you make the argument in a debate about MVP that a players defensive contributions, that don't actually contribute to preventing GA, is somehow important when determining who is a more valuable player?
 
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MapleLeafs77 said:
It’s pretty simple:
1. Matthews has 16 more goals than McDavid.
2. McDavid has 16 more points than Matthews.
3. Matthews has played 6 fewer games than McDavid.
4. Matthews is just flat out a much better defensively than McDavid and is one of the best in the league.
5. Currently have the exact same amount of even strength points.

It comes down to what’s better? 16 more goals with defensive play and one of three only players to get 60 goals post cap era VS. 16 more points with over 120 points so far
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Well that’s certainly simple.
You left out a few facts though in your rush to boost your boy:
1. Matthews plays with a top 10 scorer in Marner at ES. McDavid plays with Hyman and Puljaarvi at ES.
2. There is no consensus that Matthews is better defensively.
3. McDavid participates in a much higher percentage of his teams goals than Matthews.
4. Matthews plays on a much stronger team than McDavid. In fact when Matthews missed games the Leafs didn’t miss him.

There. That’s less simple but more balanced.
 
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snag said:
Does this not then immediately mean in the spirit of the Hart criteria, McDavid should get it? I mean, the most valuable player to his team would likely be more heavily leveraged, no?

Think you should pick a new argument.
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Oh no seems like you misunderstood the argument he is playing more ice time and scoring less relatively to said ice time, Matthews is more valuable to his team AINEC, especially considering two-way play on top of scoring rates
 
Bear of Good News said:
How do their defensive advanced stats match up?
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Does the nhl count advanced stats in the game score which corresponds to points…. No…. End of the day real goals for and against count. If we are giving Matthews mystery points for missed games, advanced stats,etc… why aren’t we doing the same for Connor?

Let’s give him an extra 30 points for career low on ice shooting percentage, another 20 points for when tippet stopped coaching…sure. Matthews can finish with 116 mystery points prorated and McDavid with 170 mystery points.

Also if he is so valuable compared to Connor why does Connor have 43.26% of Team goals and Matthews has 34.19% of Team goals? While being and worse plus minus on a better team?

Toronto media giant has been pushing the narrative so I’m sure he will probably win.
 
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WetcoastOrca said:
Lol. Maybe on the HF Leafs Board.
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Wouldn't know, why would I be there? But I think your lack of a direct response makes the reality clear as day - you won't find a single third party hockey expert/journalist/analyst that says McDavid is better than Matthews defensively.

Like...LOL
 
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Kamus said:
Does the nhl count advanced stats in the game score which corresponds to points…. No…. End of the day real goals for and against count. If we are giving Matthews mystery points for missed games, advanced stats,etc… why aren’t we doing the same for Connor?

Let’s give him an extra 30 points for career low on ice shooting percentage, another 20 points for when tippet stopped coaching…sure. Matthews can finish with 116 mystery points prorated and McDavid with 170 mystery points.

Also if he is so valuable compared to Connor why does Connor have 43.26% of Team goals and Matthews has 34.19% of Team goals? While being and worse plus minus on a better team?

Toronto media giant has been pushing the narrative so I’m sure he will probably win.
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Sir, this is a Wendy's.
 
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Subbanned said:
Oh no seems like you misunderstood the argument he is playing more ice time and scoring less relatively to said ice time, Matthews is more valuable to his team AINEC, especially considering two-way play on top of scoring rates
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And why is he playing more?
 
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I feel like both fanbases (Oilers and Leafs) are out to lunch if they think their guy is clear and cut. I would say 2-3 other players are also in the mix. This is a weird year, a lot of players actually deserve MVP for different reasons, nobody is able to predict who will win, and as an outside observer, I love it.
 
Subbanned said:
Wouldn't know, why would I be there? But I think your lack of a direct response makes the reality clear as day - you won't find a single third party hockey expert/journalist/analyst that says McDavid is better than Matthews defensively.

Like...LOL
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In respectable hockey circles it’s unanimously agreed that Matthews is far superior to McDavid defensively.
 
Bear of Good News said:
I feel like the phrase "elite defensive play" is being thrown around a little too liberally from both sides. Lets not pretend that either are a Datsyuk, Bergeron, Kopitar, Toews, etc. Above average might be the phrase you're looking for.
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Matthews is definitely in the mix with those players. If one doesn’t know how to separate goaltending from the equation them that’s their own ignorance.
 
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