NHL.com ranks top 20 centers

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

Lmao they forgot Scheifele who is at least 18 on that list.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Literally no one ever said that. Stop being dense.

“Barlow may not have the same offense, but head to head he dominated McDavid”

You take a wild guess what he’s implying here big fella.

Is that what you got from what I said?

It’s a question?

Do you consider Malkin also highly overrated?

Because everything you said could be applied to him as well

 

[Spargon]

They’ve already made clear that they don’t care about the playoffs

You and others like you only care so much about playoffs because you have zero areas to shit on Matthews for anything else. "He's not a x goal or x point scorer" Well now he has the most goals in a season in 30 years and scoring 100pts a year, leading the league in blocked shots and gets Selke votes while leading his team to the playoffs each year he's been in the league after the Leafs had made it once in 10 years.

I wonder what the new measure will suddenly be should Matthews go on a big playoff run and win say a Conn Smythe and cup. Unlikely as it is, it would be fun to watch your head spin trying to find a new schtick to not give him credit because he plays for the Leafs.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

You and others like you only care so much about playoffs because you have zero areas to shit on Matthews for anything else. "He's not a x goal or x point scorer" Well now he has the most goals in a season in 30 years and scoring 100pts a year, leading the league in blocked shots and gets Selke votes while leading his team to the playoffs each year he's been in the league after the Leafs had made it once in 10 years.

I wonder what the new measure will suddenly be should Matthews go on a big playoff run and win say a Conn Smythe and cup. Unlikely as it is, it would be fun to watch your head spin trying to find a new schtick to not give him credit because he plays for the Leafs.

All I got out of this is that I’m right and it makes you extremely upset

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Lmao they forgot Scheifele who is at least 18 on that list.

Scheifele is 30th in scoring among centers in the last two seasons while being a very poor defensive center. Hard to argue he's ahead of anyone other than Bedard on this list (and that's probably debatable).

He's behind Thompson, Kopitar, Eriksson Ek, Nelson, and Barzal in terms of guys deserving to be on this list IMO.

 

[NikolaTesla]

“Barlow may not have the same offense, but head to head he dominated McDavid”

You take a wild guess what he’s implying here big fella.


It’s a question?

Do you consider Malkin also highly overrated?

Because everything you said could be applied to him as well

Don't misquote me.

I said "most posters here overrate Drai" but you claim that I said "highly overrated"?

Why did you add "highly"? Don't be dishonest.

And your original question was "So Malkin was also never that great?", implying that's what I said about Drai. I said that people HERE overrate Drai. Hell just look at all the peoples outraged that Mattews is ahead of Drai on nhl.com list.

Fact is its very hard to judge centers playing behind a generational center. Yes Drai and Malkin are 2 perfect example. Malkin was great and he showed it during some period of times when Crosby was injured.

Draisatl didn't have much opportunities to prove its worth without McDavid because the latter wasn't as injured as often as Crosby. But until then we should assume that his production wouldn't be as high because of the reason I cited in my original post. Fact is teams game plan to shut down McDavid's line primarily, not Draisatl.

And yes I feel like Malkin was overrated on these boards as well. I've seen plenty of peoples saying that prime Malkin was better than Crosby, which I disagree with. That Doesn't mean that Malkin was never great as you try to dishonestly put in my mouth.

 

[FinlandPanther]

“Barlow may not have the same offense, but head to head he dominated McDavid”

You take a wild guess what he’s implying here big fella.


It’s a question?

Do you consider Malkin also highly overrated?

Because everything you said could be applied to him as well

I mean if you can’t read then I can’t help you.

 

[TheOrangeDesk]

Suzuki plays on a first line and is generally matched against first pairing defensemen.
Nico plays on second line and is generally matched against second pairing defensemen.

according to puckiq
Suzuki plays 42.6% of his ice time against elites, with 56.44% offensive zone start %
hischier plays 40.1% of his ice time against elites with 41.54 offensive zone start %


I'd say pretty similar minutes in terms of difficulty

 

[TheOrangeDesk]

And Journalists wonder why people question journalistic integrity.

ahhh yes a ranking of NHL centres by NHL.com is why right wing nuts think all journalists are corrupt.....

 

[TheOrangeDesk]

and not knowing where the defensive zone is.

I think he knows where the D zone is. his coach started him there 386 times for defensive zone face-offs. as opposed to Matthews coach, who only used him in that situation 303 times

 

[NikolaTesla]

according to puckiq
Suzuki plays 42.6% of his ice time against elites, with 56.44% offensive zone start %
hischier plays 40.1% of his ice time against elites with 41.54 offensive zone start %


I'd say pretty similar minutes in terms of difficulty

I know that, but Elites doesn't mean best shutdown lines. 1st lines are more likely to be matched against the opposing best shutdown lines than 2nd lines.

But yeah obviously Hischier and Suzuki are very close to each other when it comes to the best centers in the league.

 

[nbwingsfan]

I mean if you can’t read then I can’t help you.

You tell me what he’s implying by “Barkov dominated head to head”?

I’m curious what you think was meant by that

 

[dgibb10]

I know that, but Elites doesn't mean best shutdown lines. 1st lines are more likely to be matched against the opposing best shutdown lines than 2nd lines.

But yeah obviously Hischier and Suzuki are very close to each other when it comes to the best centers in the league.

It's not all that close.

Here are 2 players on ice results and individual production over the last 2 years

One is Nico Hischier in Even strength situations.
The other is Nick Suzuki in all situations (this includes nearly 600 minutes of power play time to try and help him even things up)

Player A

Player B

Guess who is who

 

[JianYang]

I making rankings is just splitting hairs for the most part.

I think grouping in tiers works better.

 

[FinlandPanther]

You tell me what he’s implying by “Barkov dominated head to head”?

I’m curious what you think was meant by that

It means that he neutralized Mcdavid. That doesn’t mean he is the BETTER player. Hope that helps

 

[Cake Eater]

Barkov may not have the same offensive numbers, but head-to-head, he's owned three of the four ahead of him in playoffs...and the fourth he's yet to meet in the post season.

How did Barkov own McDavid this year? It looked like he was injured out there he was so ineffective defensively in the finals.

 

[kranuck]

Bozo should be higher.

 

[StlBill]

I’m a homer, but Thomas is severely underrated. 80+ point #1 center who logs ice time against the best in the league. Last few years he’s been tasked with squaring off with McDavid & McKinnon, and neither have much on the scoresheet against him at all.

 

[Reality Czech]

Yeah Matthews is generational in the regular season and then a complete joke in the playoffs. He’s going to be a career LOSER.

Y'all sure got cocky after one championship and being irrelevant for most of the team's history.

 

[FinlandPanther]

Y'all sure got cocky after one championship and being irrelevant for most of the team's history.

That’s what happens when you win. You’re a Blues fan whiteknighting Toronto on a message board. Peak cringe. The Blues have 1 and Florida has 1. The blues have been in the league since Toronto’s cup drought has started lol

 

[HugeInTheShire]

Don't misquote me.

I said "most posters here overrate Drai" but you claim that I said "highly overrated"?

Why did you add "highly"? Don't be dishonest.

And your original question was "So Malkin was also never that great?", implying that's what I said about Drai. I said that people HERE overrate Drai. Hell just look at all the peoples outraged that Mattews is ahead of Drai on nhl.com list.

Fact is its very hard to judge centers playing behind a generational center. Yes Drai and Malkin are 2 perfect example. Malkin was great and he showed it during some period of times when Crosby was injured.

Draisatl didn't have much opportunities to prove its worth without McDavid because the latter wasn't as injured as often as Crosby. But until then we should assume that his production wouldn't be as high because of the reason I cited in my original post. Fact is teams game plan to shut down McDavid's line primarily, not Draisatl.

And yes I feel like Malkin was overrated on these boards as well. I've seen plenty of peoples saying that prime Malkin was better than Crosby, which I disagree with. That Doesn't mean that Malkin was never great as you try to dishonestly put in my mouth.

Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t Drai literally win a Hart trophy when McDavid was hurt?

 

[Golden_Jet]

I know that, but Elites doesn't mean best shutdown lines. 1st lines are more likely to be matched against the opposing best shutdown lines than 2nd lines.

But yeah obviously Hischier and Suzuki are very close to each other when it comes to the best centers in the league.

Coaches only get the line matchup they want half the time (at home)

 

[NikolaTesla]

It's not all that close.

Here are 2 players on ice results and individual production over the last 2 years

One is Nico Hischier in Even strength situations.
The other is Nick Suzuki in all situations (this includes nearly 600 minutes of power play time to try and help him even things up)

Player A
View attachment 903915View attachment 903916

Player B
View attachment 903917View attachment 903918

Guess who is who

Doesn't 2nd liners generally have better 5v5 numbers by not being matched against the best defensive lines? Also, Suzuki is playing in a bottom 5 team.

Coaches only get the line matchup they want half the time (at home)

I know that, but the visiting coach can still anticipate when the the home coach will put his first line, which is like 36% of the time.

Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t Drai literally win a Hart trophy when McDavid was hurt?

When McDavid was hurt for 18 out of 82 games? How many games did they not play together? That was indeed a great year by Draisatl though.

 

[dgibb10]

Doesn't 2nd liners generally have better 5v5 numbers by not being matched against the best defensive lines?


I know that, but the visiting coach can still anticipate when the the home coach will put his first line, which is like 40% of the time.


When McDavid was hurt for 18 out of 82 games? How many games did they not play together? That was indeed a great year by Draisatl though.

Any minor difference in QoC (this has been gone over), is cancelled out by offensive vs defensive deployment.

No other "2nd line center" is producing what Hischier does EV.

Not Leon Draisaitl, not JT Miller, not Barkov (the opponent is generally trying to shutdown the Tkachuk line).

 

[Golden_Jet]

I know that, but the visiting coach can still anticipate when the the home coach will put his first line, which is like 36% of the time.

How do you get 36% of the time, when 1/2 the time coach had no say on a whistled faceoff, and the rest are on the fly changes.

That seems like some kind of calculation to get 36%