Post-Game Talk: New York Rangers at Vegas Golden Knights - January 8

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Take out one of you best producers and you can’t put the puck in the net....

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

DD out.
Center depth should be
Mika
Hayes
Miller
Boo

That's also fine.

Whats the word on Hayes?

I didn't watch the 3rd period

 

[JohnC]

The team, to me, is just too much of the same thing. Obviously some of these guys are bigger or more physical than the rest and some are much faster than the others, or better defensively than others but, to me:

Miller, Kreider, Hayes, Vesey, Nash, Fast, Grabner, Nieves, Carey, McDonagh, Skjei, Staal, Holden, Smith

Are all damn near the same player. None of them can really pass. None of them really has hands. Miller and Vesey will make some nice moves in tight sometimes. Some of them have some wheels. Some are much better defensively than the rest. But overall we just have one flavor on this team.

Buch, Zucc, Ziba and Shattenkirk are the only ones who bring a different game. And honestly, Ziba and Shatty’s games aren’t that unique from the rest, they just have a bit more skill. And going a step further, even Buch and Zucc, who have the most actual stand out skill, end up playing like the rest of the guys so that they end up being less unique.

I don’t know if that’s a system thing or not. I certainly don’t like the system but I also do think it’s a personnel issue. Now, I think a lot of the players we have are good players. I think the issue isn’t with player quality but with sameness. So how do you make decisions of which of these very similar players to move on from and which to keep? What we need is a greater variety in our players skill sets that has some cohesion. All this sameness isn’t necessarily cohesive. It’s just bland. I have no suggestions on how to fix it. A guy like Chytil panning out would be big.

Sounds like the end of the Torts era. A group of players supposedly lacking skill hampered by a system that I’ve seen the Junior Rangers play during intermission at MSG dozens of times.

Take a shot every time you see the Rangers use a forechecker to fight for possession during a line change. You’ll be dead f***ing sober by the end of the game.

 

[RangerBoy]

I don't care what Vegas record is. We lost to an expansion team, in the middle of a heated playoff race, and I'm peeved.

They are not your typical expansion team. The Rangers should consider themselves fortunate to have gained the two points in Arizona thanks to Lundqvist standing on his head. The Capitals lost both games in Arizona and Las Vegas right before Christmas.

 

[RangerBoy]

That's also fine.

Whats the word on Hayes?

I didn't watch the 3rd period

Lower body injury. Hayes will re-evaluated by the Rangers doctors.

 

[silverfish]

Well at least @silverfish is back to posting in the game threads.

Be careful what you wish for.

 

[offdacrossbar]

i take 3 things from this game.

1. vegas is legit good. they play a structured, in your face style and its for real. they already play playoff hockey. i like that team and especially with MAF in net. he made some big stops late. good team.

2. our goaltending is our strength right now. pavs and hank as a tandem may be as good as any right now today.

3. we need an upgrade over rick nash sucking minutes and producing nothing. the guy is a black hole of production. he is where scoring goes to die a slow painful death.

alas his numbers the last 10 games

ZERO POINTS

enuf with the nash excuses and all the other bullshit. the guys a f***ing bum. period.

 

[Ori]

It`s easy to say that with Henrik in goal it would be an easy OT game, Pavelec weakness is he don`t move sideways fast enough with an obvious pass to the other side.

 

[Larrybiv]

This team will really struggle to reach the playoffs. A coach that should've been sacked months ago, an idiotic system, injuries, lack of players carrying their contracts, alot of road games coming up... it doesn't look pretty.

They can't score, they can't shoot with quality, they can't create traffic in front of the goalie, they can't defend, they can't keep the puck, they can't go through the neutral zone once they lose the lead... there are so many things that don't look good.

So, with all this said, how is it AV's fault? He has no choice in spreading out the minutes, or some of our better players may get burnt out/injured. Kreids isn't a world beater, but he is sorely missed. I agree that Buch should've been sitting out......he's been disinterested lately and it's unnaceptable. Disinterested now, means disinterested later. Straighten him out NOW, before it gets worse. In fact many need to be sat. He was the obvious choice.

 

[Larrybiv]

Is it wrong to say that this team is the least talented and skilled team in the metro?

No it may not be wrong, but if that is the case.......then why aren't we giving kudos to AV and his staff? Were we supposed to win the cup this year? We are def flawed, but so are other teams. It's just apparently astounding to me, how Vegas can look so good in their overall game. A bunch of players thrown together with basically no history with one another. Players playing for new contracts seem to be major motivation and an "us against the world" attitude. Those non believers. Lol.
What were Vegas Vegas odds to win the cup? Hmmmm.

 

[Ori]

I doubt Zucc was 100% healthy -2 game from flu, but I did not watch the full game.

 

[Larrybiv]

Uhhh which Metro team is less skilled???

Blue Jackets.....hard work (Torts) maybe equal talent, rely on BOB
Devils......look what 3 or 4 really good high end rookies will do and the resurrection of Schneider, but for how long?
Penguins.....way more talented but burnt out, me thinks. They want Bettman to get them that #1 pick
Carolina......probably more talented but way too young overall.
Islanders.....same as above, but are in "no man's land" and need to sign Taveras like yesterday to settle things down.
Flyers......a confused but talented team....probably more than Rangers but still have ???? as always with their goaltending.

 

[Larrybiv]

Playing Buchnevich wouldn't have made them play less hard but it might have gotten them a chance to score more than 1 goal.

I like Buch, but what has he done the last 10 games or so? I'm sorry, but I expect more from the kid. He has more talent than Carey on his pinky finger (sorry Carey). Literally invisible maybe one or 2 good plays a game, that didn't even produce a goal. Not suffice.

 

[NYR]

Man love? What the hell are you talking about? If you're asking for my personal opinion on Shattenkirk it's that he's not great in his own zone but what he brings in other aspects of his game makes up for it.

On this particular play, he's not at fault. My judgement isn't clouded by anything, I'm just looking at what happened. It's pretty clear that if you're putting that goal is Shattenkirk's fault then you're the one with clouded judgement.

I'm just being a wise ass but as far as the play goes,

That play would've never materialized if #22 was where he was supposed to be.
He needs to stop that play at the first point of contact and that's the blue line.
He offered zero resistance.
Yeah, he skated with his man all the way in but he never even so much as to put a glove or stick on him.
Maybe go down to block the pass?? Not likely either.
It's a very basic play and #22 should've prevented that particular goal so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[NYR]

I love Skjei but the guy could egg Mike Richter's house and no one would bat an eye.

Same can be said for #22

 

[NYR]

Wait were we watching the same game? I saw a blown coverage by 3 forwards and 1 dmen who wasn’t wearing 22....

Watch it again..

 

[will1066]

The collective group is looking like early in the season, without confidence and drive. Still, I thought last night was much better than Arizona. The league has caught up or surpassed us in terms of playing the high-tempo style we used to be lauded for. We're getting burned on transition. One stretch pass or two quick passes and we're all caught.

 

[LeetchisGod]

i take 3 things from this game.

1. vegas is legit good. they play a structured, in your face style and its for real. they already play playoff hockey. i like that team and especially with MAF in net. he made some big stops late. good team.

2. our goaltending is our strength right now. pavs and hank as a tandem may be as good as any right now today.

3. we need an upgrade over rick nash sucking minutes and producing nothing. the guy is a black hole of production. he is where scoring goes to die a slow painful death.

alas his numbers the last 10 games

ZERO POINTS

enuf with the nash excuses and all the other bull****. the guys a ****ing bum. period.

I have never seen more excuses for crappy play from one of our highest paid players.

 

[Mac n Gs]

I'm just being a wise ass but as far as the play goes,

That play would've never materialized if #22 was where he was supposed to be.
He needs to stop that play at the first point of contact and that's the blue line.
He offered zero resistance.
Yeah, he skated with his man all the way in but he never even so much as to put a glove or stick on him.
Maybe go down to block the pass?? Not likely either.
It's a very basic play and #22 should've prevented that particular goal so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

It’s amazing that you’re still blaming him for Skjei and Nieves completely forgetting to cover the backdoor. Shatty was correctly covering the middle lane and then shifted to Smith to keep him to the outside. That’s the right play. Idk how you keep arguing it. Blame the silly structure where you actually have to have a dmen and forward communicate whose responsibility it is to be near the netmouth on the weakside.

I’m not even saying Shatty’s been some defensive rock, but he was fine there. Could he have pressured more? Sure, but overall he completed his assignment on that play

 

[silverfish]

I'm just being a wise ass but as far as the play goes,

That play would've never materialized if #22 was where he was supposed to be.
He needs to stop that play at the first point of contact and that's the blue line.
He offered zero resistance.
Yeah, he skated with his man all the way in but he never even so much as to put a glove or stick on him.
Maybe go down to block the pass?? Not likely either.
It's a very basic play and #22 should've prevented that particular goal so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

What you're complaining about here isn't KS22, it's the system.

AV's d-scheme, when the Rangers have numbers back, isn't to step up at the blue line. In fact, I don't think AV's scheme ever has the D stepping up at the blue line. This is a major reason why BS42 has been somewhat of a let down with NYR. His best strength is eliminating zone entries against, but we don't care about that in AV hockey.

The main component of KS22's job on this play was to keep his man to the outside, and he did that. The Rangers had numbers back, so KS22 maintained his lane, and didn't allow himself to get beat inside, which is exactly what he's supposed to do there.

The fault lies with Skjei and Nieves for guarding open ice instead of the dangerous player.

Once again, I'd like to call out that the only reason we're even talking about this play is because it led to a goal against. If that play goes off, and KS22 allows the pass across and BS76 has his man, no one even remembers that this happened. What likely happens here is that we have 55 pages praising Brady Skjei for intercepting the pass, and turning the puck up ice. Exactly what he is supposed to do in this situation when running AV hockey.

How many opportunities did LV have at point blank range last night? How many odd-man rushes did the Rangers give up? Do you remember any of the players who messed up there and allowed those breakdowns to occur? No, because LV didn't score on those opportunities. Joe and Sam didn't show 15 replays from 75 different angles for you to watch on your couch so you could focus in on the player who you think was the problem in the breakdown, and ignore all the other information being presented to you.

Stay woke, y'all.

 

[will1066]

How do we know they lack skating ability? They're not allowed to skate.

Toward the end of the game, McD made a rush up against four VGK, got into the zone and almost got a shot off. It didn't look like he was injured, as folks have been speculating. He looked fine rushing the puck up. They rely on the long outlet pass to guys on the wall at the opposing blue line. I think their game improves when the defensemen carry the puck up least to the red line or when they make short outlets to the forwards at their own blue line. Even if they mess it up, they still have guys back so they're not caught when they try to stretch pass. The fourth line gets decent zone time because they're the only line that doesn't think stretch pass first.

 

[NYR]

@Mac n Gs
@silverfish

I'm not complaining, I'm just pointing out the obvious.

I can sit here for a year picking apart this system and yes, there were other players that were out of position.
Nobody is denying that but if you guys honestly think that #22 played a one on one situation correctly then I honestly don't know what to tell you.

He couldn't have possibly played it any softer. He needs pom poms instead of a stick.

I think any coach in the league would suggest that he failed miserably on that play but we've never heard that before.

 

[silverfish]

@Mac n Gs
@silverfish

I'm not complaining, I'm just pointing out the obvious.

I can sit here for a year picking apart this system and yes, there were other players that were out of position.
Nobody is denying that but if you guys honestly think that #22 played a one on one situation correctly then I honestly don't know what to tell you.

He couldn't have possibly played it any softer. He needs pom poms instead of a stick.

I think any coach in the league would suggest that he failed miserably on that play but we've never heard that before.

It wasn't a 1 on 1 situation that he was playing, it was a 3 on 2. His specific part in the 3 on 2 (three rangers, two knights) was played the way it needed to be played.

 

[NYR]

It wasn't a 1 on 1 situation that he was playing, it was a 3 on 2. His specific part in the 3 on 2 (three rangers, two knights) was played the way it needed to be played.

It was a one on one from the blue line to the goal line.
That's a long distance to go untouched in your own D zone.
Agree to disagree..

 

[silverfish]

It was a one on one from the blue line to the goal line.
That's a long distance to go untouched in your own D zone.
Agree to disagree..

That's not really how this works. If it was a true one on one, Smith coming in on Shattenkirk and they're alone in the zone, Shattenkirk plays that completely differently.

What actually happened is that it was a 2v3 rush for LV, and Shattenkirk kept his man to the outside, assuming that the Rangers having numbers back would not allow the puck to cross the royal road.

It should be pretty easy to comprehend where the actual breakdown in this play was.