OT: New Owner! New Name? New Season? New Everything!!! — Oh, and New Thread. All things Washington NFL FootBall (beat it, Dan-Bag!!)

[g00n]

Executives use wordplay and subtle or implied pressure like that all the time. It's part of the job.

So it's entirely possible Harris gave strong indication that something had to be done and in order to avoid appearing like he's meddling it was never spoken out loud.

 

[Midnight Judges]

I think damn near all of us prefer that. But I also think that all of his "football professionals" are living on borrowed time, including the coach he's speaking for. There's nothing to be gained from Wright or Mayhew making a similar statement, and we all know Ron isn't the guy for that stunt.

The only guy in the mix here with something to prove is Harris, and silence proves nothing. Ron is a totem pole that barely ever talks to anyone, almost always puts his foot in his mouth when he does, and is definitely going to be fired in a few weeks. This is who you want to hear from regarding the team's future, immediate or otherwise?

He didn't come out and say he's taking over and cleaning house. He said he met with the coach and the coach has made a couple moves. That's it. He said the guy you want to make that choice made that choice, but you don't like who delivered the message?

That's not "old school." That's just nitpicky shit.

I guess it depends on if you think owner involvement is self-evident or if it's like an iceberg. With Snyder it was very obviously like an iceberg - mostly concealed but then after the hull takes severe damage you realize how big that unseen part is.

Admittedly, I don't give the new guy the benefit of the doubt. He can earn that. Or not.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I'm not seeing where I contradicted anything Harris said.

I prefer owners merely signing checks while football professionals make the football decisions with 100% discretion (or as near as possible).

I don't even like owners making football-related announcements. I think the front office and media/PR people should be doing that as an organization. I didn't like Dan Snyder sending Lavernius Coles a flat screen TV. I didn't like Snyder meeting with RGIII. I didn't like Snyder telling WRs they should have scored, or stacking the deck against Kirk Cousins.

I wouldn't want the head coach or the GM being worried - not even slightly - that a strategic football decision might not be concurred by some billionaire douche who no NFL team would ever hire to manage football issues, but he's injected there because he has money. -That is not a recipe for success. (That's how we got Al Saunders and RGIII and Steve Spurrier and Vinnie Cerrato and Jeff George and Deion Sanders and Bruce Smith and Jim Zorn).

Certainly I am old school in this respect but I would hope that this fan base - out of all fanbases - would have learned this particular lesson.

It doesn‘t have to be all out or he’s a certified interferer. I want a smart owner actively involved in the franchise, just not making player personnel decisions.

 

[Midnight Judges]

Executives use wordplay and subtle or implied pressure like that all the time. It's part of the job.

So it's entirely possible Harris gave strong indication that something had to be done and in order to avoid appearing like he's meddling it was never spoken out loud.

Exactly. Executive power can be exercised 'softly' so to speak but the people below are getting the message loud and clear.

 

[Midnight Judges]

That's not "old school." That's just nitpicky shit.

I hope you are right and I am wrong.

I hope this owner doesn't think he's swooping in and fixing the d coordinator problem because in his mind Rivera couldn't do it himself.

I sincerely hope Harris didn't think he was going to get credit for firing JDR from the fans, and he made this personalized signed public statement to politick for fan support.

Populism isn't a good method to develop a winning franchise. That type of crap results in short-termism: scrounging for 5-6 wins a year but never rebuilding - which is pretty much what we've been doing for 24 years now.

 

[g00n]

omg Jets. That's exactly why you take a knee at the end of the half instead of throwing up a hail mary. Their DBs are better at returning the ball than your offense is at tackling/special teams.

 

[Cush]

omg Jets. That's exactly why you take a knee at the end of the half instead of throwing up a hail mary. Their DBs are better at returning the ball than your offense is at tackling/special teams.

Wonder if they should have held on to JDR for the rest of the year to help with the tank?

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Pretty sweet run back.

 

[Jags]

Some decent points, but dude…..there is a whole friggen industry called sports talk radio and television built around speculation discussions exactly like these.

Fair enough, but in those discussions there's always the guy saying what I'm saying. There's the overreactive rampant speculator and some other dude just kinda pointing to what was actually said without the reach.

Look, I'm all for the heated fan thing and am occasionally the heated fan myself. But Harris slayed a dragon when he came here. And since that day he's kept his mouth shut, been really respectful to the fans and the town, and overall pretty meek and awkward at times. He's been consistently diplomatic and adamant in his statements about making sound, decisive moves to get the franchise back on its feet.

The statement today was totally benign. There's nothing in there to be upset about and no reason to read between the lines. The message is clear, measured, and aimed directly at the fans, letting them know that changes are being made starting now and restating his motives and goals. Very candid; didn't leave much to the imagination.

But sure, by all means, let's twist ourselves and his statement into pretzels, parsing it for clues and subtext like it's the Zapruder film.

So it's entirely possible Harris gave strong indication that something had to be done and in order to avoid appearing like he's meddling it was never spoken out loud.

So he's trying to "avoid appearing like he's meddling" by issuing a long, public statement about the two firings that occurred after a meeting with his head coach that circumvented at least two levels of franchise hierarchy?

Do we think our new owner is a moron? Because that's something a moron would do if he was trying to avoid the appearance of meddling...

Populism isn't a good method to develop a winning franchise.

I totally agree, but I think there's a pretty big grey area between outright populism and communicating just enough with the fanbase to let them know what his motives and goals are. The leadership on the field -- and by the executives that have allowed it to go on -- has been abysmal. At some point fans want to hear that SOMEONE is driving the goddamn bus; that we're not complacent after getting manhandled by two divisional rivals in a row.

In my opinion, today was a good time for him to speak up. SOMEONE has to announce these changes, and I think it's better coming from someone who's still going to be working here come January. The only other candidates for delivering that message are Rivera, Mayhew, and Wright, in that order, and they're all too busy trying to remember their ZipRecruiter passwords...

 

[ynotcaps]

I hope you are right and I am wrong.

I hope this owner doesn't think he's swooping in and fixing the d coordinator problem because in his mind Rivera couldn't do it himself.

I sincerely hope Harris didn't think he was going to get credit for firing JDR from the fans, and he made this personalized signed public statement to politick for fan support.

Populism isn't a good method to develop a winning franchise. That type of crap results in short-termism: scrounging for 5-6 wins a year but never rebuilding - which is pretty much what we've been doing for 24 years now.

I haven't seen or heard anything to suggest Harris is a "populist" owner -- and that's a real statement, considering he is primary owner of 2 other franchises in other sports.
The Devils seem to be going about things the right way, building what should be a contender for a decent spell around homegrown talent acquired with smart picks.
The Sixers seem to be a contender, but I can't speak much to that because I gave up on the NBA about 30 years ago and haven't missed it for even a moment.
Dude spent $6B on a team that, recent history suggests, he views as a business investment despite the fact that he's also a fan. He seems like a business man at heart, not a self-worshipping narcissist like the Danbag.
As long as the decisions are coming from his head and not his heart, all should be well. And if he did have a role in helping RR decide that the changes needed to be made, just speaking for myself, I have no trouble with him helping his lame-duck employee pull the trigger on a move that his (RR's) own sense of loyalty was keeping him from making. If Ron really did make the move himself (which I'm on record as doubting), good for him for finally doing what had to be done, and shame on him for waiting until abject humiliation forced his hand.

Bottom line: the last month-plus is about letting the flood waters recede from the house so that in the offseason the new OG can bring in a new crew to gut and renovate this place. It's gonna' look awful and stink like hell, but it's the inevitable and necessary end.

 

[g00n]

So he's trying to "avoid appearing like he's meddling" by issuing a long, public statement about the two firings that occurred after a meeting with his head coach that circumvented at least two levels of franchise hierarchy?

Do we think our new owner is a moron? Because that's something a moron would do if he was trying to avoid the appearance of meddling...

Issuing a boilerplate statement to the fans that puts the onus of the decision on the coach is a "political" move and has nothing on its face that would suggest meddling, as written. So I'm not sure where your idea here is coming from.

 

[kicksavedave]

Everyone, sing it with me...

It's the most, wonderful time, of the year!

 

[Jags]

Issuing a boilerplate statement to the fans that puts the onus of the decision on the coach is a "political" move and has nothing on its face that would suggest meddling, as written. So I'm not sure where your idea here is coming from.

The idea came from the posters a page back that straight up said that the owner was sticking his nose where it didn't belong and that the firings came directly from Harris. I've been disagreeing with them loudly because...

I agree with you about the content of Harris' statement. My reply to you was sarcastic, but I guess it was a swing and a miss. I thought sandwiching it between two other replies that detailed how I really feel about the topic would make the sarcasm clear.

I was making their argument for them, my tongue was firmly in-cheek, but now I'm basically explaining a joke, which is excruciating in its own right, so I'm gonna go get a beer.

 

[g00n]

The idea came from the posters a page back that straight up said that the owner was sticking his nose where it didn't belong and that the firings came directly from Harris. I've been disagreeing with them loudly because...

I agree with you about the content of Harris' statement. My reply to you was sarcastic, but I guess it was a swing and a miss. I thought sandwiching it between two other replies that detailed how I really feel about the topic would make the sarcasm clear.

I was making their argument for them, my tongue was firmly in-cheek, but now I'm basically explaining a joke, which is excruciating in its own right, so I'm gonna go get a beer.

yeah sorry I only have so much time to read things

 

[notDkristich]

It doesn‘t have to be all out or he’s a certified interferer. I want a smart owner actively involved in the franchise, just not making player personnel decisions.

Too me, the message sounds like Harris was holding HC accountable. Seems reasonable, just like in any business setting. Shit rolls down hill. RR is next man up for when the shit hits the fan (end of season)

 

[Ajax1995]

Were they pass happy? Seemed like they ran the ball a lot. Pass and run was close to even despite being blown out.

They threw it 44 times, plus got sacked 4 times, and ran it 27 times, 2 of those were Howell though and I was too distracted by family Thanksgiving stuff to know if they were planned runs or scrambles. Let’s split the difference and say they dropped back to throw it 49 times and had 26 planned runs.

 

[Midnight Judges]

Issuing a boilerplate statement to the fans that puts the onus of the decision on the coach is a "political" move and has nothing on its face that would suggest meddling, as written. So I'm not sure where your idea here is coming from.

The statement from Harris says the coach merely made the recommendation to fire the d coordinator and framed it as if the owner made the final decision:

"This morning, I spoke with Coach Rivera and he recommended the team make changes at defensive coordinator and defensive backs coach. I accepted those recommendations..."

There is no "accepted" if the owner is not also potentially rejecting football decisions. So yes, he is absolutely meddling, unless this statement is somehow false or misleading.

Frankly, I hate it.

 

[Ajax1995]

The statement from Harris says the coach made the recommendation to fire the d coordinator and framed it as if the owner made the final decision:



There is no "accepted" if the owner is not also potentially rejecting football decisions. So yes, he is absolutely meddling, unless this statement is somehow false or misleading.

Frankly, I hate it.

Well the owner does have to sign off on paying these guys not to coach the team. I’m pretty sure the owner has had to sign off on every coach ever fired in any sport for that reason, and certainly for anyone with multiple years left on a contract, which I don’t believe was the case here though.

 

[Midnight Judges]

Well the owner does have to sign off on paying these guys not to coach the team. I’m pretty sure the owner has had to sign off on every coach ever fired in any sport for that reason, and certainly for anyone with multiple years left on a contract, which I don’t believe was the case here though.

My preference is that the owner gives the GM a budget and that's the end of their involvement.

Certainly I am a purist on this due to the fact that this is reportedly how the Cookes worked and we won 3 superbowls during my childhood. Whereas this is the opposite of how Dan Snyder worked and we won jack diddly squat under his billionaire douchebag unprofessional know-nothing-but-I-have-money-so-I'll-make-football-decisions meddling.

So yeah, I'm deeply burnished against the Snyder tradition. lol.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Wow exactly what I said…

 

[HTFN]

My preference is that the owner gives the GM a budget and that's the end of their involvement.

Certainly I am a purist on this due to the fact that this is reportedly how the Cookes worked and we won 3 superbowls during my childhood. Whereas this is the opposite of how Dan Snyder worked and we won jack diddly squat under his billionaire douchebag unprofessional know-nothing-but-I-have-money-so-I'll-make-football-decisions meddling.

So yeah, I'm deeply burnished against the Snyder tradition. lol.

Correct me if I'm wrong but nobody in the organization is his hire so far, so like... who watches the watchmen? Wright and Mayhew are still the most ranking "football men" in the organization so do they just get a good decade or so before hands off ownership finally wakes from its slumber and makes a change?

At some point your owner is going to be involved, at least until he's got "football men" he believes in (which is meddling) first. Kind of how it works, right?

 

[g00n]

An owner picking his generals and setting the direction of the franchise, including course corrections, isn't meddling. It's his right as the owner.

An owner calling up the coach on draft day and blowing up the draft board to take a certain player is meddling. An owner calling plays from his booth is meddling. An owner going around an otherwise competent GM to fire a head coach is meddling.

An owner of a sports franchise or really any business isn't going to just fund the project and walk away. That's simply an investor, and even they have a say in how the business is run via the board or other means.

Setting an example of accountability, transparency, and professionalism helps define company culture and is basic leadership.

 

[g00n]

Oh, and...

Cowboys' Thanksgiving blowout drew 3rd-largest TV audience in NFL regular-season history

As always, the Cowboys are the NFL's greatest draw.

sports.yahoo.com

Huge audience for that fiasco.

 

[Holtbyisms]

Wow exactly what I said…

I mean it just makes so much sense. It almost feels like now you can't just go straight to EB as the head coach because you didn't get to try him out and missed the chance. I like Ron as a man, he's a good dude. But he hitched himself to a generational talent in his prime and road him to the Superbowl. If not for Cam Newton he'd probably be out of the league a long time ago.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

I hate the cowboys…