Speculation: New coach options?

[gojetsgo]

I watched the same games you did.

Im not blaming Wheeler - maybe Lowry felt more comfortable with his personnel once Wheels was back. Could just be the coaching staff regressing to what the team knows as well... but our D system is a fkn disaster and has been for a long time.

Lowry has overplayed his top guys and Helle since day one... but early on were also playing zone D, cycling on the powerplay and had an aggressive PK

Wheeler definitely pulled the PP back to the cross ice feed and perimeter passing. You can't argue with that.

clearly you didn't watch the same games as me if you think we changed systems with wheeler gone and then suddenly reverted back when he got healthy

sometimes when players get hurt and you need to use different personnel you make tweaks to the unit and then you go back to the normal setup once healthy again...

 

[oldunclehue]

I'd love to see a younger face/mind for the new game. The game has evolved SO much in the last decade that the old guard of coaches aren't as successful as before. Don't get me wrong the old guys know systems, can do ok with the on ice product.....but its the younger generation of players and how to motivate/guide them along I think thats changed.

I'd prefer to see a younger coach given a chance like the leafs did with Keefe.

 

[cbcwpg]

High Danger Chances Against (HDA) rank

* higher the number the better the rank ie: 2 means 2nd worst in the league

2016-17 : 21
2017-18 : 26
2018-19 : 8
2019-20 : 2
2021-21 : 14
2021-22 : 5

 

[jamiebez]

Weibe is a company man par excellence -- maybe he has inside info and some water to carry?

This is what I think as well.

Weiber is pretty plugged in... between this and what Elliotte Friedman has been hinting at, I'm wondering if Chevy/Chipman are blaming the players for the disappointment of this season.

I think we need a new coaching staff either way: we just might get some big roster changes to go with it.

 

[WolfHouse]

clearly you didn't watch the same games as me if you think we changed systems with wheeler gone and then suddenly reverted back when he got healthy

sometimes when players get hurt and you need to use different personnel you make tweaks to the unit and then you go back to the normal setup once healthy again...

I like how you just repeated my own words as way to argue against them. Solid.

So we made 'tweaks' but didn't play a different system... sometimes you regress to old habits. We will never know - but we were playing zone and now we are not.

 

[WolfHouse]

This is what I think as well.

Weiber is pretty plugged in... between this and what Elliotte Friedman has been hinting at, I'm wondering if Chevy/Chipman are blaming the players for the disappointment of this season.

I think we need a new coaching staff either way: we just might get some big roster changes to go with it.

Tell me Travis Green does not have connections to TNSE... that would implode this franchise - he's awful.

 

[gojetsgo]

I like how you just repeated my own words as way to argue against them. Solid.

So we made 'tweaks' but didn't play a different system... sometimes you regress to old habits. We will never know - but we were playing zone and now we are not.

we made tweaks to the powerplay.... not 5on5...

 

[RabidOne]

ken weibe on the daily faceoff says lowry can be the right person for the job, blames the players.. then suggests travis green as a potential coach..

Not Travis Greene. That would be a horrible move.

 

[Weezeric]

High Danger Chances Against (HDA) rank

* higher the number the better the rank ie: 2 means 2nd worst in the league

2016-17 : 21
2017-18 : 26
2018-19 : 8
2019-20 : 2
2021-21 : 14
2021-22 : 5

It’s almost as if the results were really good when the defence was really good. And then became bad when 5 of 6 defencemen were lost. I, for one, am shocked..

 

[cbcwpg]

It’s almost as if the results were really good when the defence was really good. And then became bad when 5 of 6 defencemen were lost. I, for one, am shocked..

Personal leaving was obvious for the drop between 18 and 19, but I'm more concerned about what we are seeing this year to last season, when the GM specifically tried to shore up the defense by bringing in who he did. We have 4 consecutive seasons of below average to very poor defensive coverage. Is it just the players or is it the coaching?

 

[WolfHouse]

we made tweaks to the powerplay.... not 5on5...

When Lowry got here last year was when we started using strongside overload a lot more... we played zone D a lot in the Edmonton playoff series - I believe that was his influence because we needed something new after the losing streak...

All that's left of the changes I saw are the aggressive PK (mostly) and Lowry on the PP... otherwise, the system is exactly the same as it was on day 1

I wont spend all day defending Lowry because the fourth line usage, vet deployment and exhausting our top players has me off his bandagon.

 

[gojetsgo]

it's just so simple to pull our d away from the net, if you have control of the puck just skate it back to the blue line and our d will follow them all the way to the top leaving a forward to cover the net front..

 

[DRW204]

High Danger Chances Against (HDA) rank

* higher the number the better the rank ie: 2 means 2nd worst in the league

2016-17 : 21
2017-18 : 26
2018-19 : 8
2019-20 : 2
2021-21 : 14
2021-22 : 5

is this all-strengths or 5v5? and from which site?
Natural stat trick for example had us at 15th best at 5v5, and 19th at all strengths in HDCA (per 60) in the 18-19 season.


@Gm0ney has a great post of our xGA rankings (higher the HDCA leads to higher xGA) over the years, w/ our top used Dmen

basically asides from 17-18 we've been average to v bad.

Just for reference, here's a snapshot of the Age of Huddy in Winnipeg so far.

Season	xGA/60 Rank (5v5 | PK)​	Defense (in order of TOI/GP with at least 500* minutes TOI*)​
2011-12	23 | 28​	Buff, Enstrom, Hainsey, Bogo, Oduya, Stuart
2012-13	25 | 14​	Buff, Bogo, Hainsey, Clitsome, Stuart, Postma
2013-14	19 |20​	Bogo, Enstrom, Buff**, Trouba, Clitsome, Stuart
2014-15	19 | 22​	Bogo***, Enstrom, Trouba, Buff**, Chiarot, Stuart
2015-16	16 | 28​	Buff, Trouba, Enstrom, Myers, Chiarot, Stuart
2016-17	14 | 19​	Buff, Trouba, Morrissey, Enstrom, Chiarot, Postma
2017-18	4 | 29​	Buff, Trouba, Morrissey, Myers, Enstrom, Kulikov
2018-19	22 | 24​	Buff, Trouba, Morrissey, Chiarot, Myers, Kulikov
2019-20	29 | 27​	Morrissey, Pionk, Kulikov, Poolman, Sbisa, Beaulieu
2020-21	27 | 28​	Morrissey, Pionk, Forbert, Poolman, DeMelo, Stanley
2021-22	28 | 22​	Morrissey, Schmidt, Pionk, Dillon, DeMelo, Stanley
Average	21 | 24​

* TOI threshold lowered for 2012-13 (lockout) and 2021-22 (only 36 GP so far)
** 2013-14 and 2014-15 Buff played on the wing for a significant number of games.
*** Bogo traded in February 2015

The 2015-2018 seasons were really the Jets' defensive zenith...and it was really only one good year. Since losing to Vegas in the WCF, this team has been wallowing in the Bottom 10 defensively (prior to that one good year, they were mostly wallowing in the bottom half defensively). The team's been consistently bad defensively at 5v5 and on the PK through 2 different head coaches (now 3), and significant roster changes. The PK has only cracked the top half of the league in xGA/60 once in 11 seasons! And at 5v5 they've had one good year.

How does Huddy still have a job here?

 

[cbcwpg]

is this all-strengths or 5v5? and from which site?
Natural stat trick for example had us at 15th best at 5v5, and 19th at all strengths in HDCA (per 60) in the 18-19 season.


@Gm0ney has a great post of our xGA rankings (higher the HDCA leads to higher xGA) over the years, w/ our top used Dmen

basically asides from 17-18 we've been average to v bad.

It was 5-on-5 from:

2021-22 NHL Summary | Hockey-Reference.com

Check out the Eastern, Western Conference and Playoff series Standings, Statistics, Leaders and more for the 2021-22 NHL season on Hockey-Reference.com

www.hockey-reference.com

Under team Analytics ( 5-on-5) and you can sort by whatever you want. I was sorting by HDA.

 

[kanadalainen]

Travis Greene would be worse than any coach we've employed within Jets v 2.0, with the possible exception of Charlie Huddy.

Brian Greene would enjoy slightly better success on the ice, and the lads would develop excellent repartee in backstage discussions of string theory. I'm not sure if Chevy could pry him out of Columbia, but his pressers would slay.

 

[Ggg99]

It will be another true north and/or ex employee .
Pascal Vincent
Daddy Dubois
Randy Carlyle
Maybe Mike Keane will take a shot at it

Agreed. And based on the un-ending priority placed on loyalty you gotta figure the longest serving assistant coach will get consideration.

 

[Heldig]

How Huddy still has a job is shocking.

 

[kanadalainen]

Pascale Vincent would be the best of that bunch IMHO.

(VIncent, Carlyle, Daddy Dubois, Keaner)

 

[WolfHouse]

Travis Greene would be worse than any coach we've employed within Jets v 2.0, with the possible exception of Charlie Huddy.

Brian Greene would enjoy slightly better success on the ice, and the lads would develop excellent repartee in backstage discussions of string theory. I'm not sure if Chevy could pry him out of Columbia, but his pressers would slay.

There's only one Green I want anywhere near the Jets...

 

[Ggg99]

If Trotz is available would love to see him here and not just because he is an excellent coach.

 

[Guffman]

I'd prefer to see a younger coach given a chance like the leafs did with Keefe.

Maybe Keefe will one day win a playoff series.

 

[JetsFan815]

I'd love to see a younger face/mind for the new game. The game has evolved SO much in the last decade that the old guard of coaches aren't as successful as before. Don't get me wrong the old guys know systems, can do ok with the on ice product.....but its the younger generation of players and how to motivate/guide them along I think thats changed.

I'd prefer to see a younger coach given a chance like the leafs did with Keefe.

The "old guard" with a winning record gives you a baseline level of guarantee of quality (unless you hire someone terrible like Carlyle). So many new faces flame out on their first NHL job (Dallas Eakins was a hyped new coach, it looks like he's a good coach now but look how long it took him to get there). Easy decision to hire a new face if you're a rebuilding team and stakes are low, not so much with a team like the Jets that is hoping for one more run with a veteran group.

I don't think the Jets can afford to spin the dice on a fresh face. They need a proven NHL coach - a Babcock/Julien/Boudreau/DeBoar/Sutter/Laviolette type or if we are dreaming big Trotz.

Additionally I think this group needs someone with gravitas as I fear they might run over someone new to NHL coaching.

 

[Guffman]

Guffman has compiled some stats based on the current year record of head coaches sorted by years of experience.

Experience: 0-3 years Winning %: 0.519 (11 coaches)
Experience: 4-9 years Winning %: 0.576 (11 coaches)
Experience 10+ years Winning %: 0.591 (10 coaches)

More experience = better.

Stop giving me garbage about fresh faces having fresh ideas. Their half-baked ideas don't compensate for their lack of experience. The Jets are built to win NOW. You DO NOT insert some inexperienced idiot to learn the ropes when time is of the essence.

 

[ulf]

Guffman has compiled some stats based on the current year record of head coaches sorted by years of experience.

Experience: 0-3 years Winning %: 0.519 (11 coaches)
Experience: 4-9 years Winning %: 0.576 (11 coaches)
Experience 10+ years Winning %: 0.591 (10 coaches)

More experience = better.

Stop giving me garbage about fresh faces having fresh ideas. Their half-baked ideas don't compensate for their lack of experience. The Jets are built to win NOW. You DO NOT insert some inexperienced idiot to learn the ropes when time is of the essence.

are we really a win now franchise….doesn’t seem like we’re even close.

 

[surixon]

Guffman has compiled some stats based on the current year record of head coaches sorted by years of experience.

Experience: 0-3 years Winning %: 0.519 (11 coaches)
Experience: 4-9 years Winning %: 0.576 (11 coaches)
Experience 10+ years Winning %: 0.591 (10 coaches)

More experience = better.

Stop giving me garbage about fresh faces having fresh ideas. Their half-baked ideas don't compensate for their lack of experience. The Jets are built to win NOW. You DO NOT insert some inexperienced idiot to learn the ropes when time is of the essence.

How many of of those coaches first time coaches though?

Brindamour and Keith are first time coaches that have great stats for instance.

Edit:

Each of the top 3 teams in the league have a head coach in his first NHL head coaching job.

I think all that matters is you find the right coach for the style of play and the type of team you want to be.