Player Discussion: Neal Pionk Part 2

[Evil Little]

With all the stupid awards the NHL has I still cannot believe that there is only one defenseman award. There should be best overall defenseman (Norris) and the season scoring champ (Orr). Just do it, NHL.

Agreed, though you need to name it after a guy who didn't hitch his wagon to a wannabe dictator.

 

[DRW204]

Agreed, though you need to name it after a guy who didn't hitch his wagon to a wannabe dictator.

would u be surprised if the nhl did? they seem tone-deaf.

 

[voyageur]

Looking forward to seeing how he plays Mc David tonight. No Lowry, same way Leafs played us, and the Canadiens played them, want to slow down the speedsters, let em know you're there.

 

[Whileee]

Pelech's new contract (8 x 5.75M) should be a good guide for Pionk, considering overall impact. Pionk scores more, but Pelech has a bigger defensive impact. If the Jets could get Pionk signed long term for under 6M, that would be a good result.

 

[Mathil8]

Pelech's new contract (8 x 5.75M) should be a good guide for Pionk, considering overall impact. Pionk scores more, but Pelech has a bigger defensive impact. If the Jets could get Pionk signed long term for under 6M, that would be a good result.

Agreed, but how does Nurses rumoured 8 x 9.25M contract affect Pionk's contract?

 

[snowkiddin]

Agreed, but how does Nurses rumoured 8 x 9.25M contract affect Pionk's contract?

Nurse’s contract is shades of Kyle Dubas. Hopefully we can avoid that.

 

[Atoyot]

If we somehow don't end up signing Pionk then our defense hasn't improved. Need to get him signed.

 

[Gm0ney]

Pelech's new contract (8 x 5.75M) should be a good guide for Pionk, considering overall impact. Pionk scores more, but Pelech has a bigger defensive impact. If the Jets could get Pionk signed long term for under 6M, that would be a good result.

Points get paid. Defensive impact doesn't. $6M AAV or under for Pionk would be very good in this climate.

 

[Romang67]

Points get paid. Defensive impact doesn't. $6M AAV or under for Pionk would be very good in this climate.

Barrie got $4.5M.

 

[Whileee]

Barrie got $4.5M.

True. I think Barrie is seen as being a purely offensive player, with very mediocre defense. Pionk is seen as an all-around player with a good balance of offense and defense. Pionk is also a lot younger.

 

[DRW204]

Barrie got $4.5M.

nurse got 9.25m

 

[Gm0ney]

Barrie got $4.5M.

Well, there's some combination of height, TOI, toughness, points and probably +/- that GMs seem to use in valuing defensemen.

Barrie is <6', soft as a kitten, gong-show-terrible at D, scores points. $$

Pionk is 6', led Jets defensemen in hits (and hits/60), 2nd on the Jets in TOI, scores points. $$$$

If all else were equal but Barrie was 6' and hit people, he would've got $6M+.

 

[Gm0ney]

I boldly predict Pionk's AAV will fall somewhere between Barrie and Nurse...

 

[Romang67]

Yeah, I don't expect Pionk to get Barrie numbers, but I think (and kinda hope) that the ridiculous numbers we're seeing is because those D-men are big (and, you know, therefore OBVIOUSLY great defensively and tough to play against). Pionk hits, but he's nowhere near the size of those $9M D-men.

 

[tbcwpg]

Agreed, but how does Nurses rumoured 8 x 9.25M contract affect Pionk's contract?

Probably not similarly. Nurse is already getting $5.6m, has more tenure in the league, and the Oilers bought 8 years of UFA time for that price. I doubt Pionk gets anywhere close to that.

 

[Daximus]

Probably not similarly. Nurse is already getting $5.6m, has more tenure in the league, and the Oilers bought 8 years of UFA time for that price. I doubt Pionk gets anywhere close to that.

Likely not but if we want a longer term deal I wouldn't be surprised if his camp wants at least $7.5

 

[RustyCat]

Taking a shot in the dark on this and I will say 5y/5.75m. Who knows though. I never would have guess Nurse at 900 billion dollars either...

 

[tbcwpg]

Likely not but if we want a longer term deal I wouldn't be surprised if his camp wants at least $7.5

I'm not sure a longer term deal (over 5 years) is in the Jets best interest.

 

[Romang67]

I'm not sure a longer term deal (over 5 years) is in the Jets best interest.

Agreed. I think 4ish years might be pertinent, as Pionk will get another contract right in his (supposed) prime, and we'll have Pionk through this core's contracts.

 

[Mathil8]

Agreed. I think 4ish years might be pertinent, as Pionk will get another contract right in his (supposed) prime, and we'll have Pionk through this core's contracts.

I'd be pretty happy if we could get him signed under 6m for 4 years.

Another wrinkle in these contract negotiations:

If the 1 year arbitration reward for Copp is <$4,538,958 the jets would have to take it no matter what. In that case, if the arbitration reward is >4 but <4.538 they could be screwed and forced to buy someone out in order to structure the cap with Pionk's contract.

Maybe it isn't a good thing that Pionk's arbitration is up first. Might have been a better situation to determine Copp's contract (via arbitration if necessary) and then decide on a term with Pionk that would fit our cap structure.

A 6m contract for Pionk would give us a maximum of ~4.1m (with waiving/trading Beaulieu) to get Copp on a short term deal, but if we sign Pionk for that much and Copp's arbitration reward is higher, there'll need to be some cap surgery.

 

[ps241]

I'm not sure a longer term deal (over 5 years) is in the Jets best interest.

Agreed. I think 4ish years might be pertinent, as Pionk will get another contract right in his (supposed) prime, and we'll have Pionk through this core's contracts.

I am a Pionk fan but am fine with a 4 year term if we can keep the AAV down. Whatever it takes.

 

[Whileee]

I'm not sure a longer term deal (over 5 years) is in the Jets best interest.

If the Jets like him a lot, and the feeling is mutual, a long term deal is a good idea.

 

[scelaton]

I'd be pretty happy if we could get him signed under 6m for 4 years........

I'd be shocked if he settled for a $24M contract.
The future is always uncertain in the NHL, more so for a small defenceman who will be over 30 when this contract ends. If he gets injured it could be his last, so long-term security is paramount.
If I were advising him, I would tell him not to settle for <$40M total and I would not be surprised if he is asking for $50M (over 7 years).

 

[Whileee]

Nate Schmidt's latest contract (6 x 5.95M) isn't a bad comparable for Pionk. It was signed when the salary cap was the same (81.5M), but expected to rise. Overall performance was similar, though Pionk has produced a bit more offense.

 

[tbcwpg]

If the Jets like him a lot, and the feeling is mutual, a long term deal is a good idea.

I just don't think Pionk has enough hockey behind him for a long term deal to be worthwhile. Especially considering it would likely be driving the AAV up as it would not really provide Pionk, at 26 already, another chance at a significant payday.

I have no issue with 5 years but I think anything more is risky.