NCAA Hockey Expansion Thread

[No Fun Shogun]

I agree with your premise, but you cannot deny that the local market has produced a lot of NHL-level players lately and should be able to get some Illinois products as long as UofI do not want to fund a DI team.

Eh, I doubt it. If you're an Illinois-born prospect entering the NCAA, Big Ten+Notre Dame or the NCHC are the obvious destinations if you want to get NHL eyeballs, develop your craft, or just play relatively locally. Lindenwood would just be another (likely) WCHC school (with pretty long road trips). A place to maybe play, for sure, but not a top-tier target destination.

The argument for Illinois is that Champaign-Urbana is relatively local and there's an established pipeline between it and Chicagoland. Not so much for a suburb of St. Louis, aside from maybe any Metro East prospects.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

Eh, I doubt it. If you're an Illinois-born prospect entering the NCAA, Big Ten+Notre Dame or the NCHC are the obvious destinations if you want to get NHL eyeballs, develop your craft, or just play relatively locally. Lindenwood would just be another (likely) WCHC school (with pretty long road trips). A place to maybe play, for sure, but not a top-tier target destination.

The argument for Illinois is that Champaign-Urbana is relatively local and there's an established pipeline between it and Chicagoland. Not so much for a suburb of St. Louis, aside from maybe any Metro East prospects.

And therein lies the rub: how is a regional, semi-commuter school with so-so academics and no name recognition outside the area supposed to compete for recruits with schools like that? Any recruit who's a real prospect is looking for programs that are both competitive and going to get them seen, with an added bonus of providing them with a valuable degree that will impact their life after hockey. Notre Dame, Big Ten Schools, ECAC schools, HE schools all do that. Starting at zero, Lindenwood will have a long way to go. They're going to be picking over the two- and three-star recruits at best and building a team from them and transfers...

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Agreed. I don't think Lindenwood would be any kind of a disaster, but a dime a dozen program from a region that doesn't produce a whole lot of NCAA-tier hockey talent. Maybe they tap into St. Louis as I'm sure that there's a collegiate pipeline that could be tapped from there, but would that compare to a second tier program in a hotbed like say Ferris State or Bemidji State? I doubt it. A place where a good program could be formed, for sure, but not a perennial heavy hitter.

They've found a damn solid ACHA standing, but that doesn't remotely mean it would translate to the NCAA. There's a blueprint for maybe the Illini being a powerhouse in the making if they can own the Illinois prospect pool (and that's a big maybe), but that's not remotely comparable for Lindenwood.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

Agreed. I don't think Lindenwood would be any kind of a disaster, but a dime a dozen program from a region that doesn't produce a whole lot of NCAA-tier hockey talent. Maybe they tap into St. Louis as I'm sure that there's a collegiate pipeline that could be tapped from there, but would that compare to a second tier program in a hotbed like say Ferris State or Bemidji State? I doubt it. A place where a good program could be formed, for sure, but not a perennial heavy hitter.

They've found a damn solid ACHA standing, but that doesn't remotely mean it would translate to the NCAA. There's a blueprint for maybe the Illini being a powerhouse in the making if they can own the Illinois prospect pool (and that's a big maybe), but that's not remotely comparable for Lindenwood.

Division I recruiting is no longer a local game and hasn't been for decades. As was mentioned higher up in the thread, most teams have two or fewer "local" players, if they have any at all. St. Louis has put out some good players lately, including a few that have made the NHL. I don't think, however, that a scholarship offer from Lindenwood is going to keep anyone close to home just because it's nearby, especially when offered a scholarship from any institution that has name recognition.

 

[cowboy82nd]

88 million brownies and you've got a rink!

Are they pot brownies???

 

[mk80]

Starting things off with a typo in the main announcement post but I'm going to ignore that for now and finally celebrate.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Starting things off with a typo in the main announcement post but I'm going to ignore that for now and finally celebrate.

For those of you who can't differentiate between an actual announcement and something else, this is an actual announcement.

On a happier note, do they have an announcer's role to fill @mk80 ?

 

[CrazyEddie20]

Starting things off with a typo in the main announcement post but I'm going to ignore that for now and finally celebrate.

No head coach named in the release. Interesting. Zombo merely acknowledged as the club team coach...

 

[mk80]

No head coach named in the release. Interesting. Zombo merely acknowledged as the club team coach...

Zombo will be the head coach. It's not even in question

 

[JMCx4]

Zombo will be the head coach. It's not even in question

Color me disappointed.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

Color me disappointed.

I tend to agree. Despite his playing experience, I don't think Zombo really understands the difference in the level of play between ACHA Division 1 and real college hockey. Arizona State has had some marginal success under Powers, but I don't think he'll be there much longer. Penn State didn't keep Balboni around to coach, which was probably the single best move they made when starting the program, allowing them to bring in an experienced Division I coach in Gadowsky.

The reality that Lindenwood is going to face quickly next season is that literally 50% of the players that played on the ACHA team aren't really capable of playing Division I. They either have to purge the roster and recruit 15 legitimate Division I players for next season or be prepared to take some serious lumps.

 

[Ridge1982]

Rick Zombo

Richard Zombo (born May 8, 1963 in Des Plaines, Illinois, United States) is a retired professional ice hockey defenseman who played in the NHL for 12 seasons between 1984 and 1996. Zombo played with the Austin Mavericks of the USHL as a 17 year old during the 1980-81 season, earning 36 points in...

icehockey.fandom.com

In his freshman season with North Dakota, Zombo appeared in 45 games, registering 16 points, as he helped the team win the 1982 NCAA National Championship as the Fighting Sioux defeated the Wisconsin Badgers 5-2 in the championship game. In 1982-83, Zombo would once again earn 16 points, and he would earn a spot on the US National Team in the World Junior Hockey Championships, where he went pointless in seven games. Zombo saw his offensive numbers explode in the 1983-84 season with North Dakota, as he recorded 31 points in 34 games in what would be his last season with the Fighting Sioux.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

Rick Zombo

Richard Zombo (born May 8, 1963 in Des Plaines, Illinois, United States) is a retired professional ice hockey defenseman who played in the NHL for 12 seasons between 1984 and 1996. Zombo played with the Austin Mavericks of the USHL as a 17 year old during the 1980-81 season, earning 36 points in...

icehockey.fandom.com

So your position is that because Zombo played Division I college hockey 40 years ago, he's therefore qualified to coach Division I hockey now? Is that what your post is meant to say?

 

[willy702]

I tend to agree. Despite his playing experience, I don't think Zombo really understands the difference in the level of play between ACHA Division 1 and real college hockey. Arizona State has had some marginal success under Powers, but I don't think he'll be there much longer. Penn State didn't keep Balboni around to coach, which was probably the single best move they made when starting the program, allowing them to bring in an experienced Division I coach in Gadowsky.

The reality that Lindenwood is going to face quickly next season is that literally 50% of the players that played on the ACHA team aren't really capable of playing Division I. They either have to purge the roster and recruit 15 legitimate Division I players for next season or be prepared to take some serious lumps.

Yeah a purge is really needed. I went to the exhibition game with DU this year and it was like men playing with not even boys. DU went into all-star mode not really going hard after the first period and still got to 9 goals. Nothing against these kids as they were trying their best, but the skating and puck handling skills were just at such different levels. I watched part of one of the DU games against ASU and the skill differential was nothing that noticeable even though the games weren't that close. The program will need years to just get to a competent level such as where ASU stands.

 

[JMCx4]

Yeah a purge is really needed. I went to the exhibition game with DU this year and it was like men playing with not even boys. DU went into all-star mode not really going hard after the first period and still got to 9 goals. Nothing against these kids as they were trying their best, but the skating and puck handling skills were just at such different levels. ...

Ditto my observations from attending one of the USAFA @ LU exhibitions in October 2021. Now to be fair with both of our observations:

1. These exhibitions were very early in the 2021-22 season, putting Lindenwood at a greater disadvantage as they solidified their roster & before they developed the timing and momentum that led them to the ACHA Division 1 championship earlier this month;
2. I think we are both assuming that Lindenwood will carry over the majority of their current non-varsity players to their initial NCAA DI roster.

No. 2 causes me the greater concern in light of @mk80's pronouncement that Rick Zombo will be the DI head coach, as I'm not sure how "plugged in" he is to the NCAA recruiting circuit. Add to that my observation over the LU men's games that I've watched that he motivates his players more on emotion than on skill or hockey tactics. I just have an overall queasy feeling that he will not be capable of building a competitive team in the foreseeable future, just as his counterpart leading the women's NCAA DI team the last 3 seasons (Shelley Looney) has failed to do. I believe they are comparable situations.

 

[mk80]

I think we are both assuming that Lindenwood will carry over the majority of their current non-varsity players to their initial NCAA DI roster.

I'm expecting over half the roster to be new players. LU has 6 seniors graduating this spring, 2 Grad students that will not be back. The only players I would expect will be on the NCAA roster next year from this season's team are the 11 guys brought in for NCAA play already, and likely the 3-4 current juniors who will be seniors next season. Similar to what Penn State and ASU did, their then senior players stayed on in their first full NCAA seasons, while the rest of the roster was brought in around them.

---------------------------------------------------------------

As far as on ice results, next year I expect that similar to the most recent NCAA expansion teams Penn State, ASU, LIU, St. Thomas. LU will also have some lopsided scores against them as they build their program, and especially putting some powerhouse programs on the schedule by the sounds of things.

I'll drop a few interviews here from last week with Rick Zombo on a couple radio shows on local radio station 590 The Fan.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

As far as on ice results, next year I expect that similar to the most recent NCAA expansion teams Penn State, ASU, LIU, St. Thomas. LU will also have some lopsided scores against them as they build their program, and especially putting some powerhouse programs on the schedule by the sounds of things.

I don't expect improvement year-over-year from either LU or LIU. They don't have the institutional advantages that ASU, Penn State, or even St. Thomas have. ASU and Penn State both made the NCAA Tournament within four years of starting a Division I program. Half of LIU's 10 wins this year were against Non-Division I opponents. Given the paucity of institutional support LU has given the women's hockey program and its dearth of success, why should we expect anything different from the men's program?

 

[S E P H]

Atlantic Hockey Votes to Bring Robert Morris Back

Atlantic Hockey athletic directors met on Tuesday and voted to reinstate Robert Morris to the league for the 2023-24 season, sources tell College Hockey News...

www.collegehockeynews.com

- Robert Morris got accepted back into Atlantic hockey conference, but the vote was not unanimous.

- Utica University is trying to also join Atlantic hockey after being a success DIII programme. They as a school are trying to boost up all their athletics to DII, but because there is virtually zero DII hockey schools, there is a rule that allows them to move to DI. They would play in the same rink that the AHL Comet's play out of and would want to start in 2023-24 if they gain acceptance.

- Stonehill College is one of the few DII schools who is looking to go DI in the future and if they do, they are going to build a brand new rink. How the article is written is quite strange, but I think they're trying to apply to Atlantic Hockey as well. We might need two divisions in this conference considering how many teams want to join them.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Atlantic Hockey Votes to Bring Robert Morris Back

Atlantic Hockey athletic directors met on Tuesday and voted to reinstate Robert Morris to the league for the 2023-24 season, sources tell College Hockey News...

www.collegehockeynews.com

- Robert Morris got accepted back into Atlantic hockey conference, but the vote was not unanimous.

- Utica University is trying to also join Atlantic hockey after being a success DIII programme. They as a school are trying to boost up all their athletics to DII, but because there is virtually zero DII hockey schools, there is a rule that allows them to move to DI. They would play in the same rink that the AHL Comet's play out of and would want to start in 2023-24 if they gain acceptance.

- Stonehill College is one of the few DII schools who is looking to go DI in the future and if they do, they are going to build a brand new rink. How the article is written is quite strange, but I think they're trying to apply to Atlantic Hockey as well. We might need two divisions in this conference considering how many teams want to join them.

Utica already does play out of the Aud, which they share with the Comets, and have had at least 3,000 people per game for the last decade. The College Hockey News announced the school's athletic programs already are moving up to NCAA DII which the school flat out denied and said they don't have the money to do. I will believe this one when I see it.

Same thing with Stonehill. They barely fund their NCAA DII programs as it is and they play 20 minutes off campus. And there are absolutely no news articles anywhere on the internet even hinting at a NCAA D1 move.

 

[S E P H]

Utica already does play out of the Aud, which they share with the Comets, and have had at least 3,000 people per game for the last decade. The College Hockey News announced the school's athletic programs already are moving up to NCAA DII which the school flat out denied and said they don't have the money to do. I will believe this one when I see it.

Same thing with Stonehill. They barely fund their NCAA DII programs as it is and they play 20 minutes off campus. And there are absolutely no news articles anywhere on the internet even hinting at a NCAA D1 move.

Yeah that makes a lot more sense. The article said "CNH sources" concerning Stonehill, so take that as you will.

 

[mk80]

Atlantic Hockey Votes to Bring Robert Morris Back

Atlantic Hockey athletic directors met on Tuesday and voted to reinstate Robert Morris to the league for the 2023-24 season, sources tell College Hockey News...

www.collegehockeynews.com

- Robert Morris got accepted back into Atlantic hockey conference, but the vote was not unanimous.

- Utica University is trying to also join Atlantic hockey after being a success DIII programme. They as a school are trying to boost up all their athletics to DII, but because there is virtually zero DII hockey schools, there is a rule that allows them to move to DI. They would play in the same rink that the AHL Comet's play out of and would want to start in 2023-24 if they gain acceptance.

- Stonehill College is one of the few DII schools who is looking to go DI in the future and if they do, they are going to build a brand new rink. How the article is written is quite strange, but I think they're trying to apply to Atlantic Hockey as well. We might need two divisions in this conference considering how many teams want to join them.

Utica already does play out of the Aud, which they share with the Comets, and have had at least 3,000 people per game for the last decade. The College Hockey News announced the school's athletic programs already are moving up to NCAA DII which the school flat out denied and said they don't have the money to do. I will believe this one when I see it.

Same thing with Stonehill. They barely fund their NCAA DII programs as it is and they play 20 minutes off campus. And there are absolutely no news articles anywhere on the internet even hinting at a NCAA D1 move.

I could see Utica being plausible more so than Stonehill at this time, they've been doing a lot of work rebranding themselves as a school over recent years, including the name change to Utica University just about a month ago. Utica College is Now Utica University | Utica University

There has been a lot talk surrounding them since the Adirondack Bank Center hosted the Atlantic Hockey conference tournament. If they do elevate their department to DII and their hockey to DI subsequently, I'm sure their women's team would be a welcome addition in the CHA to help stabilize that conference, and it's possible the comments from AHA/CHA Commissioner Bob DeGregorio a few months ago talking about the CHA and saying they had discussions with a non NCAA DI school about joining could connect to the recent flurry of discussion of Utica.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Yeah that makes a lot more sense. The article said "CNH sources" concerning Stonehill, so take that as you will.

Yes, so that means absolutely nothing. They are probably the same "CNH sources" that have claimed in that past that at different points that Navy, U of Illinois, and University of Georgia joining the NCAA DI hockey ranks was imminent. When I can't even find rumors online anywhere of anything even suggesting it, it means absolutely nothing.

 

[S E P H]

Yes, so that means absolutely nothing. They are probably the same "CNH sources" that have claimed in that past that at different points that Navy, U of Illinois, and University of Georgia joining the NCAA DI hockey ranks was imminent. When I can't even find rumors online anywhere of anything even suggesting it, it means absolutely nothing.

I think the Georgia rumour is coming from this Georgia Planning New $34M Rink For Club Team - Neutral Zone . However, that was posted in 2020 and I am not sure what/where the progress is concerning it.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

I think the Georgia rumour is coming from this Georgia Planning New $34M Rink For Club Team - Neutral Zone . However, that was posted in 2020 and I am not sure what/where the progress is concerning it.

There were multiple announcements where the school was blatantly clear about it being a community asset and not the future home of a NCAA DI program. CHN chose to take that as "Georgia to NCAA DI is imminent."

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Tennessee State, Nashville Predators reveal fundraising campaign to launch HBCU hockey teams

Athletics director Mikki Allen wore a Tennessee State ice hockey sweater with Predators CEO Sean Henry at his side to announce a fundraising effort

www.tennessean.com

Tennessee State University starts their fundraising campaign to add NCAA DI hockey. Earlier in this thread it was brought up their feasibility studies and partnership with NHL Nashville Predators.

They do not state how much money they have so far or their goal, but they specifically stated they need enough to cover scholarship money as well as an on campus arena, etc.