Confirmed Trade: [MTL/CHI] Kirby Dach for 2022 1st-round (13OA), 2022 3rd-round (66OA)

[Junohockeyfan]

Dach's 3.3M caphit for 3.5 more years is a huge deal for what he is producing and yet to produce. He looked dominant last night and has improved at C.

 

[Goptor]

Here we go again.

A franchise player is by definition someone that a team is building around or has built around, for now that's Suzuki. Maybe it'll shift from Suzuki to Slaf or Bedard.

Franchise player Kevin Hayes!

 

[JRichard]

Dach has been playing really well since being moved back to centre.

So I think it's cheerleading?

Team board discussion imo. Unless something changed after the trade. Imagine bumping in here all trade-draft threads when a guy is playing well

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

How many centers do you see above him right now ?
Let me tell you, he is 23rd best center in the league right now, and there are 32 franchises if I am not mistaken.
And he is 23... On rebuilding team. With linemates younger than him.

At which position was Bergeron drafted ? (Pretending not to know...)

cmon now i love Suzuki but hes not a franchise center

 

[Drumman44]

I am glad to see him excel in Montreal

 

[BHawk21]

Two responses. You're right that I focused too much on their opinion of what a franchise player is.

Second, he has 31 points in 43 games and is 34 years old.

Not sure how that fits franchise forward at this point

because the franchise was built around kane and up until the last 20-25 injured games has produced above a ppg for 15 straight seasons...

 

[BHawk21]

I dont think very many hawks fans are disappointed in trading away Dach still. That is not a shot at Montreal. They can also be happy with the trade.

 

[MXD]

There is a special place in hell for necro bumpers

I'm afraid the easiest way to get rid of necro bumpers is to get rid of the hot takes that bring about necro bumping in the first place.

 

[DevilsHughes86]

I honestly don't get why the Hawks let him go being a team on the rebuild themselves. Fantastic trade for the Habs, the games I've watched he has looked great.

 

[ottawa]

Franchise player Kevin Hayes!

If that's who the Flyers are building around, then sure.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I mean, the Hawks didn't give up on him because of his age. They gave up on him because they didn't believe in him anymore. Which seems to have been the wrong conclusion.

 

[jfhabs]

I dont think very many hawks fans are disappointed in trading away Dach still. That is not a shot at Montreal. They can also be happy with the trade.

I'm a bit puzzled by this and you're not the only one saying it. Is it the teams communication team doing some voodoo alienation or something!?!

Not a shot at the fan base at all.

Hawks management traded away a 21yo guy they had lost confidence on and he turns out to be a good top 6 player the very next season. They had used a much better pick, 3ov, drafting the guy just 3 years before.

At the very least, you guys could've gotten a better return if you waited a little I think?

 

[EquivalentStay]

cmon now i love Suzuki but hes not a franchise center

I HATE the Habs, and Suzuki is without a doubt a franchise center, the guy is a heck of a hockey player.

 

[Canuck Luck]

How many centers do you see above him right now ?
Let me tell you, he is 23rd best center in the league right now, and there are 32 franchises if I am not mistaken.
And he is 23... On rebuilding team. With linemates younger than him.

At which position was Bergeron drafted ? (Pretending not to know...)

Zegras
Keller
Bergeron
Krejici
Thompson
Cozens
Lindholm
Aho
Necas
Mackinnon
Pavelski
Hintz
Larkin
McDavid
Draisaitl
Nugent-Hopkins
Barkov
Eriksson ek
Hughes
Hischier
Barzal
Nelson
Zibanejad
Hayes
Crosby
Malkin
Hertl
Kyrou
Thomas
Stamkos
Point
Matthews
Tavares
Pettersson
Horvat
Miller
Eichel
Stephenson
Kuznetsov
Scheifele

All these centers have been statistically better this season so far. He may be better due to his defensive play than maybe 5 max 10 guys but that still puts him 30th at best

 

[KrakenSabresMike]

I HATE the Habs, and Suzuki is without a doubt a franchise center, the guy is a heck of a hockey player.

There’s a difference between franchise center and 1st line center- these days a real franchise center needs to be above a ppg and a play driver. For example Dylan Cozens is 2 years younger, scores more points, more physical and has great leadership traits - I will call him a great second line Center or a 1b but not a franchise center. There’s only 4-5 real franchise centers in the league - I think this whole calling everybody a franchise center things started with the eichel draft where everyone said there were two franchise centers, which, obviously there were not!

 

[boompuffboom]

ataboy KD! coin coin coin!

 

[Wayfarer13]

i think it's well understood that a #1c is a center who is capable of playing well on the 1st line. it's not someone who just gets put in that role due to a lack of that talent in an organization.

Then one would have need to define what playing well would be.Would it include 32 players or could it be more or less? Then the time period would need to defined.On a given night, to that point in a season, up to the present point in a season or what a player is projected?

 

[jfhabs]

Zegras
Keller
Bergeron
Krejici
Thompson
Cozens
Lindholm
Aho
Necas
Mackinnon
Pavelski
Hintz
Larkin
McDavid
Draisaitl one or the other
Nugent-Hopkins
Barkov
Eriksson ek
Hughes
Hischier
Barzal
Nelson
Zibanejad
Hayes
Crosby
Malkin
Hertl
Kyrou
Thomas
Stamkos
Point
Matthews
Tavares
Pettersson
Horvat
Miller
Eichel
Stephenson
Kuznetsov
Scheifele

All these centers have been statistically better this season so far. He may be better due to his defensive play than maybe 5 max 10 guys but that still puts him 30th at best

A lot of them are not playing center...
I'd also take him ahead of : Zegras, Kreici, Eriksson Ek, Hayes, Tavares, Stephenson, Nelson.

The habs have not much for offense this year. Most of the guys your saying are better are mostly playing with better teams. Suzuki plays the PK and the tougher match up every night. A lot of these guys have the luxury of playing in easier match up. It's a lot more complicated to stop a 2 headed monster.

I think Suzuki is in the 20-30 range when it comes to centers.

 

[BHawk21]

I'm a bit puzzled by this and you're not the only one saying it. Is it the teams communication team doing some voodoo alienation or something!?!

Not a shot at the fan base at all.

Hawks management traded away a 21yo guy they had lost confidence on and he turns out to be a good top 6 player the very next season. They had used a much better pick, 3ov, drafting the guy just 3 years before.

At the very least, you guys could've gotten a better return if you waited a little I think?

We have seen Dach play enough to know hes not a star. The unknown and potential of Nazar is good enough to not have regrets over a solid 50-60 point center. I believe we can get one of those in free agency if Nazar turns out to be better or worse then Dach.

It didnt look like Dach was going to reach his potential here. He looked more Strome then Toews. The management and coaches seemed to have an issue with his effort. Hes in a good spot where he can catch a ride along with some of your talented players and produce. We needed to take a risk to find a guy who could drive play.

There was a chance he would continue to regress with nobody to play with and his value would go lower then 13th overall.

 

[jfhabs]

We have seen Dach play enough to know hes not a star. The unknown and potential of Nazar is good enough to not have regrets over a solid 50-60 point center. I believe we can get one of those in free agency if Nazar turns out to be better or worse then Dach.

It didnt look like Dach was going to reach his potential here. He looked more Strome then Toews. The management and coaches seemed to have an issue with his effort. Hes in a good spot where he can catch a ride along with some of your talented players and produce. We needed to take a risk to find a guy who could drive play.

There was a chance he would continue to regress with nobody to play with and his value would go lower then 13th overall.

I understand and all points are fair. However do you really expect the same management to develop Nazar better? If you ask me, it's poor asset management overall. It might be a little too early to judge the Hawks management, but I'm not a fan so far.

We've seen some of that with the Habs, during Bergevin last few years. Panic signing Hoffman and trading for Dvorak, while letting Danault walk was something...

 

[DevilsHughes86]

I mean, the Hawks didn't give up on him because of his age. They gave up on him because they didn't believe in him anymore. Which seems to have been the wrong conclusion.

It's just weird though, 21 years old at the time of the trade, 3rd overall pick and coming off his best season. I don't know man, maybe something happened with him that we don't know, I just find it weird they would give up on him like that. Good for the Habs I guess.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

I understand and all points are fair. However do you really expect the same management to develop Nazar better? If you ask me, it's poor asset management overall. It might be a little too early to judge the Hawks management, but I'm not a fan so far.

We've seen some of that with the Habs, during Bergevin last few years. Panic signing Hoffman and trading for Dvorak, while letting Danault walk was something...

Different management.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It's just weird though, 21 years old at the time of the trade, 3rd overall pick and coming off his best season. I don't know man, maybe something happened with him that we don't know, I just find it weird they would give up on him like that. Good for the Habs I guess.

Idk, he had 26 points in 70 games last year while playing 18 minutes a night, which ends up with him having a 1.10 5v5 points/60. Among players who played in more than 700 minutes at 5v5 last year, he was 281st of 306 players in terms of 5v5 points/60. That's terrible.

He has improved with Montreal this year but it's honestly not by as much you'd expect. He's at 1.46 5v5 points/60 this year, that ranks 211th of 306 players who have played in 400 or more minutes.

 

[sting101]

I honestly don't get why the Hawks let him go being a team on the rebuild themselves. Fantastic trade for the Habs, the games I've watched he has looked great.

Honestly he's just scratching the surface it was a huge steal for MTL. Not only do big body guys often take longer Dach also had a horrific grotesque injury that hurt his skill development as well as his former baseline.

For a 13th OA in a very weak draft that was some crazy gold mining for MTL. Super smart big strong skilled player. Wish my team got in on that

 

[dirtydanglez]

Then one would have need to define what playing well would be.Would it include 32 players or could it be more or less? Then the time period would need to defined.On a given night, to that point in a season, up to the present point in a season or what a player is projected?

yea there it lots of grey area but i assume most people understand it as play well over a sustained period of time. multiple seasons to make the best case.