Player Discussion Mitch Marner - On Hiatus

[ToneDog]

I'll blame the $2m checker when he blocks our shots in front of an empty net and costs us the series, or when he hangs onto the puck and tried to make plays for himself rather than feed a wide open Matthews who was calling for the puck over and over. shift after shift.
Hyman was a very selfish player as a leaf, some of his 'passes' were when the puck rolled off his stick, else he seldom did.

Matthews is a give an go player on zone entries, but, he'd pass to Hyman, and Hyman would just GO, and never pass back to Matthews.

Hyman on the Leafs top line was just 'bad' except, for a short time when he got moved to the 3rd line and he looked great, and even drove the line, but, Keefe kept putting him back on the top line with players he just didnt fit with.

Hyman may have been all that you say but no way do I blame him for losing us a series. That goes to the guys making all the money. Not one has stepped up and won us a series. They have had good games but they pretty much disappear when it counts. Not winning when you invest half your cap in four forwards and they cannot find a way to score more than one goal in a game #7 or average 2 goals in something like the last 14 playoff games or go 1 for 21 on the PP.

 

[francis246]

Your expectations are the same for 2milly Hyman and 11 milly Marner?

Yes because I don’t nitpick to try and win a strawman argument. If you’re on the top line my expectation is for you to produce. I’m not a fan who gives a shit about salary or money. When I watch sports in general (besides the NHL) salary cap is a non-factor honestly. the NHL is really the only sport where the cap matters this much to fans because of the restrictions placed by the league. But for me, cap hits don’t really factor into whether I like a guy or not. I carry that same feeling throughout all sports.

I’m not sitting there when Robertson does something stupid and say, oh you only make 950k, I’m not as mad, when Marner does something stupid, you make 11 million I’m more mad. I don’t operate like that. My response is equal

 

[IPS]

Yes because I don’t nitpick to try and win a strawman argument. If you’re on the top line my expectation is for you to produce. I’m not a fan who gives a shit about salary or money. Mainly because I’m a sports fan in general and the NHL is really the only sport where the cap matters this much. But for me, cap hits don’t really factor into whether I like a guy or not.

Lol cap hits really dont matter to you?

Fanboying marner must be the easiest job ever. You can just lower the standard however low you need to support any nonsensical argument you want.

 

[notbias]

Hyman may have been all that you say but no way do I blame him for losing us a series. That goes to the guys making all the money. Not one has stepped up and won us a series. They have had good games but they pretty much disappear when it counts. Not winning when you invest half your cap in four forwards and they cannot find a way to score more than one goal in a game #7 or average 2 goals in something like the last 14 playoff games or go 1 for 21 on the PP.

Today I learned that ELCs are not to be criticized at all.

The core only has 5 years of failure because it was Marleau's fault before for taking up too much of the cap.

 

[Madap]

10 years?! I don’t remember Marner being on the 2014/15 Toronto Maple Leafs!?

I barely remember him being on the 23/24 Maple Leafs because the guy is straight up invisible come playoff time.

 

[mydnyte]

Yeah there’s some strange blame game when it comes to Hyman.

I'll be completely honest, and say i really didnt like him on the top line
...any other line I would have liked him or even wanted him to stay, but, he was killing the top line when he was here.

 

[ToneDog]

Today I learned that ELCs are not to be criticized at all.

The core only has 5 years of failure because it was Marleau's fault before for taking up too much of the cap.

It is good to learn something everyday.

 

[Ports]

I'll be completely honest, and say i really didnt like him on the top line
...any other line I would have liked him or even wanted him to stay, but, he was killing the top line when he was here.

Well he’s not killing Edmonton’s top line. So I guess he’s figured it out.

 

[ToneDog]

Well he’s not killing Edmonton’s top line. So I guess he’s figured it out.

Scored a goal off a Bouchard slapshot off his knee. He's definitely figured it out.

 

[Hellcat]

Nobody is saying that ...ok maybe a few. Its a start to fixing this team, not the end of fixing it and most in here understand that whether you want to acknowledge that or not. And you know there is a chance it might not help at all but Im good with trying something somewhat drastic rather than the same old same old. Its a stale product. Something has to give.

The word "nobody" has a specific definition... it is a very absolute, specific measurement, how a word is defined still matters , no?

 

[Ports]

Scored a goal off a Bouchard slapshot off his knee. He's definitely figured it out.

Playoff goals are usually dirty goals. The problem is Marner or Nylander wouldn’t be anywhere near the front of the net to score that goal.

 

[Notsince67]

Hasn't that been the formula since the core 4 were signed? Everything around them changed multiple times including 2 coaches.

I do agree that it was up to Keefe to do something about what was happening and if Marner was too scared of his shadow he should have sat him for a player that wasn't. Now in saying that you would think top 10 salaried players would have their own expectations on how they play and what effort/sacrifice they need to make....At least the non paper tiger stars do anyway.

Chief said one of the reasons he came was because of the core. Why would you presume to know better?

 

[mydnyte]

Lol cap hits really dont matter to you?

Fanboying marner must be the easiest job ever. You can just lower the standard however low you need to support any nonsensical argument you want.

I've been defending Marner all through this thread, not because I'm a fan, but, because I realize what he is and worth.
I was in favor of trading him before he signed the last deal, and am in favor now too, but, only if we get a good enough return.

Fiala (who is basically Marner super-lite) got Faber plus a 1st so, my expectation is a young potential #1D man and a 1st as a bare minimum.

LA just cleared a ton of cap space, a deal starting with Brandt Clarke, a 1st and another decent piece (like Kaliyev) as an example. (i doubt we could get Byfield, though I'd start by asking for him of course)

 

[mydnyte]

Playoff goals are usually dirty goals. The problem is Marner or Nylander wouldn’t be anywhere near the front of the net to score that goal.

Nylander scores the majority of his goals from the slot area ...he isnt an in the crease player, and there is usually only 1-2 per team that ever is

 

[ToneDog]

I've been defending Marner all through this thread, not because I'm a fan, but, because I realize what he is and worth.
I was in favor of trading him before he signed the last deal, and am in favor now too, but, only if we get a good enough return.

Fiala (who is basically Marner super-lite) got Faber plus a 1st so, my expectation is a young potential #1D man and a 1st as a bare minimum.

LA just cleared a ton of cap space, a deal starting with Brandt Clarke, a 1st and another decent piece (like Kaliyev) as an example. (i doubt we could get Byfield, though I'd start by asking for him of course)

LA may have cleared cap space so they can pay Byfield.

 

[HolyCrap]

Lol cap hits really dont matter to you?

Fanboying marner must be the easiest job ever. You can just lower the standard however low you need to support any nonsensical argument you want.

Yup. I laughed up my beer reading that comment. Maybe the dumbest thing ever posted here. Which is a major accomplishment. Marner fanboys are almost as bad as Dubas jock sniffers.

 

[myleafs]

Yes because I don’t nitpick to try and win a strawman argument. If you’re on the top line my expectation is for you to produce. I’m not a fan who gives a shit about salary or money. When I watch sports in general (besides the NHL) salary cap is a non-factor honestly. the NHL is really the only sport where the cap matters this much to fans because of the restrictions placed by the league. But for me, cap hits don’t really factor into whether I like a guy or not. I carry that same feeling throughout all sports.

I’m not sitting there when Robertson does something stupid and say, oh you only make 950k, I’m not as mad, when Marner does something stupid, you make 11 million I’m more mad. I don’t operate like that. My response is equal

Very odd take imo. Why do we pay some players 11+ and others 1+ if they are equal and expectations are equal?

 

[francis246]

I've been defending Marner all through this thread, not because I'm a fan, but, because I realize what he is and worth.
I was in favor of trading him before he signed the last deal, and am in favor now too, but, only if we get a good enough return.

Fiala (who is basically Marner super-lite) got Faber plus a 1st so, my expectation is a young potential #1D man and a 1st as a bare minimum.

LA just cleared a ton of cap space, a deal starting with Brandt Clarke, a 1st and another decent piece (like Kaliyev) as an example. (i doubt we could get Byfield, though I'd start by asking for him of course)

Exactly, I’m indifferent, if we trade Marner and get a good return I’m cool with that. If we keep him, he’s a good player and I’m cool with that. Talent doesn’t grow on trees. Whatever we decide it better be the right call so we can win.

I’ve muted IPS. Defending a player doesn’t mean you’re a fan boy. You can see both sides of the argument without wanting to diminish/devalue who the player is.

 

[notDatsyuk]

What metric shows that games 5, 6, and 7 are harder? Something other than your feelings would be appreciated.

How much harder are they than games 1-4? A percentage will be fine.

Why does Kucherov has points in games 5 and 6, but 0 in game 7? Does this mean that game 7 is much harder than games 5 and 6?

Why don't players care during games 1-4? Wouldn't it make sense to play hard during all the games?

Why would somebody complain about games 5, 6, and 7 being a small sample size, and then immediately use just game 7 as a rebuttal?

 

[francis246]

Very odd take imo. Why do we pay some players 11+ and others 1+ if they are equal and expectations are equal?

What I’m saying is that if I’m watching a game, in that moment I’m not thinking about a players salary. If Marner does something stupid, I’m going to be upset, just like like I’d be upset at any other player on the team.

No one is saying that players don’t have different expectations. But in the heat of the moment when I’m watching a game, if Hyman misses an open net in the playoffs I don’t care if he makes 2 million or 5 million. I’m gonna be pissed. If Marner misses an open net I don’t care if he makes 11 million or 6 million I’m gonna be pissed. I don’t get more mad at one player vs the other

 

[ACC1224]

What I’m saying is that if I’m watching a game, in that moment I’m not thinking about a players salary. If Marner does something stupid, I’m going to be upset, just like like I’d be upset at any other player on the team.

No one is saying that players don’t have different expectations. But in the heat of the moment when I’m watching a game, if Hyman misses an open net in the playoffs I don’t care if he makes 2 million or 5 million. I’m gonna be pissed. If Marner misses an open net I don’t care if he makes 11 million or 6 million I’m gonna be pissed. I don’t get more mad at one player vs the other

It was pretty clear what you meant. Some let the froth and their insecurities cloud their thinking and they just throw out childish rebuttals.

 

[francis246]

It was pretty clear what you meant. Some let the froth and their insecurities cloud their thinking and they just throw out childish rebuttals.

Yeah, thanks. they are purposefully trying to put it out of context to spin it into something I didn’t say lol.

 

[Gabriel426]

If MM signs an extension, can we just have an annual MM off season thread.

 

[ToneDog]

Why would somebody complain about games 5, 6, and 7 being a small sample size, and then immediately use just game 7 as a rebuttal?

Imagine the takes if McDavid does not get a point in game #7 of the SCF. Yeah he got 12 points in games 4-6 but he got nothing in game #7. If only we could say the same about our $11m players.

 

[Gabriel426]

What I’m saying is that if I’m watching a game, in that moment I’m not thinking about a players salary. If Marner does something stupid, I’m going to be upset, just like like I’d be upset at any other player on the team.

No one is saying that players don’t have different expectations. But in the heat of the moment when I’m watching a game, if Hyman misses an open net in the playoffs I don’t care if he makes 2 million or 5 million. I’m gonna be pissed. If Marner misses an open net I don’t care if he makes 11 million or 6 million I’m gonna be pissed. I don’t get more mad at one player vs the other

Cannot agree more, a bad play is a bad play, it doesn’t matter how much the players make.

Don’t understand why people need to defend a players making a bad play.