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Mitch Marner discussion continues

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CantLoseWithMatthews said:
yeah, like when he has an open net and tries to stickhandle past the goalie instead of shooting. Or when he has an open teammate on the rush, and tries to beat multiple opposing defenders. For a supposedly high IQ player, he often misses the right play that helps the team in favour of making the advanced play that makes him look good if he pulls it off
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Some geniuses fail to do basic things. I know this heart surgeon since Uni, he is always smart but he just lacks common sense and no matter how much you teach him, he will keep repeating it. Like drinking soup, he doesn’t understand the concept of moving the soup bowl closer to him. He will drink it with his spoon no matter how far you put the soup from him. He will never move the bowl in front of him. I still play this joke with him whenever we have dinner.
 
SeaOfBlue said:
His complete lack of awareness is what concerns me more. That is a simple read, especially for a guy who is supposed to be as good as he is. I don't even think he knew Gallagher was coming, or thought he would be somewhere else entirely. He looked completely off guard and out of position like he misread the entire situation.

What makes these guys think they will win by fumbling basic plays? This should be second nature for him by now...
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I think he had a very good sense of where Gallagher was coming from...if he didn't think it was Gallagher, it's another Habs player...he also knew where the puck was coming from as it's a standard pass along the boards from his own teammate...he didn't want to be the first to get there because he was afraid of getting hit...as he was skating towards the puck, in his mind he had already decided to give it up, as he turned away from it the last second because he knew someone was coming behind him. What's disappointing is he pretended to care by skating towards the puck having already decided that he wasn't going to be the first one to get it...if he was acting, it's a bad job, because it was so transparent for everyone to see.
 
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Notsince67 said:
Now count on ice goals against
You dont credit 25% shooting percentage as skill. It is luck. Pure and simple. It doesn't change years of proof that Marner is a far superior player. Only liars and fools say he isnt.
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Who disappears when the games count, gets stapled to a generational goal scorer whilst performing his no shows and is vastly overpaid for his unacceptable playoff performance

One player sits on the outside like he's a little boy afraid of contact and the other is willing to get his ass around the net and bang in garbage to get goals

But sure, let's pretend Marners disgusting performance is "luck" not his lack of intestinal fortitude or his unwillingness to go where the action is
 
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Kiwi said:
Who disappears when the games count, gets stapled to a generational goal scorer whilst performing his no shows and is vastly overpaid for his unacceptable playoff performance

One player sits on the outside like he's a little boy afraid of contact and the other is willing to get his ass around the net and bang in garbage to get goals

But sure, let's pretend Marners disgusting performance is "luck" not his lack of intestinal fortitude or his unwillingness to go where the action is
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I keep hearing the “luck” argument. The scorers just “went cold” I guess Mark Stone just went cold as well. Or what actually happened Montreal shuts down good scoring chances and rushes you into attempting poor ones

ah well as long as the xG numbers look good Keefe and Dubas will keep instructing them to do the same crap
 
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Notsince67 said:
Now count on ice goals against
You dont credit 25% shooting percentage as skill. It is luck. Pure and simple. It doesn't change years of proof that Marner is a far superior player. Only liars and fools say he isnt.
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In the regular season - superior player indeed, no debate.

In the playoffs - minimal difference, with Nylander being much better this year. $4M difference.

If the scenario was flipped and Marner had Nylander's stats these playoffs - you absolutely would not be saying it was just luck.
 
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Gabriel426 said:
I don’t get why the constant take down on Willie that you and other Marner fans are constantly showing on this board for no reasons whatsoever. Are you guys that insecure about Marner that you need to constantly put down other players to justify Marner is a good player?
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Personally I don't even see the use in arguing it. Nylander is not supposed to be Marner's peer nor is he paid to be.

Marner's peers are Point, Rantanen Aho and Barzal. Never mind Nylander being superior to Marner in the playoffs - those guys have been leagues better than Marner when it matters most.
 
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IPS said:
Personally I don't even see the use in arguing it. Nylander is not supposed to be Marner's peer nor is he paid to be.

Marner's peers are Point, Rantanen Aho and Barzal. Never mind Nylander being superior to Marner in the playoffs - those guys have been leagues better than Marner when it matters most.
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Exactly. Marner is the 2nd highest paid winger in the league, his comparable should Kuch, Panarin and Ovie.
 
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Superstar said:
Him and Matthews also have full NMC in the final year of their contracts (Marner the final 2 years)...what kind of joke is that? So you can't even trade these young guys in their final years when they might leave as UFAs...when did they earn those rights and why do they need them at their age?
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Dubas gave them the moon and then some. NMC, short deals, tons of $$$ all for players who haven't proven squat. Couldn't make it out of the Micky Mouse North Division (let alone the first round) and with great deals like Hyman coming off the book with no replacement in sight, I'm not confident we can hang with teams like Florida, Boston, or Tampa. Honestly I can see us being a wild card team next year.
 
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Kiwi said:
Who disappears when the games count, gets stapled to a generational goal scorer whilst performing his no shows and is vastly overpaid for his unacceptable playoff performance

One player sits on the outside like he's a little boy afraid of contact and the other is willing to get his ass around the net and bang in garbage to get goals

But sure, let's pretend Marners disgusting performance is "luck" not his lack of intestinal fortitude or his unwillingness to go where the action is
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Marner took more hits as well as gave more hits while playing outside the kiddie pool against the biggest and strongest of the habs
 
IPS said:
In the regular season - superior player indeed, no debate.

In the playoffs - minimal difference, with Nylander being much better this year. $4M difference.

If the scenario was flipped and Marner had Nylander's stats these playoffs - you absolutely would not be saying it was just luck.
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I think willie is decent. 25% shooting % is lucky
 
Willchel Marlynder said:
Honestly who cares? In series clinching games Nylander has 3 goals in 7, Matthews 1 goal, and Marner 1 Assist (and 2 PIM 0 goals). Enough with the luck talk. Some players are able to rise to the occasion and some are not.
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Yeah...lets choose to keep Willy over a top 5 point scorer in the league because we know he will shoot 25% in all future playoffs.
 
Willchel Marlynder said:
Honestly who cares? In series clinching games Nylander has 3 goals in 7, Matthews 1 goal, and Marner 1 Assist (and 2 PIM 0 goals). Enough with the luck talk. Some players are able to rise to the occasion and some are not.
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None of them have risen.
 
Notsince67 said:
Yeah...lets choose to keep Willy over a top 5 point scorer in the league because we know he will shoot 25% in all future playoffs.
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Nylander could have shot at 1% over the past 18 playoff games and STILL would have had more goals than Marner... I'm happy Marner's regular season numbers are good enough for you. However most people here are looking at value and as it stands Marner is overpriced given his lack of finishing ability in general but especially in the playoffs. This is a salary cap system you can't expect to compete if you're paying wingers 11M for 1 goal in 3 playoff series.

ACC1224 said:
None of them have risen.
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If 3 points in games 5, 6, and 7 while playing a brand of playoff hockey isn't rising to the occasion than your expectations are too high. We can't have people saying Nylander is overpaid, and then in the same breath have expectations that he goes 1.5PPG in the playoffs while being a Selke Candidate player.
 
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Willchel Marlynder said:
Nylander could have shot at 1% over the past 18 playoff games and STILL would have had more goals than Marner... I'm happy Marner's regular season numbers are good enough for you. However most people here are looking at value and as it stands Marner is overpriced given his lack of finishing ability in general but especially in the playoffs. This is a salary cap system you can't expect to compete if you're paying wingers 11M for 1 goal in 3 playoff series.



If 3 points in games 5, 6, and 7 while playing a brand of playoff hockey isn't rising to the occasion than your expectations are too high. We can't have people saying Nylander is overpaid, and then in the same breath have expectations that he goes 1.5PPG in the playoffs while being a Selke Candidate player.
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My expectations are high for all of them not just Nylander. He still does a lot of the things the others are blamed for he just happened to put up a few points this time.
 
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ACC1224 said:
My expectations are high for all of them not just Nylander. He still does a lot of the things the others are blamed for he just happened to put up a few points this time.
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Agreed.
Which is why in addition to the cap change of moving a player it is also a core change as the sum of the parts suffer from all the same issues.
It’s not Simmonds or Thornton.
We need to find a completely different core player in this system who has completely different elements.
 
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ACC1224 said:
My expectations are high for all of them not just Nylander. He still does a lot of the things the others are blamed for he just happened to put up a few points this time.
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This series was the best 7 games I have ever seen from Nylander, never seen him compete so hard for pucks and engage physically. Hopefully he saw for himself what results he garners when he plays like that and we see it every game going forward. But it was much more than just "happening to put up a few points", he looked determined to make something happen every shift and played a mature game. He played great and deserves credit for it.
 
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