Salary Cap: Mitch Marner Contract Discussion Part VIII | We Waitin'

[Rymistri]

Ok Paul



lol

Do do dodo do do do do do do do

This Islanders never made sense to me. Are they going to overpay Marner to get him to sign and then try and get Barzal to take less?

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Ok Paul



lol

Do do dodo do do do do do do do

I would take their 4 1st round picks and run laughing hysterically to the bank

 

[therealkoho]

excellent point Mess

 

[TheDoldrums]

Food for thought comparing Leafs current RFA spending to NHL cap usage.

Kapanan and AJ just resigned for ~$7 mil combined and Marner is asking for $11 mil to sign = $18 mil cap.

Lets compare that to other teams.

TB: Kucherov ($9.5 mil) + Stamkos ($8.5 mil) = $18 mil Cap
PIT: Malkin ($9.5 mil) + Crosby ($8.7 mil) = $18.2 Cap
WAS: OV ($9.54 mil) + Kuz ($7.8 mil) = $17.34 mil
BOS: Entire top line = $19.6 mil

So Leafs new RFA signings are going to be for about the same amount of cap as Eastern conference top players and their competition for the Cup in the playoffs.

lol why are you going to two decimal points on Ovechkins AAV but Kappy/Johnsson's $6.6 million is rounded up to $7.

 

[YearsintheWilderness]

Now Mitch needs a new contract and the Marner's feel like they want to be the #1 star in Toronto. THE guy. The highest paid Leaf, along with the most important piece and face of the franchise. Along with being the Captain.

They must have zero self-awareness. Sure, he can score. But wearing the C is about a lot more than that. His goofball persona just doesn't cut it. I highly doubt he is currently the type of player that his team-mates look up to and consider a leader. Not only that, but he's got a pretty high cringe factor in front of the camera. He's like a thin version of Kessel, without the charm.

 

[IPS]

lol why are you going to two decimal points on Ovechkins AAV but Kappy/Johnsson's $6.6 million is rounded up to $7.

Because that's the sort of subtle dishonesty that drive discussions.

Leafs fans can't escape the BS no matter where they go apparantly.

They must have zero self-awareness. Sure, he can score. But wearing the C is about a lot more than that. His goofball persona just doesn't cut it. I highly doubt he is currently the type of player that his team-mates look up to and consider a leader. Not only that, but he's got a pretty high cringe factor in front of the camera. He's like a thin version of Kessel, without the charm.

I tend to agree with this. You look at a guy like Rielly and you think captain material right away. You look at a guy like Marner and you do not have the same sentiment.

 

[MattySnipes]

Why is it ok for UFA and not RFA?

Personally, to me, I don't have a problem with both classes going to market. UFA is the traditional time to see what your worth, but hockey also has RFA and with concentration on young players last decade and how good they are so soon I understand why they want to see what's out there.

Regards to Matthews being bothered by Mitch getting 11, he wouldn't be mad at Mitch. He'd be so happy because they're like brothers. I still feel he would be upset more so at management and he'd probably let his agent know and the next negotiations (5 years) would only become tougher.

 

[ShaneFalco]

 

[Mr Hockey]

Why is it ok for UFA and not RFA?

The original team has invested a lot of time and money in developing the young (RFA) players and it helps the not so good organizations hold on to the young stars' longer

 

[57 Years No Cup]

After remembering your posts in the Nylander threads, this is an extreme version of 'pot meet kettle' take

I think you have me confused with someone else. At no point was I ever a Nylander "hater". However I suppose that as a member of the WNFC you see any faint criticism of Willie as "hate". It's hard to see the middle when you're so far to one side.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

If some of your closer comparables sign contracts that they go on to hate... why would you sign the same/similar contract? Why would you expect the player to be willing to sign such a contract?

It DOES work both ways too, so yes... Buffalo will likely regret the Skinner contract. A GM can't say: "Schiefele gets 6, you must get 6" and an agent can't say "Skinner got 9, so we must get 9". No, you look at the big picture.

The point I was making is that 8x11 would likely be fair value for Marner, still. Accounting for inflation, and given that there is a very good chance that Kucherov's services will be worth much more than the salary he's earning, and that Marner has demonstrated to be a better player at this respective stage of their careers (U22 season), etc... there are a lot of rational and logical reasons Marner can demand such a contract.

U22 years? Compare Kapanen and Johnson’s u22 years. Why did that have no bearing on their contracts?

I also like how on your original post, you bring up KUCHEROV regretting his contract, but no such context given to Skinner contract and how a gm will regret it.

In other words, you appear to have a bias towards rationalizing a Marner overpayment.

 

[Coatsy79]

Who'd have thought it was easier to sign the American kid from the desert than to sign the lifelong, "dreams really do come true" local golden boy leaf fan

‍‍‍‍‍

 

[IPS]

I would take their 4 1st round picks and run laughing hysterically to the bank

When the Isle's next-level goaltending dried up they looked very average. That is a team who's 1st round pick you'd love for 4 consecutive years.

 

[X66]

Dreger seems extra upset since he led the "John Tavares will not sign in Toronto" crusade.

Don't think he enjoyed the egg on the face.

 

[The CyNick]

I don’t believe that is true for a second.

Dubas would heavily lean on the Kucherov contract.

Signed several years ago. Deals quickly become obsolete. No question the leafs would bring it up, but signing the matthews deal changed the game. This is a player without an 80 point season who was given in reality more than McDavid.

 

[Amadeus]

He's an outstanding young player who we drafted and developed. In addition, he's asking to be paid fairly! It's a business at the end of the day.

You sign and retain him at all reasonable cost. If we need to match the deal Auston signed for, then you bite your lip and do it because he's that good.

I'd rather trade Kadri, Brown to create that added space because I think Mitch is not even a finished product yet.

Yes, we'll be hurting our team's depth, but Kadri and Brown both had subpar years last season. We can replace Brown with Trevor Moore who will produce similarly, and I'm not really sure we desperately need Kadri's offense. We can replace him with a two-way C on the 3rd line who may chip in offensively but can be pre-dominantly a defensive specialist - perhaps a Roope Hintz.

 

[ShaneFalco]

He's an outstanding young player who we drafted and developed. In addition, he's asking to be paid fairly! It's a business at the end of the day.

You sign and retain him at all reasonable cost. If we need to match the deal Auston signed for, then you bite your lip and do it because he's that good.

I'd rather trade Kadri, Brown to create that added space because I think Mitch is not even a finished product yet.

Yes, we'll be hurting our team's depth, but Kadri and Brown both had subpar years last season. We can replace Brown with Trevor Moore who will produce similarly, and I'm not really sure we desperately need Kadri's offense. We can replace him with a two-way C on the 3rd line who may chip in offensively but can be pre-dominantly a defensive specialist - perhaps a Roope Hintz.

No he isn't, not at all or it would have been done.
He's a great player, he's flashier than AM, but not the better player at all. And he plays the wing

It is a business, so all that drafted and developed, bleeds-blue, wants to win here shyte goes out the window

 

[biotk]

So those thinking this Marner OS will cause a chain reaction of OS potentially, its not happening in terms of our Leafs anyways, because Leafs dealt their 2020 or 2021 pick away in the Marleau deal which now disqualifies Toronto for the next 2 years from submitting any OS themselves that would involve a 1st round pick as compensation.

They will be fine for any OS that requires two 1sts. But, they would be stupid to put in an offer sheet. The only reason to put in an offersheet is to land a massive talent because your team doesn't have one. The Leafs have several. They need to fix holes - badly.

 

[MyBudJT]

U22 years? Compare Kapanen and Johnson’s u22 years. Why did that have no bearing on their contracts?

I also like how on your original post, you bring up KUCHEROV regretting his contract, but no such context given to Skinner contract and how a gm will regret it.

In other words, you appear to have a bias towards rationalizing a Marner overpayment.

I think it did have a bearing on their contracts (Kappy being younger / more upside). Kapanen signed the "better" contract, in that he signed for pretty well the same AAV on less term.

I already mentioned I was largely being facetious with the Skinner statement. And I've also conceeded it works both ways to you multiple times. Not sure why that is still an 'issue' for you. Also, I wasn't the first to bring up Kucherov. I was responding to someone that was comparing Marner to Kucherov. In case that wasn't clear to you.

 

[Amadeus]

No he isn't, not at all or it would have been done.
He's a great player, he's flashier than AM, but not the better player at all. And he plays the wing

It is a business, so all that drafted and developed, bleeds-blue, wants to win here shyte goes out the window

His worth is shown already on the PP and the PK.

I love Auston. He's our C but he doesn't play on the PK at all. Marner is a threat both ways and has outscored Auston this season and still has untapped potential.

 

[Mr Hockey]

I would take their 4 1st round picks and run laughing hysterically to the bank

Leafs are trying to win a cup in the next 5 years, those 1st round picks will be useless unless used in a trade

 

[stopclickbait]

After remembering your posts in the Nylander threads, this is an extreme version of 'pot meet kettle' take

Yup very true lol Search Results for Query: nylander | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League

 

[The CyNick]

Stamkos isn't a TOP centre anymore. Point has taken him over tbh. Matthews is already better than Stamkos.

Right now Point is better. But when Kuch sighed, Stamkos was the top centre.

Using your logic, Kuch should not have been able to get paid more than Stammer based on position.

Ovi is the highest paid player in Wash.

Good players should get paid, regardless of position.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

It’s funny there’s a few posters who will defend each and every move Babcock does and any sort of criticism comes from “clueless fans”
There’s one or two in the Marner boat too

And the Nylander boat is going to capsize due to overcapacity....

 

[The CyNick]

Sounds like someone who doesn't understand you need skill to win.