Mirtle: End is near for Hyman in Toronto

[PromisedLand]

Trade Marner for Eichel and use the savings to put towards Hyman

If somehow we are able to pull this off..... assuming sabres will take marner's contract


Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
Tavares-Eichel-XXX (see if we can get Burkovsky ?)
B. Saad-Engvall-Mikheyev
Robertson-Brooks-Spezza

I can live with that.....

Kerfoot out to Kraken (Kerfoot has grown on me though)

 

[JayfromNB1219]

Okay. I am 100% convinced that you're not a Leafs fan and you're just trolling.

Def a leafs fan but also an absolute troll…this is the same one who called another poster homophobic because they had the “nerve” to laugh at the rainbow leafs logo…not worth the time to respond to as they are here purely to sow division

 

[PromisedLand]

Brodie and Muzzin are signed to reasonable contracts. Matthews and Marner created a cap crunch, by being overpaid $2-3M collectively.

That is Dubas' fault. Players can demand the world that doesnt mean GM has to bendover and hand it to them.

Dubas is the only guy to blame here

 

[KuleminFan41]

Hyman over the past 2 years in 94 regular season games played has totaled 35 goals, and only Matthews, Tavares and Nylander have scored more and he is doing for the bargain basement price of $2,250,000. That is a .37 goals/game pace or 30-31 goals on a full 82 games season. So what is the market for a 30 goal capable pace player?

However now when its time for a raise to reward that level of contribution the Leafs cap heavy top 4 salary cap once again is going to squeeze the middle out as they let him walk for affordability reasons and they once again will be forced to go diving for bargain basement lower priced players that can replace Hyman and his goal and other contribution.

Similarly how Kapanen and Johnson were squeezed out last year after they proved to +20 goal capable middle team players but their $3 mils newly signed 1 year old deals became too expensive and they were dealt for futures in picks and prospects and their offense not replaced by the Thornton, Simmonds, Vesey, Boyd and Engval types brought in.

Previously how the JVR and Kadri and Connor Brown types forced out and cheaper solutions required.

Leafs cap Hell and Top 4 forwards continue to put the squeeze on the middle creating a perpetual "Have and Have Nots" annually with a rotating door where these cheaper contracts that surround the core are expected not only to replace the former production, but apparently expected to fix the Leafs and make them more Cup competitive in the process.

Its not hard to pinpoint why the Leafs continue to spin their wheels and become less and less Cup competitive with each passing year with this type of cap management strategy.

This is kind of ridiculous dude. Hyman is 29 years old and never scored more than 21 goals scored in a season. Being on pace doesn't really mean anything , especially at that age, no one tends to blow up and become a 30 goal scorer. You're cherry picking stats a tad here because Marner has 36 goals in the past 2 seasons , so Hyman didnt out score him. Hyman had 1 point in 7 playoff games this past season and 4 points in his last 13 games, thats pathetic for the guy you're bigging up as a 30 goal scorer and was stapled to Auston Matthews for nearly 5 seasons. He had 15 goals and 33 points last season, pretty solid for a contract year, but to put it into perspective, Spezza had 10 goals and 30 points in the season and 5 points in the playoffs. Kerfoot had 8 goals and 23 points in the season and 6 points in the playoffs. And neither had nearly the amount of ice time or line mates Hyman gets either.

Don't get me wrong, I like Hyman but you don't overpay for "solid' players like him , especially with his 5 points in 19 playoff games. That's just pathetic for a "30 goal capable" player.

 

[JayfromNB1219]

You’re not even a Leafs fan so you’re allowed to think what you like

And you are lol? All I’ve seen from you is you going at other posters for stupid sht that has nothing to really do with the team…so you calling another poster “not a fan” is entertaining to me

 

[Racer88]

Players don't get paid during the playoffs.
Marner has been among the league leaders for points for the last few seasons.
I get you are passionate about trying to blame someone for Marner's contract but blaming someone for finding good value is an odd concept for me. yes he gets paid a lot but he also is among the leagues elite point producers and good without the puck and good on the PK.

McDavid is considered a value contract but is one dimensional, if he has the puck he is electric, with out the puck he's not a great player. He can't play well in his own end and does not play PK. Marner does everything and is top 5 in scoring.

So rack up crazy points, have one dimension to your game your a great player and he is a great player. Play in all 3 zones in any possible condition and score among the top 4 in the league and your contract is an albatross? What exactly are the Leafs waiting for?

I know they don’t get paid in the playoffs but that is irrelevant. In a fixed cap his massive contract no matter how well he plays in the regular season prevents them but building better at other positions now compound that by the fact he has been awful in the playoffs. Unless you don’t consider the playoffs important

 

[Bluelines]

It's not about skill. The guy plays like a boy in the playoffs. How long till he grows up already? You also don't get that the regular season is just a warmup for the playoffs. I couldn't care less how many points he scored in the regular season. Matthews doesn't get a pass either.

He is a boy, he's 23 years old. When I was 23, the most pressure I was in was deciding Big Mac or Whopper.

 

[PromisedLand]

Totally agree, dubas needs to pivot and trade marner. The flat cap will not work having tied up so much money in 4 forwards. To stay the course is ignorance of the highest order. But something tells me his ego will get in the way of any big changes.

You have to put things in context.

Matthews and Nylander UFA in about 3 years; Rielly next season. No guarantees that Matthews/Nylander re-sign with the Leafs.

Leafs gotta take a solid run in these 3 years with 3 kicks at the can. Marner has shown nothing of value.

Dubas refuses to rectify his mistakes. It would be a colloasal failure if Leafs dont even make the playoffs the next 3 seasons (or lose again and again in the 1st round) and then Nylander/Matthews walk as UFA.

Dubas has ruined the Leafs to such an extent that it will be hard to be a competitive team.

Now when you see when Dubas got handed the GM position on a silver platter where the team was trending and how much cap space we had you can see how much of a LOSER Dubas really is

 

[Racer88]

He is a boy, he's 23 years old. When I was 23, the most pressure I was in was deciding Big Mac or Whopper.

We’re you making 11.6 million dollars per year to provide success for your team

 

[Bluelines]

I know they don’t get paid in the playoffs but that is irrelevant. In a fixed cap his massive contract no matter how well he plays in the regular season prevents them but building better at other positions now compound that by the fact he has been awful in the playoffs. Unless you don’t consider the playoffs important

Does Matthews's massive contract prevent them from building a better team?
Does Tavares's massive contract prevent them from building a better team?
Does Andersen's massive contract prevent them from building a better team?
Does Nylander's massive contract prevent them from building a better team?

Why is it just Marners contract that is a problem?

 

[member 298589]

I can say the same for you, clearly you have a strong bias that you can't see past. I guess you are prime example of "people see what they want to see". Cheers.

And with this, I would recommend you read about the "bias blind spot" phenomenon.

*clinks glass*

 

[Bluelines]

We’re you making 11.6 million dollars per year to provide success for your team

Won their division, top 4 in scoring. That sounds like success eh? Why is only Marners responsibility to wear the goat horns? McDavid who makes $12.5 million per year, has had what sort of success?

 

[Bluelines]

And with this, I would recommend you read about the "bias blind spot" phenomenon.

*clinks glass*

I'm surprised someone afflicted by said bias would know about it? Your aware of what your bias is called but can't admit you have a bias, odd.

 

[Craig Button]

Dubas' overpayments are killing this team...the flat cap definitely doesn't help...Matthews $1 to $1.5 million overpaid...Marner $1 to $2 million overpaid, Nylander $500K overpaid...even Muzzin is several hundred thousand overpaid...that's $2 million of cap space right there...just keep squeezing guys out like Kapanen, Johnsson (though I think Dubas held onto him too long and should have traded him when his value was high), and now Hyman...is Rielly the next to be squeezed out?

30 goals and 40 assists that’s about 100 points.

 

[Nylander88]

Ok, see ya. Did nothing in the first round. Don’t blame it on the injuries. How long does it take to get things going?
3rd line player that was force fed 1st line minutes.

While I love Hyman and what he brings, there is definitely undertones of what you're saying that I agree with 100%. Hyman needs to realize the situation he's in here with the top end talent that he's able to play with. And yes, other teams may put you with one of their good players, or maybe even two of them...but it may not click the same, there's never a guarantee of that. Furthermore, I do agree with the 3rd liner statement to a degree as well. Him allegedly being worth more than 5 or maybe even 6...yikes. I don't want that contract for a grinder who has been having injury issues. Is there that big of a gap between him and guys like Coleman, Goodrow, Foligno? I don't think so at all. I think all those players would play well up with Matthews & Marner (a healthy Foligno had 4 points in 4 games with Matthews and Marner before injury, then was never on that line again). I'd rather have Coleman & Goodrow at a combined 5-6 mil, than 1 Zach Hyman. So I'm fine if he walks away as part of the shakeup. Would also look to move Rielly. If the core 4 are to stay, there needs a major shakeup around the edges

 

[PromisedLand]

Matthews 3rd highest paid player, 5th highest scorer (points)
Tavares 5th highest paid player, 25th highest scorer (points)
Marner 7th highest paid player, 4th highest scorer (points)

What I find odd is people are targeting on Marner for his playoff choke with no consideration for his amazing regular season but Matthews has an equally bad playoffs but gets a pass because he had an amazing regular season?

What I find odd is people are saying its Marner's salary that is preventing us from signing Hyman but Marner's salary is better value compared to Tavares and Matthews.

Odd how a narrative starts and fans are willing to accept it with out critically questioning the logic....

Gm1: Marner gives away the puck on the PP Leafs have to exit the zone; then while entering habs get a break and score a shorty

Gm1: Marner over the glass penalty for no f***ing reason

Gm6: No one around Marner and once again he f***ing puts the puck out giving habs 5 on 3 advantage and they score

Gm7: score tied 0-0, Marner f***ing gives away the puck on offensive blue line and habs transition to score the goal


There are other BS plays but these 4 plays were the most impactful plays where Leafs got screwed. Not only Marner is not f***ing scoring but he is making plays where Leafs get scored on. That is the definition of USELESS

 

[koyvoo]

Gonna lose a heart and soul warrior because we overpay two gutless fakers. That’s the short and tall of it.

 

[Suntouchable13]

He is a boy, he's 23 years old. When I was 23, the most pressure I was in was deciding Big Mac or Whopper.

Oh ok, great, but you weren’t being paid 10.9 per year. He is expected to be a man in the playoffs. Both Matthews and him were dogshit. They have to own it.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

OK so with that logic, him giving money back improved the team how?

I don't know. It's not McDavid's job to figure out how to allocate the extra cap room he seemingly gave the GM, nor is it his fault if it was misallocated.

 

[Suntouchable13]

While I love Hyman and what he brings, there is definitely undertones of what you're saying that I agree with 100%. Hyman needs to realize the situation he's in here with the top end talent that he's able to play with. And yes, other teams may put you with one of their good players, or maybe even two of them...but it may not click the same, there's never a guarantee of that. Furthermore, I do agree with the 3rd liner statement to a degree as well. Him allegedly being worth more than 5 or maybe even 6...yikes. I don't want that contract for a grinder who has been having injury issues. Is there that big of a gap between him and guys like Coleman, Goodrow, Foligno? I don't think so at all. I think all those players would play well up with Matthews & Marner (a healthy Foligno had 4 points in 4 games with Matthews and Marner before injury, then was never on that line again). I'd rather have Coleman & Goodrow at a combined 5-6 mil, than 1 Zach Hyman. So I'm fine if he walks away as part of the shakeup. Would also look to move Rielly. If the core 4 are to stay, there needs a major shakeup around the edges

It’s just that as a fan I am really frustrated at the playoff failure this year. I am sick of these guys not performing when it counts. Maybe I am being overly harsh on the players because of it.

 

[forecheck]

This team is going to miss the playoffs next year.

Very Likely ... Then hopefully upper Management cleans house and the franchise can move on from this mess.

 

[koyvoo]

Gm1: Marner gives away the puck on the PP Leafs have to exit the zone; then while entering habs get a break and score a shorty

Gm1: Marner over the glass penalty for no f***ing reason

Gm6: No one around Marner and once again he f***ing puts the puck out giving habs 5 on 3 advantage and they score

Gm7: score tied 0-0, Marner f***ing gives away the puck on offensive blue line and habs transition to score the goal


There are other BS plays but these 4 plays were the most impactful plays where Leafs got screwed. Not only Marner is not f***ing scoring but he is making plays where Leafs get scored on. That is the definition of USELESS

The measuring stick for what’s acceptable shouldn’t be Marner’s performance. Being marginally better than Marner’s playoff performance is still very poor.

Matthews only measuring stick should be himself. Aside from some fleeting moments, he has played and produced below his abilities and standards when games matters and opponents give max effort every shift. Not even close to his standards and abilities.

If he played for a rival, we would be completely digging him, and we’d be absolutely 100% in doing so.

 

[Bluelines]

I don't know. It's not McDavid's job to figure out how to allocate the extra cap room he seemingly gave the GM, nor is it his fault if it was misallocated.

Who job is it to figure our the line up?

 

[Bluelines]

Oh ok, great, but you weren’t being paid 10.9 per year. He is expected to be a man in the playoffs. Both Matthews and him were dogshit. They have to own it.

I think they both gave YE interviews and said as much. What is your definition of a man in the playoffs?

 

[keonsbitterness]

He is a boy, he's 23 years old. When I was 23, the most pressure I was in was deciding Big Mac or Whopper.

Whopper. Always Whopper.