- Nov 7, 2017
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lol...Zucc's current market value is $7.5 million, according to Capfriendly. And Foligno's is 2.9 million. So yeah his extension is a bit of an overpayment, while Zucc's deal is really cheap.
Minnesota Wild General Discussion - 2023-24
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- Mar 19, 2023
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he’s definitely not a guy who belongs on waivers, but he isn’t worth 7.5M. I doubt a team in the league would pay him $6M. He gives up just as much as he scores.
Dr Jan Itor
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Zucc's contract ends the same summer as Kaprizov.
Foligno's NMC ends that same summer, and Hartman's the summer before.
MuckOG
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- May 18, 2012
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There was no need to sign players like Foligno, Hartman and Gaudreau before the season. Better move would be to let the season play out and make these decisions during or after the season. Even worse was giving them the no trade clauses.
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If Billy is set on those players, wait and see how it goes. If they have a down year, you get them cheaper. Cheaper hoping for a rebound year vs expensive with a no move hoping for a rebound year…
Guerin seemed to think that a 33yo, 25 pt. Foligno with a recent history of taking bad penalties in the playoffs would be getting offers of 5/25M, otherwise why jump the gun almost a full year earlier and sign him for 4/16M?
Hartman you can actually argue is deserved, but adding the NMC takes away away flexibility trade wise. You should only add those if you have to.
I'm fine with the Zucc deal. 2 x 4M is a bargain for him, but again, that NMC... he would be a valued commodity on the trade market for a playoff contender.
Added together, these contracts without NMC's would be ok(Zucc +/Foligno -)for a regular team with regular cap worries. For our team, with it's 15M cap penalties next year, they are not smart, as we are not going to be able to compete as Cup contenders, and should be looking to get younger, not older, and loading up on younger players. The NMC's could've brought in something like two 1sts and a 2nd at the TDL, IMO. It would be a bold move because you're stripping down your team, but that's adding a lot to your prospect pool/future, and are 33-36 yo foligno, 30's Hartman, and 50 yo Zucc really all that valuable going forward? Are they really the difference between us contending, or not? I would say that it's been proven that they are not, as their younger, better iterations did not get it done.
Another guy they need to consider moving this summer is Spurgeon, once his NMC is over and his NTC kicks in. Love him, but he is fading, and is slightly overpaid. We will miss him, but Faber has proven that he is good enough to be the #1RD, against all odds, so I would love to see if we can get another first for Spurge, and also see what we can get with the extra 7.5M.
All this is assuming that this year and the next will not be ones in which we can compete for a Cup. I am looking forward to 25-26.
Hartman you can actually argue is deserved, but adding the NMC takes away away flexibility trade wise. You should only add those if you have to.
I'm fine with the Zucc deal. 2 x 4M is a bargain for him, but again, that NMC... he would be a valued commodity on the trade market for a playoff contender.
Added together, these contracts without NMC's would be ok(Zucc +/Foligno -)for a regular team with regular cap worries. For our team, with it's 15M cap penalties next year, they are not smart, as we are not going to be able to compete as Cup contenders, and should be looking to get younger, not older, and loading up on younger players. The NMC's could've brought in something like two 1sts and a 2nd at the TDL, IMO. It would be a bold move because you're stripping down your team, but that's adding a lot to your prospect pool/future, and are 33-36 yo foligno, 30's Hartman, and 50 yo Zucc really all that valuable going forward? Are they really the difference between us contending, or not? I would say that it's been proven that they are not, as their younger, better iterations did not get it done.
Another guy they need to consider moving this summer is Spurgeon, once his NMC is over and his NTC kicks in. Love him, but he is fading, and is slightly overpaid. We will miss him, but Faber has proven that he is good enough to be the #1RD, against all odds, so I would love to see if we can get another first for Spurge, and also see what we can get with the extra 7.5M.
All this is assuming that this year and the next will not be ones in which we can compete for a Cup. I am looking forward to 25-26.
Why did I think Zucc's was a 3 year contract? Both have modified NTC though ...
Zucc's is a 2 year full NMC contract.
Hartman is 3 year contract with 1 year full NMC followed by 2 years 15 team NTC. It added a NMC to this current season.
Foligno is a 4 year contract. 2 year NMC followed by 2 years of 15 team NTC. It added a NMC to this current season.
Spurgeon has negative value at his full cap hit.
You've NEVER liked Spurgeon. A team like EDM would love to have him, as would many others.
I mean, if he is out for another 6 weeks or so then it will affect his value, but in general, he is a top 25 D, and a RHD two way D at that. Those guys are in short supply.
I've never liked his contract. It's more of an overpay in money and term than what Foligno was given.
There aren't teams that want a $7.5m x 3, 2nd pair (4D really), pp2, pk2, 35 yo, injury prone, RD that is useless in the Playoffs. Burns @ $5.28m x 3 only got a 3rd + stuff as a reference point.
Spurgeon isn't a top-25D, I don't even know if he would be in the top-50 when healthy. There are a lot of young d-men coming into their own. He's not even top-2 on the Wild for d-men.
EDM doesn't need Spurgeon they have Bouchard. The things EDM needs from MN is last year's version of Gus, JEE, and Brodin (instead of Nurse).
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
Spurgeon's contract was a slight overpay, but got a lot worse when the pandemic happened and the cap locked for a couple years.
I agree with everything said here except Zucc having value at 4 million for the next 2 years. He is only useful on the PP. He’s basically Addison at wing. He provides no value anywhere on the ice at this point aside from the pp.
This is basically the definition of a $4m/yr playmaking wing. Play about even at 5v5 and add a bunch of PP points. If you get to be $100k per point for a FWD it's usually makes for a fair contract.
Foligno has only topped 30p once in his career. He has some intangibles that offset the lack of scoring, but it's not enough to make up the difference in the $4m he is going to get paid.
Wasted Talent
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- Aug 9, 2011
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In Foligno's defence, two of his best years coincided with shortened covid seasons. He played at a ~0.5 PPG pace in 172 games between 2019 and 2022.
Of course it made no sense for Guerin to reward him for those years now, but it is what it is.
I can also see why other teams may place some value in him. I just can’t myself having to watch him. It sucks , the effort is there. He’s just aging out quickly, his intelligence keeps him relative on the man advantage where he has some space to use his brain. Everywhere else though it’s a rough ride
True, but like you said, that was in the past. He's not really a bastion of health and coming off of a down year. His new deal just isn't a contract that you sign before the season even starts.
Freddy G is a player that is well worth his contract. I just don't like him on the team.
TBF this whole team is pretty unwatchable this year. It was mostly unwatchable last year when Kap wasn't on the ice.
21-22 to 22-23 was the ultimate rug pull. We had such an awesome exciting perfect non Minnesota team. The end result was perfectly Minnesota but what an awesome regular season. Then in the blink of an eye right back to struggling mediocrity.
- Nov 7, 2017
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In other words, a point per game player is worth $8M, fits well with Zucc's value based on the evaluation by both Capfriendly and The Athletic. A 50% discount on his new contract, in return I'd say Guerin won't trade him.
So it's sad to see the trash talking by some fans. Zucc playing a game with a broken bone in his arm shows how much he cares for this team. He started this closed door meeting the other day, Russo said. And he was very vocal in there. It really helped, a very different team came out against the Islanders.
With all this, Zucc earns a lot of respect from his teammates, they listen to him. To have a leader like this on a very teamfriendly contract is something you should be happy about.
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
$4M per year is just fine for a complimentary winger that is hurt a lot, but does have offensive instincts/abilities.
What's the record for closed door meetings in a season, because wasn't this our 3rd or 4th?
What's the record for closed door meetings in a season, because wasn't this our 3rd or 4th?
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