Minnesota Wild General Discussion - 2023-24

[Spurgeon]

Really one Soucy level defender from being capable of getting back to closer to the level they've been at for the previous 5-10 years (which is IMO a top 5 group defensively).

I was hoping they’d target Hanifin in the offseason and roll out:

Hanifin - Spurgeon
Brodin - Faber

Figured that’d give them plenty of time to develop the rest of the D prospects in the 5D & 6D spots with one of them eventually replacing Spurgeon. We don’t really have a player in that age range to bridge the gap between Brodin/Spurgeon & the prospects.

Not sure how feasible that plan is anymore with the Zucc + Foligno signings, but I do think a Top 4 D is an acquisition that needs to be made in either this upcoming offseason or the next.

 

[AKL]

I was hoping they’d target Hanifin in the offseason and roll out:

Hanifin - Spurgeon
Brodin - Faber

Figured that’d give them plenty of time to develop the rest of the D prospects in the 5D & 6D spots with one of them eventually replacing Spurgeon. We don’t really have a player in that age range to bridge the gap between Brodin/Spurgeon & the prospects.

Not sure how feasible that plan is anymore with the Zucc + Foligno signings, but I do think a Top 4 D is an acquisition that needs to be made in either this upcoming offseason or the next.

I don't get this sentiment. We're not in a contender window right now, what's the point in going out and acquiring another top 4 LD when you're not even sure what you'll have down the line? If we were actual contenders I'd understand it, but this team isn't a Hanifin away from suddenly making a Cup run. This team still has no 1C or 1D and they have just two top 6 wingers (three if you want to count Zuccarello as the fourth top six winger, but that ship is quickly sailing away). What's the point in making a move for Hanifin when you're still missing that much?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I don't get this sentiment. We're not in a contender window right now, what's the point in going out and acquiring another top 4 LD when you're not even sure what you'll have down the line? If we were actual contenders I'd understand it, but this team isn't a Hanifin away from suddenly making a Cup run. This team still has no 1C or 1D and they have just two top 6 wingers (three if you want to count Zuccarello as the fourth top six winger, but that ship is quickly sailing away). What's the point in making a move for Hanifin when you're still missing that much?

So, Hanifin this summer, and then more pieces the summers after when we have the extra $14M to play with? Hard to argue that another top 4 defenseman isn't a need. Might not be the #1 need, but it isn't too far off either.

 

[AKL]

So, Hanifin this summer, and then more pieces the summers after when we have the extra $14M to play with? Hard to argue that another top 4 defenseman isn't a need. Might not be the #1 need, but it isn't too far off either.

So wait to see what you have in the prospects in Iowa. That's the entire point of the prospects.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

So wait to see what you have in the prospects in Iowa. That's the entire point of the prospects.

Ok. The best one can take Middleton's spot then.

How much are you willing to bet that 2 of them turn out better than Hanifin?

 

[AKL]

Ok. The best one can take Middleton's spot then.

How much are you willing to bet that 2 of them turn out better than Hanifin?

If you get Hanifin, you have a top 4 D consisting of Spurgeon, Brodin, Faber and Hanifin, with maybe 6-7M less cap space.
If just one of them turns out as good or better than Hanifin, you have a top 4 D consisting Spurgeon, Brodin, Faber and the one that's better than Hanifin, with 6-7M more cap space to spend on the missing 1C and other two top six wings.

Which one you picking?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

If you get Hanifin, you have a top 4 D consisting of Spurgeon, Brodin, Faber and Hanifin, with maybe 6-7M less cap space.
If just one of them turns out as good or better than Hanifin, you have a top 4 D consisting Spurgeon, Brodin, Faber and the one that's better than Hanifin, with 6-7M more cap space to spend on the missing 1C and other two top six wings.

Which one you picking?

Maybe I'm betting on Rossi and Yurov instead of the D prospects.

But, if there's a 1C out there for the picking instead, definitely ok with that too.

 

[AKL]

Maybe I'm betting on Rossi and Yurov instead of the D prospects.

Yurov hitting still leaves us with a missing 1C and a missing top six winger that you can use that money on. Not to mention the 15M earmarked for Kaprizov to stay, because if he leaves then you really need more forward help.

If you're betting on more forward prospects to hit than we need, and zero of the defensive prospects hitting, then you can exchange some of the forwards, future prospects, or picks down the line for the piece you know you need, from a position in the pool you know you don't need. It doesn't make any sense to me to try to make that move now when you know you need everything and don't know what you have a surplus of.

 

[Spurgeon]

I don't get this sentiment. We're not in a contender window right now, what's the point in going out and acquiring another top 4 LD when you're not even sure what you'll have down the line? If we were actual contenders I'd understand it, but this team isn't a Hanifin away from suddenly making a Cup run. This team still has no 1C or 1D and they have just two top 6 wingers (three if you want to count Zuccarello as the fourth top six winger, but that ship is quickly sailing away). What's the point in making a move for Hanifin when you're still missing that much?

I think our best chance of winning a cup is the 2-year window beginning next season when the cap goes up, Kap is still under contract, and Spurgeon is still able to play near his current level.

I think it’d be a mistake to not capitalize on that when our defensive prospects are still seemingly 2-3 years out from being able to play in the Top 4.

There’s also are no longer many spots to fit in upgrades to our top 9, which is why I wasn’t in favor of either the Zucc or Foligno signings to begin with.

 

[AKL]

I think our best chance of winning a cup is the 2-year window beginning next season when the cap goes up, Kap is still under contract, and Spurgeon is still able to play near his current level.

But you're just going to give the entire increase to Hanifin. Do you think this roster + Hanifin is a Cup contender? To the point where you're going to do whatever it takes to capitalize on a tiny 2 year window?

I think it’d be a mistake to not capitalize on that when our defensive prospects are still seemingly 2-3 years out from being able to play in the Top 4.

There’s also are no longer many spots to fit in upgrades to our top 9, which is why I wasn’t in favor of either the Zucc or Foligno signings to begin with.

What do you mean there's no longer many spots to upgrade in our top 9? Hartman, Johansson, Zuccarello are not top 6 options on a Cup contender. Maroon and Foligno are not top 9 options on a Cup contender. That's 5 spots that can be upgraded in our current top 9.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I thought Hanifin’s underlying numbers were terrible?

 

[AKL]

I thought Hanifin’s underlying numbers were terrible?

Don't know what his underlying numbers say, he's definitely a legit 2nd pair guy, I mean he would be a definite upgrade on the rotation of bottom pair/press box guys we have filling in now.

But I really disagree that trading futures and handing out all our additional cap space this summer to another 2nd pair defenseman is the way to go at this point.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Don't know what his underlying numbers say, he's definitely a legit 2nd pair guy, I mean he would be a definite upgrade on the rotation of bottom pair/press box guys we have filling in now.

But I really disagree that trading futures and handing out all our additional cap space this summer to another 2nd pair defenseman is the way to go at this point.

Where would you go with that cap space? I don’t really hate how our forward group looks for next year:

Kap-Rossi-Boldy
Johansson-Hartman-Zucc
Khusnutdinov-Ek-Yurov
Foligno-Gaudreau-Dewar

Defense could use an upgrade:

Bacon-Broccoli
XXXX-Spurgeon (Lambos? Peart? Hunt? O’Rourke? Anyone??)
Middleton-XXXX (Spacek?)

 

[Webster]

15% of the season played and I'd say players who are a point per game or more would be top 6 on any team...

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

With the cap going up, Hanifin is going to get $7M+ on his next deal, so it's highly likely that it's a moot point anyway.

 

[Spurgeon]

But you're just going to give the entire increase to Hanifin. Do you think this roster + Hanifin is a Cup contender? To the point where you're going to do whatever it takes to capitalize on a tiny 2 year window?



What do you mean there's no longer many spots to upgrade in our top 9? Hartman, Johansson, Zuccarello are not top 6 options on a Cup contender. Maroon and Foligno are not top 9 options on a Cup contender. That's 5 spots that can be upgraded in our current top 9.

Hanifin is at an age where giving him a 7-8 year contract at $7-8M is not detrimental to the future of this team. Brodin and Spurgeon are going to need to be replaced eventually and getting a Top 4 defenseman that is 4 years younger than Brodin & 7 years younger than Spurgeon seems like it fits any timeline.

Our current top 9 is:

Kap - Rossi - Boldy
Johansson - Ek - Zucc
Foligno - Gaudreau - Hartman

Paying Foligno, Hartman, or Zucc $4M to play on the 4th line seems like a financial mistake. That's why I stated that they're blocking a spot in the top 9. The better option (imo) would have been to sign someone like Lindholm and then have either Yurov or Khusnutdinov become the 9th forward. Since that's no longer an option, I think it makes more sense to upgrade Middleton to Hanifin next season and then replace Johansson's spot with a UFA in the following offseason.

Going into the 25-26 season, they'd have something like this:

Kap - Rossi (RFA) - Boldy
X - Ek - Zucc
Foligno - Gaudreau - Hartman
X - X - X

Brodin - Faber (RFA)
Hanifin ($7.5M) - Spurgeon
X - X

Gus
Wall (RFA)

Assuming Hanifin would get around $7.5M. They'd have $30M to sign Rossi, Faber, and Wallstedt, as well as fill out the remaining empty spots.

They'll have the following forwards available for ELC deals: Yurov, Khusnutdinov, Ohgren, Haight, Heidt, Bankier, Kumpulainen, and Stramel

On defense they'll have: Peart, Lambos, Spacek, and Masters (Hunt & ROR will need RFA deals)

I'm a lot more comfortable predicting that they'll have 3 bottom 6 forwards in that top group than I am of there being 2LD, 3LD, and 3RD in our prospect pool.

 

[TaLoN]

15% of the season played and I'd say players who are a point per game or more would be top 6 on any team...

Depends on their even strength numbers.

A player who's PPG, but gets roughly half his points from the PP isn't a guaranteed top 6 player on any team. He'd probably be on one of the PP units of any team though.

 

[AKL]

Where would you go with that cap space? I don’t really hate how our forward group looks for next year:

Kap-Rossi-Boldy
Johansson-Hartman-Zucc
Khusnutdinov-Ek-Yurov
Foligno-Gaudreau-Dewar

Defense could use an upgrade:

Bacon-Broccoli
XXXX-Spurgeon (Lambos? Peart? Hunt? O’Rourke? Anyone??)
Middleton-XXXX (Spacek?)

I would rather sit on that cap space and be patient and see what develops in our prospect pool. Sign a short term, cheaper option if you feel compelled to use the cap space, but there's no reason to commit to any big UFA deals at this point, it would just hamper our ability to spend efficiently down the line when we could put that money to better use.

I don't think this is going to be our lineup next year. I think it's going to look more like what we have this year. I would be shocked if both Russians make the team, and I would be even more shocked if they're both impact players. I'm expecting Foligno and Gaudreau to still be on the third line, with Guerin either bringing back Maroon or someone similar to fill that role on the fourth line. I'm also expecting Zuccarello to continue getting worse, further emphasizing that that's not a 2nd line you can win with in the playoffs.

Defense needs help too, not denying that. Forwards need help. There are very few spots on this roster that don't need an upgrade. I'm advocating for patience. I don't think our window is in the next two years. I think with any luck it's going to be after that, it's going to be longer, and we'll have a clearer idea of what we need and what we can spare then, and we'll be able to go get the pieces we need when we need them. Just not trying to predict what we need in 4 years right now.

 

[Sweetnut]

We all know Bogo is getting that sweet 4x4 NMC contract before the Sweden trip anyways, so....

 

[thestonedkoala]

I thought you had written him off?

Disappointing and writing them off are not the same thing. My hope is that he'll still develop.

 

[keppel146]

Where would you go with that cap space? I don’t really hate how our forward group looks for next year:

Kap-Rossi-Boldy
Johansson-Hartman-Zucc
Khusnutdinov-Ek-Yurov
Foligno-Gaudreau-Dewar

Defense could use an upgrade:

Bacon-Broccoli
XXXX-Spurgeon (Lambos? Peart? Hunt? O’Rourke? Anyone??)
Middleton-XXXX (Spacek?)

I’m guessing the answer would still be Middleton with a lame bottom pair like mermaid/ketchup. (Mermis/hunt)

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I would rather sit on that cap space and be patient and see what develops in our prospect pool. Sign a short term, cheaper option if you feel compelled to use the cap space, but there's no reason to commit to any big UFA deals at this point, it would just hamper our ability to spend efficiently down the line when we could put that money to better use.

I don't think this is going to be our lineup next year. I think it's going to look more like what we have this year. I would be shocked if both Russians make the team, and I would be even more shocked if they're both impact players. I'm expecting Foligno and Gaudreau to still be on the third line, with Guerin either bringing back Maroon or someone similar to fill that role on the fourth line. I'm also expecting Zuccarello to continue getting worse, further emphasizing that that's not a 2nd line you can win with in the playoffs.

Defense needs help too, not denying that. Forwards need help. There are very few spots on this roster that don't need an upgrade. I'm advocating for patience. I don't think our window is in the next two years. I think with any luck it's going to be after that, it's going to be longer, and we'll have a clearer idea of what we need and what we can spare then, and we'll be able to go get the pieces we need when we need them. Just not trying to predict what we need in 4 years right now.

I don’t think we can pass up an upgrade on defense if the opportunity presents itself. Which is why it’s frustrating to not really be able to see what they have in O’Rourke, Hunt (tho he is up now), and to a lesser extent Lambos/Peart/Spacek. It feels like we’ve been waiting on some of those guys for forever. We can’t go another year with Middleton in the top 4 looking okay because he’s paired next to Spurgeon. That is unacceptable in my book.

I’ll put my hat in the ring of calling both Yurov and Khusnutdinov will be on the team next year, with a higher probability that Yurov is an impact player. Ohgren is going to try and make it too, but that remains to be seen.

I think our window starts next TDL. No excuse for it not to start then IMO.

 

[BagHead]

I don’t think we can pass up an upgrade on defense if the opportunity presents itself. Which is why it’s frustrating to not really be able to see what they have in O’Rourke, Hunt (tho he is up now), and to a lesser extent Lambos/Peart/Spacek. It feels like we’ve been waiting on some of those guys for forever. We can’t go another year with Middleton in the top 4 looking okay because he’s paired next to Spurgeon. That is unacceptable in my book.

I’ll put my hat in the ring of calling both Yurov and Khusnutdinov will be on the team next year, with a higher probability that Yurov is an impact player. Ohgren is going to try and make it too, but that remains to be seen.

I think our window starts next TDL. No excuse for it not to start then IMO.

Damn, I got a little fired up reading this post. I think this would be a great season to rotate the Iowa defenders into the NHL, one by one, to see who's got what at the NHL level. Unfortunately, they've got one defenseman too many on the roster to do that, once Spurgeon is healthy. I know Guerin wants to win every game so he's trying to ice his best defense, but sometimes good long-term strategy means short-term pain.

 

[keppel146]

I don’t think we can pass up an upgrade on defense if the opportunity presents itself. Which is why it’s frustrating to not really be able to see what they have in O’Rourke, Hunt (tho he is up now), and to a lesser extent Lambos/Peart/Spacek. It feels like we’ve been waiting on some of those guys for forever. We can’t go another year with Middleton in the top 4 looking okay because he’s paired next to Spurgeon. That is unacceptable in my book.

I’ll put my hat in the ring of calling both Yurov and Khusnutdinov will be on the team next year, with a higher probability that Yurov is an impact player. Ohgren is going to try and make it too, but that remains to be seen.

I think our window starts next TDL. No excuse for it not to start then IMO.

I’m assuming the Wild brass know about what threshold is needed to play nhl games and the young D in Iowa haven’t gotten there yet. They’re still pretty young, I’d rather let them (Lambos/peart/spacek) marinate and see what they are in 2ish years.

 

[Sweetnut]

Merrill benched for a while now, is there any chance Billy G can pull off another trade for a 6th round pick or something?
What team could possibly need him?
I see none, don´t know if he can be sent down or waived.