Post-Game Talk: Mild

[Machinehead]

I have no problem with moaning after a loss. It's the extrapolization into absurd generalizations that are nuts to me.

Lose a game and everything about the team sucks is stupid.

Granted, a percentage of every fan base in every sport does exactly that. To me, it's odd, but to some I'm odd, so.......

You're not wrong.

I think you know me better than to think I'm reacting to one game.

Like I said, I've just gotten into the habit of leaving it alone if the team wins.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Yes!

You've found the golden ticket.

And it's because they don't have enough players that are just good enough at offense to score within a structure.

It's actually crazy how bad this forward corps is. You can count the good skaters on one hand and the good passers on one finger.

People say "HAHA the analytics have us down there with the Sharks!!!" as a dig at the analytics.

I mean, nobody is saying analytics are gospel or that we're legitimately as bad as the Sharks, but that should alarm you.

Meanwhile this is what I'm watching for 11 games so when people say "but we won some of them!!!!" it's like "...ok?"

Dude, you're a Giants fan aren't you? Stop!

 

[Machinehead]

Dude, you're a Giants fan aren't you? Stop!

The Giants, I've just turned off emotionally until they give me a reason to care.

I guess the Rangers aren't at that point which is something.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

You're pretty much just making fun of people for having criticisms of the team.

Well, when said team is 3rd in the league in points after 8 of 11 on the road with a new coach and new system I do question the constant negativity.

 

[Machinehead]

Well, when said team is 3rd in the league in points after 8 of 11 on the road with a new coach and new system I do question the constant negativity.

If winning the games is the only result that matters to you, I understand and respect that.

Not everybody sees it that way because at the end of the day, these 8 regular season wins and $2.90 gets me on the bus.

People are allowed to have that perspective.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

The Giants, I've just turned off emotionally until they give me a reason to care.

I guess the Rangers aren't at that point which is something.

I can't see a team that's 8-2-1, had strong seasons the last two years and have this ridiculous reaction. Yesterday's game is appalling. We rely on Fox probably as much as the Oilers rely on McDavid. And that's a problem. Yes our 5 on 5 numbers suck. But Jesus Christ it's just impossible to come to this board where every loss brings out people going crazy about how we're an awful team. The Avs just got shutout and blown out 3 of the last 4 games.

 

[Machinehead]

I can't see a team that's 8-2-1, had strong seasons the last two years and have this ridiculous reaction. Yesterday's game is appalling. We rely on Fox probably as much as the Oilers rely on McDavid. And that's a problem. Yes our 5 on 5 numbers suck. But Jesus Christ it's just impossible to come to this board where every loss brings out people going crazy about how we're an awful team. The Avs just got shutout and blown out 3 of the last 4 games.

We can agree to disagree on what reactions are justified or not, but you have a healthy respect for analytics and randomness. I think you understand why I don't really care about wins as an indicator.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

We can agree to disagree on what reactions are justified or not, but you have a healthy respect for analytics and randomness. I think you understand why I don't really care about wins as an indicator.

Considering you've been complaining about the same thing for the last 2+ seasons and not just this season that doesn't really make sense. 173 games is enough of a sample where randomness gets mitigated.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

If winning the games is the only result that matters to you, I understand and respect that.

Not everybody sees it that way because at the end of the day, these 8 regular season wins and $2.90 gets me on the bus.

People are allowed to have that perspective.

Dude, it's all about the wins and points in this league. That's why they play the games. Aside from a handful of games this year I think they have played really well. I always give a team with a new coach and system 20 games to settle in and see what is working and not working. The fact that this team is where it is makes me excited about the season. Again, I don't understand the constant bitching and moaning given their record and compete level.

 

[DanielBrassard]

I can't see a team that's 8-2-1, had strong seasons the last two years and have this ridiculous reaction. Yesterday's game is appalling. We rely on Fox probably as much as the Oilers rely on McDavid. And that's a problem. Yes our 5 on 5 numbers suck. But Jesus Christ it's just impossible to come to this board where every loss brings out people going crazy about how we're an awful team. The Avs just got shutout and blown out 3 of the last 4 games.

Yes they are 8-2-1 and what was their record to start the 15-16 season? How many times do we have to see this team have a good record but we all know at the end of the day they aren’t really a true cup contender? I am not declaring that is the case this season, and I hope that @TheDirtyH is right. However I think it’s extremely reasonable to be skeptical and to discuss the teams flaws that have been apparent for quite some time.

 

[Machinehead]

Dude, it's all about the wins and points in this league. That's why they play the games. Aside from a handful of games this year I think they have played really well. I always give a team with a new coach and system 20 games to settle in and see what is working and not working. The fact that this team is where it is makes me excited about the season. Again, I don't understand the constant bitching and moaning given their record and compete level.

Wins are objectively a poor indicator of future playoff performance, though.

And they don't matter right now. You don't get an ounce of purple piss for winning games now. You have to win games in June.

 

[Machinehead]

Considering you've been complaining about the same thing for the last 2+ seasons and not just this season that doesn't really make sense. 173 games is enough of a sample where randomness gets mitigated.

I've been complaining about the same thing for the last 2+ seasons because the Rangers have been bad at it for the last 10+ seasons.

 

[will1066]

Other than in that Covid year when he started the season with 3 points in 15 games he hasn't been THIS bad 5 on 5 since he broke out in 2019. Either he's just past his prime or he's just struggling this season but when Eichel became available that wasn't the case. Plus Eichel was injured and on a perennial loser. I don't think I blame them for not trading for him. His first year with Vegas he wasn't that great either. This wasn't McDavid becoming available.

Good stuff, in case anyone has amnesia of the Eichel situation. It worked out for Vegas, but it was definitely a gamble at the time. Shit, I made a pun unintentionally.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Yes they are 8-2-1 and what was their record to start the 15-16 season? How many times do we have to see this team have a good record but we all know at the end of the day they aren’t really a true cup contender? I am not declaring that is the case this season, and I hope that @TheDirtyH is right. However I think it’s extremely reasonable to be skeptical and to discuss the teams flaws that have been apparent for quite some time.

I'm not sure if that was the season or not because I was in grad school that year and didn't see much of it but if it was the season I'm thinking about that team had no structure and was destroyed every game. They relied on Lundqvist entirely. This season has structure but is struggling creating chances 5 on 5. But they have not relied on Shesterkin/Quick nearly as much outside of yesterday's game. Completely different team with completely different problems. And that one season and I guess 2009-10 when they started are outliers. They have mostly been very good if they started very well. Why bring up the outliers because one time the team started off well but finished poorly?

And frankly, we're overly relying on the PP but when everyone is healthy it's easily a top 3 PP in the NHL. It's not like it's a fluke. We have probably 4 top 10 PP players in the league who have been playing together for years now. That won't go away. The % will probably go down some but I'd like to think that would be evened out by our 5 on 5 not being bottom of the league but merely average.

I've been complaining about the same thing for the last 2+ seasons because the Rangers have been bad at it for the last 10+ seasons.

Did you just ignore what I said? You're basically using 173 game sample size and complaining about randomness.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

Wins are objectively a poor indicator of future playoff performance, though.

And they don't matter right now. You don't get an ounce of purple piss for winning games now. You have to win games in June.

And you have to win games in October and November to make sure you may be playing in June. Saying wins don't matter right now is hogwash especially in a parity league. All wins matter.

 

[Machinehead]

Did you just ignore what I said? You're basically using 173 game sample size and complaining about randomness.

I'm not saying that the Rangers haven't sustainably won games.

I just think winning regular games games is a garbage indicator of playoff success.

The Canadiens fairly recently went to a SCF smack dab in the middle of a 46-70-22 run in the regular season.

Again, it's different perspectives, but to me, the regular season is good for two things: 1) laughs and 2) being a KPI.

Wins aren't the KPI.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I'm not saying that the Rangers haven't sustainably won games.

I just think winning regular games games is a garbage indicator of playoff success.

The Canadiens fairly recently went to a SCF smack dab in the middle of a 46-70-22 run in the regular season.

Again, it's different perspectives, but to me, the regular season is good for two things: 1) laughs and 2) being a KPI.

Wins aren't the KPI.

If you're calling wins in the regular season random in an 82 game sample then what is the 16-28 game sample of the playoffs (for the winner)?

 

[chosen]

I'm not saying that the Rangers haven't sustainably won games.

I just think winning regular games games is a garbage indicator of playoff success.

The Canadiens fairly recently went to a SCF smack dab in the middle of a 46-70-22 run in the regular season.

Again, it's different perspectives, but to me, the regular season is good for two things: 1) laughs and 2) being a KPI.

Wins aren't the KPI.

While your point is valid, Montreal, that season, is not a fair representation of that for obvious reasons.

 

[Machinehead]

If you're calling wins in the regular season random in an 82 game sample then what is the 16-28 game sample of the playoffs (for the winner)?

That's random too. Sports are random. Especially hockey. Teams go up and down exchanging scoring chances and at the end of the day, you don't really control whether or not you're gonna have the three that go in that game.

All you can do is give yourself the best odds. Teams with certain profiles have better odds than others and the Rangers very often land far from
that profile.

You know what, maybe we will just win the Cup one day because Panarin, Zibanejad, and Shesterkin all go on a binge at the same time, and we ride our 48.6% xGF all the way down the canyon of heroes.

I'd just like to be a bit more proactive about improving our chances.

And I'd like another star forward too. I'd like to draft one. I want that even if we go 82-0. If that makes me the bad guy, then I'm the bad guy.

 

[Machinehead]

While your point is valid, Montreal, that season, is not a fair representation of that for obvious reasons.

It's just an example. Another one is the 18-19 Blues having the fewest points in the league on New Year's Eve.

And don't even get me started on Boston last year going into this year. And I called that!

 

[duhmetreE]

Zibs has the talent but he decided to mimic Panarins game under gallant. Someone needs to tell him, you’re not that guy pal.

things can change. Panarin this season, is nothing like Panarin of the past 2 under Gallant. Zibs needs to 're-discover' his identity. I have faith in the coaching staff, as crazy as that sounds.

Trocheck needs to start putting the puck in the net as well.

Our centers have been 'poor' to say the least to start the season at 5v5. That is the crux of the issue. Maybe they are too focused on defense? Once they get comfortable with that aspect, maybe the offensive side starts getting worked on.

I would change the lines up though.

Panarin Zibs Laffy
Kreider Tro Kakko
Cuylle Goodrow Wheeler

until Chytil is back/ We really need to get Zibs and Tro going and producing.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

That's random too. Sports are random. Especially hockey. Teams go up and down exchanging scoring chances and at the end of the day, you don't really control whether or not you're gonna have the three that go in that game.

All you can do is give yourself the best odds. Teams with certain profiles have better odds than others and the Rangers very often land far from
that profile.

You know what, maybe we will just win the Cup one day because Panarin, Zibanejad, and Shesterkin all go on a binge at the same time, and we ride our 48.6% xGF all the way down the canyon of heroes.

I'd just like to be a bit more proactive about improving our chances.

And I'd like another star forward too. I'd like to draft one. I want that even if we go 82-0. If that makes me the bad guy, then I'm the bad guy.

You're not a bad guy, it's just really tiresome to read how terrible this team is after every loss. This game it was better than the Preds game where the team that blew 4 top 10 picks (for various reasons) in the last half a dozen years just needed to tank a little longer and apparently the biggest joke franchise in recent memory who just finally happened to win the jackpot and get perhaps the most talented player ever and STILL not win jack shit, is seen as a better alternative to what we have now.

 

[Machinehead]

You're not a bad guy, it's just really tiresome to read how terrible this team is after every loss. This game it was better than the Preds game where the team that blew 4 top 10 picks (for various reasons) in the last half a dozen years just needed to tank a little longer and apparently the biggest joke franchise in recent memory who just finally happened to win the jackpot and get perhaps the most talented player ever and STILL not win jack shit, is seen as a better alternative to what we have now.

See, again, I think this is just different perspectives.

We all have a favorite kid, let's be honest. You talk about the Giants a lot. They're important to you. The Giants have won like 12 games since Ryan Callahan was here, so you place value on just being able to win some games.

And you said "but aren't you a Giants fan?"

Yes, but my favorite kid is Liverpool. They've had possession of the ball probably 70% of my fandom and like 95% of the losses are because we didn't finish.

Your expectation now is to make the playoffs and win more games than you've lost. That's a smashing success for the Giants. My expectation is looking good just about every game and having superstars.

I don't just care about how many. I care about how. I watch to enjoy it. I'm not interested in getting outplayed and winning. Getting outplayed is a failure.

Now, hockey is obviously a different beast with a lot more parity, but our rate of producing offense and offensive stars is very bad relative to other hockey teams.

I don't even expect to win the Stanley Cup. That's a lot of luck. I expect to look better than the other team more games than not and have offensive players that scare other teams' fans. Winning ugly doesn't satisfy that goal for me.

Some people on this board are particularly married to the Mets or the Yankees. They're just happy to be alive.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

See, again, I think this is just different perspectives.

We all have a favorite kid, let's be honest. You talk about the Giants a lot. They're important to you. The Giants have won like 12 games since Ryan Callahan was here, so you place value on just being able to win some games.

And you said "but aren't you a Giants fan?"

Yes, but my favorite kid is Liverpool. They've had possession of the ball probably 70% of my fandom and like 95% of the losses are because we didn't finish.

Your expectation now is to make the playoffs and win more games than you've lost. That's a smashing success for the Giants. My expectation is looking good just about every game and having superstars.

I don't just care about how many. I care about how. I watch to enjoy it. I'm not interested in getting outplayed and winning. Getting outplayed is a failure.

Now, hockey is obviously a different beast with a lot more parity, but our rate of producing offense and offensive stars is very bad relative to other hockey teams.

I don't even expect to win the Stanley Cup. That's a lot of luck. I expect to look better than the other team more games than not and have offensive players that scare other teams' fans. Winning ugly doesn't satisfy that goal for me.

Some people on this board are particularly married to the Mets or the Yankees. They're just happy to be alive.

You're basically a more sophisticated version of EdJovanovski. He cares about douchebags making dipsy doodle moves at the blueline effective or not and you care about the asthetics of the game. I don't fault you for the asthetics of the game THAT much, this is why I didn't love the 11-12 team as much as I should have. That said to me that's a tie breaker. I'm not watching the Rangers strictly for the art. This is not an oscar nominated movie. The whole point is to win. And that said they've been boring this year but they haven't been outplayed in most cases. At least outside of a few third periods when we had the lead.

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

He's a good skater and I think the physical part of his game will work out.

Schneider can be good carrying the puck in & shooting. Otherwise, no. His decision-making & ability to move the puck quickly just are not there. Every long shift in the Rangers' zone he is on the ice it seems.