Player Discussion Mike Matheson

Miller Time

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Sep 16, 2004
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Should have traded Matheson for a good haul this past summer and kept Kovacevic.

And whom plays up to replace Matheson's ice time?

Hutson is already at 23min /night.

Matheson is out of place as a #1D. He's clearly out of place used as much as he is... but he's also clearly a better option than our current alternatives.

Matheson is paid like a 2nd pairing dman, he'd be good as a #2, and great as a #3. Not his fault we have no viable alternative to reduce his minutes.

Until KH finds an upgrade at top pairing D, Matheson will keep getting used too heavily, and keep drawing the misguided ire of a fan base determined to have a few whipping boys.

Hopefully, if we do move him it's for the kind of return that will make the main board implode...
 

salbutera

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My solution was adding a vet that's not a paper tiger like Matheson, someone the kids can actually look up to. Hughes decided to sit down and double down on his pet-client because that's what we do in the foxhole.

Matheson shouldn't play PP1.
Matheson shouldn't be on the ice when we need a goal.
Matheson should be leaned on at the detriment of playing younger players.
Matheson shouldn't be kept beyond this year because he has no value to us.
Well HuGo don’t agree with your thought process
 

BozoTheClown

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And whom plays up to replace Matheson's ice time?

Hutson is already at 23min /night.

Matheson is out of place as a #1D. He's clearly out of place used as much as he is... but he's also clearly a better option than our current alternatives.

Matheson is paid like a 2nd pairing dman, he'd be good as a #2, and great as a #3. Not his fault we have no viable alternative to reduce his minutes.

Until KH finds an upgrade at top pairing D, Matheson will keep getting used too heavily, and keep drawing the misguided ire of a fan base determined to have a few whipping boys.

Hopefully, if we do move him it's for the kind of return that will make the main board implode...
Have them all play between 18-22 minutes a game.
 
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Miller Time

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Have them all play between 18-22 minutes a game.

So that people can complain about Barron, Strubble, Xhekaj & Savard as they get exposed in bigger minutes?

Unless the goal is to spread the scapegoating to more players, while further reducing the on ice quality of play, not sure this is a great plan lol
 

Mrb1p

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So that people can complain about Barron, Strubble, Xhekaj & Savard as they get exposed in bigger minutes?

Unless the goal is to spread the scapegoating to more players, while further reducing the on ice quality of play, not sure this is a great plan lol
But people are complaining about Matheson because he's god-awful.
 
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Benstheman

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So that people can complain about Barron, Strubble, Xhekaj & Savard as they get exposed in bigger minutes?

Unless the goal is to spread the scapegoating to more players, while further reducing the on ice quality of play, not sure this is a great plan lol
Whatever it is. Matheson is definitely not a solution going forward. Trade him for whatever value he is having.
 
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Miller Time

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Whatever it is. Matheson is definitely not a solution going forward. Trade him for whatever value he is having.

Or add an actual top pairing player, and slot him firmly in a 2nd pairing role... That's far better for us if the goal is to get competitive sooner than later.

Very hard to find an upgrade on Matheson in a 3-4 role at a similar cap hit, let alone cost of acquisition.

But people are complaining about Matheson because he's god-awful.

And better than the alternative... That's what blind complaining misses.
 
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Mrb1p

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Or add an actual top pairing player, and slot him firmly in a 2nd pairing role... That's far better for us if the goal is to get competitive sooner than later.

Very hard to find an upgrade on Matheson in a 3-4 role at a similar cap hit, let alone cost of acquisition.



And better than the alternative... That's what blind complaining misses.
Is he really better than the alternative? Does Struble make more mistakes than him? Does Xhekaj? Does Barron? Does Savard?

We know Hutson is a better alternative on the PP1. We know Guhle is probably at least similar on PP2.
We know Guhle and Hutson can both outplay him at ES/5v5.
We know that Struble, Xhekaj, Barron don't play a lot and they could play a couple more minutes with similar success.
We know that AX, Struble, Savard, Guhle can all play PK.

Stop butt clenching. Matheson isn't a necessity on this roster, he's just like Gustaffsson again. He's just like Kulak.
 
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Benstheman

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Or add an actual top pairing player, and slot him firmly in a 2nd pairing role... That's far better for us if the goal is to get competitive sooner than later.

Very hard to find an upgrade on Matheson in a 3-4 role at a similar cap hit, let alone cost of acquisition.



And better than the alternative... That's what blind complaining misses.
I agree we need to replace him with a more stable top pair guy, ideally on the right side. But at the end of the day, just can't have a left side of Hutson, Matheson, Xhekaj. At one point you have to play some decent defensive hockey to win.
 
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Miller Time

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I agree we need to replace him with a more stable top pair guy, ideally on the right side. But at the end of the day, just can't have a left side of Hutson, Matheson, Xhekaj. At one point you have to play some decent defensive hockey to win.
once Hutson and Xhekaj/Strubble/Engstrom are established and entering their prime years, a Hutson/Matheson duo in the top 4 LD is absolutely fine.

not much different than the top 2 LDs for recent cup winners.

take any of those pairings when the top guy was the same age as Hutson (Forsling, Theodore, Toews) and consider what they'd have looked like.

Forsling
OEL

Mikola

Toews
Byram

Johnson

even Vegas...
Theodore
Martinez

Hague


Matheson may or may not still be here in 2-3 years, but if he is, and playing at the level he's currently at, as long as Hutson and the other young guys have progressed and are entering their prime years, and we've addressed the top 4 RD situation, and we're looking at a great LD situation.

trading Matheson for futures now makes no sense at all. we don't need the additional futures, and we do need quality vets. Matheson is a quality vet on a very good contract, he's taking on more than he's capable of because of our roster situation, moved into the right spot, and he's an obvious net positive.
 
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Miller Time

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Is he really better than the alternative? Does Struble make more mistakes than him? Does Xhekaj? Does Barron? Does Savard?

Yes. Quite obviously. the volume of mistakes a player makes is affected by their usage... time on ice, matchups, linemates... there's also the internal impact of greater responsibility and playing with less rest... these factors are difficult to quantify, difficult to assess (especially from the outside), and, are the single largest variable that fans dismiss and overlook.

Hutson isn't doing what he does, and getting the minutes that he is, because of his physical attributes. It's almost entirely about his mental game and ability to handle the pressure of the role and responsibility he's been given/taking.

If any of X, Strubble, Barron had the ability to perform well with greater ice time, there is zero reason to believe that they wouldn't be getting it already. MSL has quite clearly shown no reservation to giving younger players more time, more responsibility and play them above vets, when they (coaching staff) asseses them as able to handle it.

one may disagree with their assessment, but overall I think it's without merit to suggest that the team is prioritizing any veteran just because of their age.

Savard? come on... he can't handle that type of role responsibility. Again here, one might argue we should have a different play style and approach, but let's be real here... Savard didn't get that kind of role or usage in Columbus (under 20min/night, 9sec/game of PP time) nor in Tampa on their playoff run (14min/night).

he's not a reasonable option to take on any more responsibility than he already has, and thus far this season he's been struggling even there.

We know Hutson is a better alternative on the PP1. We know Guhle is probably at least similar on PP2.
We know Guhle and Hutson can both outplay him at ES/5v5.
Hutson and Guhle are already playing more ES time than Matheson.
Guhle has dealt with injuries to start the year... if he stays healthy, I'd imagine we'll see his overall usage go up.

the PP question... sure, we could reduce Matheson's time and up Guhle's... but

We know that Struble, Xhekaj, Barron don't play a lot and they could play a couple more minutes with similar success.
could not disagree more with this assessment. But I am glad to hear that you see them as able to be successful with more usage... Barron in particular is often the target of excessive scapegoating and complaints in most threads, your voice pointing out that he should get more, rather than less, usage will be a breath of fresh air!

We know that AX, Struble, Savard, Guhle can all play PK.
yes, and so can matheson... who is 2nd in PK ice time... on a team that is 12th in the league in PK efficacy.

so, again, not sure I see the validity of the critique, nor how the proposed solution actually improves us right now. Numbers don't add up.

Stop butt clenching. Matheson isn't a necessity on this roster, he's just like Gustaffsson again. He's just like Kulak.

no player is a "necessity". If your done with the petty insults and baseless empty comments, we can focus in on your inability to differentiate players.

If you think Gustafsson and Matheson are equivalents, I understand why you think any of our young dmen could just be swapped in with no difference. I encourage you to spend some time away from the PlayStation and perhaps watching games with someone who understands hockey as a step towards being able to better understand what you are watching.

bad takes are easy to throw around. grounding a take takes some actual effort, and some degree of coherence. your takes in this post lack coherence, and worse, given your large volume of complaints about the GM, the coach, and your pet peeve players, there's a clear pattern here of wholly inconsistent and contradictory takes.... a whole lot of hot air, no substance.

what you get out of all this complaining and whining, :dunno:
 
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Apoplectic Habs Fan

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Cant trade Matheson, who else plays and they will lose

MTL is losing cause Matheson is playing out of his role and given too much ice time

So either way is MTL is losing. Might as well get future assets that might fit time frame. At worst, get players that might foster better accountability and supposed culture they want
 

Kaiden Ghoul

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Jan 19, 2020
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I dreamed the other Hughes extended him... yeah more an nightmare

The day Hutson take the PP reign will be a good day movin fwd
 
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Paddyjack

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Cant trade Matheson, who else plays and they will lose

MTL is losing cause Matheson is playing out of his role and given too much ice time

So either way is MTL is losing. Might as well get future assets that might fit time frame. At worst, get players that might foster better accountability and supposed culture they want
I would trade him for a veteran stay at home RD, then place Guhle on the left with that guy, Savard with Hutson, and the rest as 5-6.

Im pretty sure it would improve the D considerably
 

BozoTheClown

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So that people can complain about Barron, Strubble, Xhekaj & Savard as they get exposed in bigger minutes?

Unless the goal is to spread the scapegoating to more players, while further reducing the on ice quality of play, not sure this is a great plan lol
I will not complain, we are rebuilding and these guys need ice time. Trade Savard at the deadline.
 

MasterD

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Jul 1, 2004
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I bring the consistency that Matheson cannot bring
Honestly you're being unfair, and this type of behavior is why tons of players don't want to come bere. You're turning him into a scapegoat the same way Brisebois was the scapegoat back in the day.

Matheson shouldn't be a #1 dman. He shouldn't play so much. He shouldn't be the main PP QB.

The fact is this roster sucks and the coach overuses him.

It is NOT the player's fault.

Petry was never this bad for us. Heck, I'm not even sure if Petry is this bad right now.
Petry was just as bad his last year here, AND didn't produce offensively nearly as much.
 

Spearmint Rhino

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Think the pressure of Hutson playing well is getting to him. Ridiculous we have our other future top 4 LHD playing his offside to make room for MM, needs to be jettisoned ASAP
 
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Mrb1p

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Honestly you're being unfair, and this type of behavior is why tons of players don't want to come bere. You're turning him into a scapegoat the same way Brisebois was the scapegoat back in the day.

Matheson shouldn't be a #1 dman. He shouldn't play so much. He shouldn't be the main PP QB.

The fact is this roster sucks and the coach overuses him.

It is NOT the player's fault.


Petry was just as bad his last year here, AND didn't produce offensively nearly as much.
That's what people making excuse like to say but it's not the reality.

Brisebois was not this bad either.
 

salbutera

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Sep 10, 2019
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I dreamed the other Hughes extended him... yeah more an nightmare

The day Hutson take the PP reign will be a good day movin fwd
Before season started I predicted Hutson assumes PP QB duties by US Thanksgiving….. that’s 3-weeks away

An NHL regular season is 6-months long, it’s a marathon not a sprint, the lack of patience is appalling
 

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