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McDavid heating up, what are odds on 150 points this season?

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Soundwave said:
80s hockey while entertaining and fun if we're being honest is pure pond hockey.

There's no defensive strategy whatsoever, some of the D can't even skate properly backwards, lol. Just pure fire wagon hockey with far worse goaltending than today.
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80s hockey is not nearly as entertaining as hockey today. Even the Canada Cup games leave a lot to be desired because of how bad the goaltending and positional play is.
 
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jigglysquishy said:
Just going off performance versus peers, it's unlikely he will top the 2021 season. Here is his production versus 7th in scoring (to reduce noise)

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD]McDavid Points[/TD]
[TD]7th in Points[/TD]
[TD]Ratio[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2020-21[/TD]
[TD]105[/TD]
[TD]66[/TD]
[TD]1.59[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2022-23[/TD]
[TD]72[/TD]
[TD]48[/TD]
[TD]1.50[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2016-17[/TD]
[TD]100[/TD]
[TD]82[/TD]
[TD]1.22[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2017-18[/TD]
[TD]108[/TD]
[TD]92[/TD]
[TD]1.17[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-22[/TD]
[TD]123[/TD]
[TD]106[/TD]
[TD]1.16[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

His non-Art Ross years too are very dominant (1.17 in 2019 and 1.14 in 2020).

For reference, the highest post 1996 ratio is Jagr in 1999 (1.37). Lemieux in 1996 had 1.49/Jagr had 1.38. Gretzky has multiple seasons over 1.80, peaking at 1.98 in 1985. Seriously, he hit 208 points while 7th had 105.

If he can maintain he ratio, it will be worth more over 82 games than 56 and likely go down as the best offensive season ever outside the Big Four and Espo.
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:blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah:
 
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NeverForget06 said:
His 5 points last night came with only 16:01 TOI.... pretty good
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This is the one big disadvantage McDavid has versus say Gretzky.

Gretzky still played when the oilers were way up in the 80s. In fact if this game was the 80s oilers up 3 before the 5 minute mark, Peter Pocklington would probably have been in the locker room between periods offering Gretz a bonus if he could score a hat trick on top of his playmaker.
 
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Hockey Outsider said:
Agreed. I made a number of posts on this topic last year (here's one example, but there are others): NHL.com Trophy Tracker - Hart Trophy

McDavid was playing at around a 140-145 point level last year, but was hampered by a terrible on-ice shooting percentage. McDavid shot well, and generated a ton of chances, but his linemates couldn't finish.

As I've said before - McDavid shouldn't get credit for the points he "should" have scored. But my take is 2022 was the fluke year. He's been playing at an 140+ point level for 2.5 seasons now. He missed out on 140 in 2021 due to the shortened season, and he had bad luck last year. (Though this shows that even if McDavid has a really bad year by his standards, he's still good enough to win the Art Ross).

I fully expect McDavid to slow down in the second half of this season (he's on pace for 160 points and it's very unlikely he gets there). So in that sense, the naysayers in this thread will be "proven right". But, barring injury, McDavid will almost certainly become the first player in 27 years to score 130 points, and he has a good chance at becoming only the 10th player in NHL history to reach 140.
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What’s interesting is his on-ice shooting percentage is still low this year and he’s actually generating fewer chances 5v5, but the PP numbers are through the roof so they’re pushing him above what he did last year. It’ll be interesting to see if an when both game states normalize, and how it will affect his numbers the rest of the year.
 
Think scoring ain't easier this season ?...... Skinner 23 points in last12 games.

Just one of a multitude of examples
 
MikeyMike01 said:
How valuable are you, really, if you miss the playoffs?
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Gonna call San Jose and offer a 3rd for Meier or Karlsson because they'll miss the playoffs so how valuable are they....

Value is based on a players individual inputs, not a team result. It's like saying X player is bad because his +/- is -20 when he had the worst goaltending in the league.

Would Gretzky putting up 200pts but missing not be the greatest season ever and thus he'd be the most valuable.
 
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steleh said:
And this is precisely why i think this argument doesn't work. Like what? You put up 150 points, 50-60 goals, your team misses the playoffs. Alright. What else could you have done? Played goalkeeper aswell? Been the coach behind the bench in between your shifts? Responsible for drafting and player development in between games?
No, the heart trophy is for most valuable player, and you can be the leagues most valuable player to your team even if your team fails to make the playoffs. You have to imagine what they would have been without said player.
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In addition to what you said, fon't forget that McDavid also apparently has to:
- Have a significant point gap over the 2nd leading scorer on the team
- Not have won the Hart easily in recent seasons
- Be considered an "above average defensive player" by all the analytics guys on Twitter

Only then has he earned the Hart Trophy in the minds of his doubters. But we've learned they will create other reasons not vote for him.
 
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Frank the Tank said:
In addition to what you said, fon't forget that McDavid also apparently has to:
- Have a significant point gap over the 2nd leading scorer on the team
- Not have won the Hart easily in recent seasons
- Be considered an "above average defensive player" by all the analytics guys on Twitter

Only then has he earned the Hart Trophy in the minds of his doubters. But we've learned they will create other reasons not vote for him.
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When you have morons like Stan Fischler saying they'd take multiple players ahead of McDavid and that Crosby and Ovechkin might still be better than him because they play a 200 foot game.

Alot of uninformed media out there.
 
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Tobias Kahun said:
When you have morons like Stan Fischler saying they'd take multiple players ahead of McDavid and that Crosby and Ovechkin might still be better than him because they play a 200 foot game.

Alot of uninformed media out there.
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Stan Fischler said that Ovi is playing a 200 foot game this season?
 
Tobias Kahun said:
When you have morons like Stan Fischler saying they'd take multiple players ahead of McDavid and that Crosby and Ovechkin might still be better than him because they play a 200 foot game.

Alot of uninformed media out there.
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Didn't Fischler make a career of attempting to discredit Gretzky across his career? Him and Dick Beddoes were the definition of professional jimmy rustlers.

Edit: found one article
www.nytimes.com

HOCKEY;Is Great One Not So Great? (Published 1996)

www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

wetcoast said:
Stan Fischler said that Ovi is playing a 200 foot game this season?
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Yeah, they coaxed him out from under his bridge for a Hockey News article

www.google.com

Fischler Report: McDavid Is the Most Spectacular – But Isn’t the Best

Stan Fischler discusses Connor McDavid, compares Alex Ovechkin and Gordie Howe and much more.
www.google.com www.google.com
 
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Tobias Kahun said:
"A good case could still be made for Crosby, Ovechkin and Stamkos for “Best Player In The World.” They play the 200-foot game the way it’s supposed to be played. They are also captains who genuinely lead their teams."
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None of those guys even have a good two-way game. Should go with Bergeron to actually have an intellectually coherent point, if you value two-way play and leadership so much.
 
jigglysquishy said:
This is the same Fischler who said Gretzky, in the midst of a 200 point season, would be lucky to make the third line on the 60s Leafs.

He's been the king of dumb hockey takes for 40 years.
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No that's Dick Beddoes, Fischler was actually fairly high on Gretzky (he had it in for Orr after their falling out), ranked him 10th all time in 1984, second to Gordie Howe four years later.
 
Frank the Tank said:
Didn't Fischler make a career of attempting to discredit Gretzky across his career? Him and Dick Beddoes were the definition of professional jimmy rustlers.

Edit: found one article
www.nytimes.com

HOCKEY;Is Great One Not So Great? (Published 1996)

www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com


Yeah, they coaxed him out from under his bridge for a Hockey News article

www.google.com

Fischler Report: McDavid Is the Most Spectacular – But Isn’t the Best

Stan Fischler discusses Connor McDavid, compares Alex Ovechkin and Gordie Howe and much more.
www.google.com www.google.com
Click to expand...
Man that was a painful read, especially the part where he says this

A good case could still be made for Crosby, Ovechkin and Stamkos for “Best Player In The World.” They play the 200-foot game the way it’s supposed to be played. They are also captains who genuinely lead their teams.
Click to expand...

I mean I get the argument for Crosby be in the top 5 for Hart discussion but Ovi or Stamkos playing 200 foot games....er what?
 
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