Martin Brodeur vs Dominik Hasek, who would you draft

[Albatros]

it took NINE other HOFers on the team for Hasek to win his only cup as a starter.

There were three other HHoFers in that team, only one of them 35 or younger.

 

[dgibb10]

There were three other HHoFers in that team, only one of them 35 or younger.

9. There were 9 other hall of famers on that team.

If you're referring to the one Osgood won, then yes there were 3 on that team. But hasek was the backup on that team

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Would you like to simply dickride hasek?

Yes, you're clearly arguing in good faith.

I'll repeat my question - which you've ignored twice. If you were to draft Hasek *right now*, what is preventing him from playing in the NHL this fall?

 

[dgibb10]

Yes, you're clearly arguing in good faith.

I'll repeat my question - which you've ignored twice. If you were to draft Hasek *right now*, what is preventing him from playing in the NHL this fall?

The same things that stop russians and other european goalies in today's day and age.

Shesterkin and sorokin still didn't come over till their mid 20s.

You seem to be vastly underestimating how valuable and rare the fact that broduer was an elite NHL goalie at age 21 was. And the value of the vast workload he took on

 

[Snuggs]

Would you like to simply dickride hasek?

What if he also didn't retire on a team with 9 (will be potentially 10 at some point if/when zetterberg gets in) HOFers leaving them out to lunch in 02-03. And yes, it took NINE other HOFers on the team for Hasek to win his only cup as a starter. And yes they still won with Chris Osgood in net.

Hasek quit on a superteam. He played for the best team of the 2000s, by far. And quit on them. So I don't want to hear any bullshit crying about the help hasek had.

Stop riding some Canadian Frenchmen so hard.


Very surprising though, honestly to see the polls at 80% one way.

 

[dgibb10]

You don't even know what you're talking about, "quit" he started all five games in the finals and had 65 games played in the regular season.

Manny Legace was his back up in the regular season.

Chris Osgood came the year after, when Hasek retired, then came back mid/early season.

Stop riding some Canadian Frenchmen so hard and you could google your own info.

Yes, he won 1 cup as a starter on a team with 9 other HOFers (broduer never had it that easy)

And then he quit in 2002-2003, probably burning 1-2 cups in the process, on again, a superteam

 

[POVERTY]

I'll take Hasek since he's the GOAT and Brodeur isn't.

 

[HugeInTheShire]

He was a good goalie as I indicated by goalies 4 thru 12. Yes he was the best puck handler. Trade him to buffalo and hasek to NJ. NJ never loses while buffalo would struggle to make the playoffs. Hasek literally carried them every season as far as he could

I disagree, I think it's quite the opposite. If Marty was on Buffalo and they played the same style as NJ, they'd be the ones that dominated that era. Also Hasek wasn't equipped to play NJ's style either, he'd struggle there as well. There is a reason that NJ's "trap" was so much better than everyone else's and it's not because they were the only ones doing it.

People really fail to understand that NJ had the perfect combination of players buying in and an elite goaltender. Hasek is a superior puck stopper, but that doesn't make him the correct choice here.

 

[Mike C]

Brodeur is my all time favorite goalie

That trapezoid rule is all because of him

 

[DJB]

Am I the only one that thinks Brodeur was overrated? Played behind two HOF d men and in a defensive stifling system back in the clutch and grab days.

Hes a step below Hasek and Roy despite his accomplishments to me

 

[dgibb10]

Am I the only one that thinks Brodeur was overrated? Played behind two HOF d men and in a defensive stifling system back in the clutch and grab days.

Hes a step below Hasek and Roy despite his accomplishments to me

Hasek's only cup as a starter also came behind 2 HOF dman (and SEVEN HOF forwards)

 

[dgibb10]

Am I the only one that thinks Brodeur was overrated? Played behind two HOF d men and in a defensive stifling system back in the clutch and grab days.

Hes a step below Hasek and Roy despite his accomplishments to me

Surely broduer didn't win multiple vezinas after Stevens and Neidermeyer left

 

[Snuggs]

Yes, he won 1 cup as a starter on a team with 9 other HOFers (broduer never had it that easy)

And then he quit in 2002-2003, probably burning 1-2 cups in the process, on again, a superteam

My mistake, I thought you just meant in-general he quit on the Red Wings.

*I'll take my own advice. Lol. *

 

[Albatros]

If you're referring to the one Osgood won, then yes there were 3 on that team. But hasek was the backup on that teamView attachment 903484

Osgood played in the finals, but Hašek started 40 regular season and 4 playoff games. No other goalie in league history has played as many games in a season at that age (with the possible exception of Johnny Bower depending on his real age).

There's Osgood's own take on playing with Hašek in his elderly years:

https://x.com/i/web/status/1319769963012509701

 

[Michael Farkas]

Am I the only one that thinks Brodeur was overrated? Played behind two HOF d men and in a defensive stifling system back in the clutch and grab days.

Hes a step below Hasek and Roy despite his accomplishments to me

The only one? I think this opinion is so far behind that it would just be considered "modern" and we're at post-postmodern probably.

"The Brodeur played behind..." thing is just lazy at this point, in my opinion. As if his whole 20 year career was in the same era with the same team in the same circumstances...and Patrick Roy's and Dominik Hasek's teams were out there holding their butt-ends on the ice instead of their blades.

I'm not saying Brodeur is better or not. But that argument is basically the "Napoleon Bonaparte was mad because he was the shortest man in France" haha

 

[HugeInTheShire]

Am I the only one that thinks Brodeur was overrated? Played behind two HOF d men and in a defensive stifling system back in the clutch and grab days.

Hes a step below Hasek and Roy despite his accomplishments to me

Brodeur at 39 years old took the 2012 team to the finals with a D core of Bryce Salvador, Marek Zidlicky, Anton Volchenkov, Andy Greene, Mark Fayne and Peter Harrold. That is much worse than anything Hasek took deep.

 

[Michael Farkas]

If Marty was on Buffalo and they played the same style as NJ, they'd be the ones that dominated that era. Also Hasek wasn't equipped to play NJ's style either, he'd struggle there as well. There is a reason that NJ's "trap" was so much better than everyone else's and it's not because they were the only ones doing it.

Brodeur's save pct in Buffalo would likely be higher. I also think it would have brought out some different strengths one way or the other. Either Lindy Ruff would have found a way to play to Brodeur's strengths or...Buffalo plays the same way and Brodeur is better with short side shots than his he was in his career.

Hasek I find to be a little less "adaptable" in the traditional sense because he just did his own thing for the most part. If the Devils played the same style with him, his save pct would obviously go down - which would hurt his fanfare I guess - but he'd still do all right (and then some). I'd be curious to see what he did in his game facing shots from medium and long range - which was not really his strength. I don't think he had it in him to ever be good at handling the puck...so that puts a lot more on guys like Ken Daneyko than they cared to take on probably.

The idea of Dominik Hasek's famous charges out to the top of the circles being combined with Scott Stevens ability to, uhh, surgically remove a player from the ice would be interesting to watch, if nothing else...

 

[Caps8112]

I disagree, I think it's quite the opposite. If Marty was on Buffalo and they played the same style as NJ, they'd be the ones that dominated that era. Also Hasek wasn't equipped to play NJ's style either, he'd struggle there as well. There is a reason that NJ's "trap" was so much better than everyone else's and it's not because they were the only ones doing it.

People really fail to understand that NJ had the perfect combination of players buying in and an elite goaltender. Hasek is a superior puck stopper, but that doesn't make him the correct choice here.

But that’s not what I said. Just trade goalies and don’t change anything else about the teams and NJ would have won more with prime hasek while buffalo would have struggled more.

 

[HugeInTheShire]

Brodeur's save pct in Buffalo would likely be higher. I also think it would have brought out some different strengths one way or the other. Either Lindy Ruff would have found a way to play to Brodeur's strengths or...Buffalo plays the same way and Brodeur is better with short side shots than his he was in his career.

Hasek I find to be a little less "adaptable" in the traditional sense because he just did his own thing for the most part. If the Devils played the same style with him, his save pct would obviously go down - which would hurt his fanfare I guess - but he'd still do all right (and then some). I'd be curious to see what he did in his game facing shots from medium and long range - which was not really his strength. I don't think he had it in him to ever be good at handling the puck...so that puts a lot more on guys like Ken Daneyko than they cared to take on probably.

The idea of Dominik Hasek's famous charges out to the top of the circles being combined with Scott Stevens ability to, uhh, surgically remove a player from the ice would be interesting to watch, if nothing else...

Hasek wouldn't have had a lot of success playing the system NJ did, simply because his puck handling wasn't anywhere near even average and the system depends on the goalie having that ability. Without that teams could dump the puck into the corner and punish the D every time, with Marty back there they didn't even bother going into the corner because Marty would get it, at least until they changed the rules so he couldn't anymore.

I've said it countless times, Hasek is the better goalie but Marty being willing to take less money all the time and play over 70 games most seasons makes him the better choice here. To me if it's for 1-5 seasons, I take Hasek, if it's for 1 playoffs, I take Roy and if it's for an entire career I take Marty.

 

[Romang67]

The team who drafted Hasek got 25 games of sub 0.900 goaltending from him.
The team who drafted Broduer got 20 years of excellence

You choose hasek over broduer as a GM and you probably end up fired before hasek even makes the NHL

Why would Hasek be stuck behind the iron curtain in 2024?

 

[dgibb10]

Why would Hasek be stuck behind the iron curtain in 2024?

Why did Shesterkin and Sorokin still not come over until they were in their mid 20s?

 

[HugeInTheShire]

But that’s not what I said. Just trade goalies and don’t change anything else about the teams and NJ would have won more with prime hasek while buffalo would have struggled more. We’ll have to agree to disagree

If that's the case then NJ wouldn't have won more with Hasek, he couldn't play in their system. That system relied heavily on the puck handling of Brodeur.

He's a better puck stopper and that'd help but if we're not changing anything about systems, neither one is likely in the conversation as the best of all time if they played each others system. People seriously underestimate the amount they relied on Brodeur and this ability. Hasek wouldn't have been able to handle the requirements of playing the puck to be successful in NJ.

You'll think that I'm overestimating the importance of the puck handling but, there are few goalies that could have handled the puck as much as was required. He was the perfect goalie for the system he played in.

Although in saying that, I'm kind of second guessing taking him in this poll because while he did win quite a bit after the trap, he never won the Cup after.

 

[Romang67]

Why did Shesterkin and Sorokin still not come over until they were in their mid 20s?

Seems they enjoyed playing in their home country. Are you under the impression that Hasek is Russian?

 

[dgibb10]

Seems they enjoyed playing in their home country. Are you under the impression that Hasek is Russian?

European goalie who took a long time to come over vs european goalie who took a long time to come over.

Hasek came over at age 26 and still didn't become an NHL starter for another 3 years, why are we adding a half decade of presumed elite play to him before that

 

[x Tame Impala]

Am I the only one that thinks Brodeur was overrated? Played behind two HOF d men and in a defensive stifling system back in the clutch and grab days.

Hes a step below Hasek and Roy despite his accomplishments to me

This is a contrarian opinion if I ever saw one. His trophy case and accomplishments automatically disqualify him from being overrated.

Regardless, overrated in terms of what? Being on the same par as Roy and Hasek? Even if he’s 3rd on that list he’s still among the greatest goalies of all time.