Marner Predictions - What Happens Now

[rumman]

Yeah well that’s how shit goes sometimes. Lots of superstars and hall of famers do not have Stanley cups and it shouldn’t and doesn’t take away from what they’ve accomplished in their careers.

Also people need to stop crying. These guys are 27/28 years old. They are not 35. They can still win a cup. It’s not over for them. Ovechkin won his at 33, Yzerman in his 30’s and there’s others who grinded it out with their teams. Yeah would it have been nice for them to grab one earlier? Sure, but all hope isn’t lost. I don’t blame you if you choose to be apathetic to the team (even though I think it’s a shitty way to be a fan LMAO), but I think these guys will eventually get over the hump, might take some time maybe it’s just 2 of them still here when it happens. Who knows.

Can you name another team with four superstar forwards that haven’t won a cup? Oilers come to mind, but nothing else pops into my head?

 

[francis246]

Don’t bring facts into the conversation, revert back to regular season warriors……

Well the playoffs is one part of your career it’s not the entire thing. So while it is fair to criticize players for their lack of performance in the playoffs it is not fair to try and diminish their entire career based on playoffs. Hockey is a team sport. Everything has to fall in place to win. Edmonton is a prime example, even with arguably the two best players in the world who defy the odds and perform even better in the playoffs than they do in the regular season could not get it done. Team sports is just like that, every part of the team has to be there for you to win.

Can you name another team with four superstars that haven’t won a cup? Oilers come to mind, but nothing else pops into my head?

Should we limit it to hockey? Or can we include other sports? Because I have some examples

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Weird? lol The irony.. coming from the poster who has an odd obsession with Marner and lives in the Marner threads.

Heres a link to the "Marner appreciation thread" you created. You know the one where you demanded posters be banned if they criticized Marner?

Tribute - Marner Appreciation Thread

Kid is on a serious heater, time for a fresh thread. Marner is now up to a 14-game points streak, after hustling in and centring for John Tavares’ club-high 12th goal. Marner is the seventh Leaf with a run that long, joining Darryl Sittler, Ed Olczyk, Babe Dye, John Anderson, Lorne Carr and...

forums.hfboards.com

Re: Hello Kitty, AC/DC, et al:

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it".

-Upton Sinclair-

 

[francis246]

Can you name another team with four superstars that haven’t won a cup? Oilers come to mind, but nothing else pops into my head?

Off the top of my head,

2010/11 Vancouver Canucks. They legit had 4 or 5 superstars. They had the Art Ross, Ted Lindsey, Selke and Jennings winning players all on the same team and also won the presidents trophy

02/03 Ottawa Senators, 06/07 Ottawa Senators

Any SAN Jose Sharks team lol

05/06 Buffalo Sabres

95/96 St. Louis Blues

Teams that fall in that category but eventually the organization won a cup.

18/19 Tampa Bay Lightning
95/96 Red Wings
85/86 Oilers
92/93 Penguins
09/10, 15/16, 16/17Capitals
05/06 Red Wings
21/22 Panthers
2013/14 Blackhawks
02/03 Avalanche

 

[egd27]

Can you name another team with four superstars that haven’t won a cup? Oilers come to mind, but nothing else pops into my head?

The argument of what defines a "superstar" will be inevitable, but the 03-04 Sens

Alfredsson
Hossa
Spezza
Chara

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Not knowing what you're doing isn't much of an excuse.

He should have stopped at "I've never knowingly posted..."

 

[rumman]

The argument of what defines a "superstar" will be inevitable, but the 03-04 Sens

Alfredsson
Hossa
Spezza
Chara

My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….

Off the top of my head,

2010/11 Vancouver Canucks. They legit had 4 or 5 superstars. They had the Art Ross, Ted Lindsey, Selke and Jennings winning players all on the same team and also won the presidents trophy

02/03 Ottawa Senators, 06/07 Ottawa Senators

Any SAN Jose Sharks team lol

My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….

 

[egd27]

My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….

So JT and MM are "superstars" for the purpose of this argument?

 

[rumman]

So JT and MM are "superstars" for the purpose of this argument?

I’m using Leaf Nation standards here…….

 

[francis246]

My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….


My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….

Okay Vancouver Canucks 10/11

Henrik, Daniel, Kessler, Burrows/Samuelsson

So JT and MM are "superstars" for the purpose of this argument?

Agreed, I thought Marner isn’t a superstar haha

 

[francis246]

My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….


My apologies, I should have said four superstar forwards…….

Either way I think the list I’ve provided pretty much shows that having a stacked team doesn’t always mean you’re gonna win. But sometimes if you stick with it you’ll break through. The reality is no one knows what can happen. Leafs can make changes and that helps us get closer to winning a cup. They can stay the same and nothing changes or the guys figure it out. Or we can make changes and things get worse.

 

[ACC1224]

So JT and MM are "superstars" for the purpose of this argument?

They get easily confused.

I love the made up "Marner wants 14" and then in the same breath want facts.
Some funny shit for sure.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

The only thing we know for certain is that the player doesn't want to leave, everything else is just fantasy.

That’s lip service.

You’d be kidding yourself to believe the “I want to stay really badly” talk.

Odd you got suckered into that obvious line.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

He knows what he’ll get. If the decision was made, it would be best for all parties to sign and trade. Negotiate an 8 yr deal in July and be done with it.

It’s fairly obvious to me that decision has not been made.

Sign and Trade is best for the Leafs, not Marner.

Marner knows the Leafs have moved on and picked Nylander over him.

love the made up "Marner wants 14" and then in the same breath want facts.

That is definitely made up.

But it’s effectively true. He definitely wants “too much”.

Tre isn’t negotiating. He knows Marner is going to free agency and he picked Nylander anyways.

 

[rumman]

Sign and Trade is best for the Leafs, not Marner.

Marner knows the Leafs have moved on and picked Nylander over him.


That is definitely made up.

But it’s effectively true. He definitely wants “too much”.

Tre isn’t negotiating. He knows Marner is going to free agency and he picked Nylander anyways.

He’d have to be a idiot to not realize they don’t want him, but that won’t stop them from signing him imo…….

 

[Madap]

Either way I think the list I’ve provided pretty much shows that having a stacked team doesn’t always mean you’re gonna win. But sometimes if you stick with it you’ll break through. The reality is no one knows what can happen. Leafs can make changes and that helps us get closer to winning a cup. They can stay the same and nothing changes or the guys figure it out. Or we can make changes and things get worse.

Okay now name a team that has lost that many times in the first round in a decade. Literally any team, doesn’t have to be one with 4 superstar forwards.

It’s not random chance. It’s not comparable to other teams. Our stars, and the rest of the team, have been historically horrible. It’s unprecedented.

You’re right that things can turn around still, but from what we’ve seen, the chances of that are so damn small. Anyone who doesn’t want a change to this core is fooling themselves.

 

[Peasy]

Okay now name a team that has lost that many times in the first round in a decade. Literally any team, doesn’t have to be one with 4 superstar forwards.

It’s not random chance. It’s not comparable to other teams. Our stars, and the rest of the team, have been historically horrible. It’s unprecedented.

You’re right that things can turn around still, but from what we’ve seen, the chances of that are so damn small. Anyone who doesn’t want a change to this core is fooling themselves.

They'll just respond with the Leafs being unlucky in their match ups and constantly having to go against higher seeds. They'll say that with a straight face when they know they lost to the lousy habs and cbj. Those teams havent had a problem beating higher seeds here and there, if the Leafs are so great why cant they?

 

[Hellcat]

I don't pay setup men as if they can score. I pay the actual goal scorers and play drivers. Marner has proven he's unable to rise to the call of playoff hockey.

You build your Stanley Cup team. I'll build mine.

10.8 for a winger, who is below average in: shooting, zone entry, carrying the puck, retrieving the puck, physical play. It's like the GM was a friend of his from the Marlies?


#1) Ferris absolutely sucks.
#2) Bye Marner. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

First problem with your statement, is you dont pay anyone anything. Take a look at primary assist leaders over the last 8 years. He's a PPG player in the playoffs over the last 3 years, with a minimum of 20 games played (147 players meet that criteria) he is among the elite assist and point producers, 10th in A/60, 12th in P/GP, not sure where you got this weird take he does not rise to the call in the playoffs, simple stats would suggest otherwise.

It's not that he has a bad shot, it's that he has the best shooter in the last 40 years at his center, do you want what will be at the end of Mattys career the greatest goal scorer of all time taking the shot or do you want anyone else taking the shot? There is literally no one else in the league that is a better shooter than Matty. The more shots Mitch takes the less Matty takes, that seems on the surface a stupid strategy TBH.

That below average player, is 10th in points since 2016-17, If you look at players who were drafted in his draft year up till today, only McDavid and Matthews have scored more points. Attempting to paint a false narrative that this guy is some shlub of a player, when he is among elite players, is intentionally deceptive. Next thing disingenuous people are going to say he is a pigeon who only scores because of Matty/Nylander. Kuch plays with Stammer and Point - who's the pigeon? McDavid plays with Drai - who's the pigeon? MacKinnon plays with Rantanen/Makar - who's the pigeon?

They'll just respond with the Leafs being unlucky in their match ups and constantly having to go against higher seeds. They'll say that with a straight face when they know they lost to the lousy habs and cbj. Those teams havent had a problem beating higher seeds here and there, if the Leafs are so great why cant they?

 

[HamiltonNHL]

He's a PPG player

PG

That’s the issue. I’m not interested in PG stats.

The team moved on from Marner. People need to accept it. They picked Nylander.

It's not that he has a bad shot

his shot is objectively bad.
You are off here, by a lot.

 

[Hellcat]

That’s lip service.

You’d be kidding yourself to believe the “I want to stay really badly” talk.

Odd you got suckered into that obvious line.

Sounds like a guy who is packing his bags eh?

https://athlonsports.com/nhl/toronto-maple-leafs/maple-leafs-mitch-marners-ontario-event-speculation-future

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Sounds like a guy who is packing his bags eh?

https://athlonsports.com/nhl/toronto-maple-leafs/maple-leafs-mitch-marners-ontario-event-speculation-future

He is packing.
The team moved on.

There is no spot for him.

The expensive winger slot was given to Nylander

 

[Hellcat]

PG

That’s the issue. I’m not interested in PG stats.

The team moved on from Marner. People need to accept it. They picked Nylander.


his shot is objectively bad.
You are off here, by a lot.

He has a career 13% SH%, general rule of thumb anyone above 10% is elite. Objectively your perception is flawed.

How did the team move on from Marner?

 

[HamiltonNHL]

How did the team move on from Marner?

They aren’t signing him.

 

[Hellcat]

He is packing.
The team moved on.

There is no spot for him.

It's rare a team moves on from an elite top ten player. Teams are more about protecting assets, we can debate if Marner is top ten or top 100, but none the less he is an asset that generates points and is deployed defensively, this sort of player would be in demand from most teams. It would be irresponsible, an abdication of GM duties to let him walk for nothing.

They aren’t signing him.

Why?

 

[HamiltonNHL]

He has a career 13% SH%, general rule of thumb anyone above 10% is elite.

I’ll use Goals to determine elite shooting, Thank you.

I’m also aware of the open net, goalie out of position goals Marner gets.

He can slide the puck on the ice.

It's rare a team moves on from an elite top ten player. Teams are more about protecting assets, we can debate if Marner is top ten or top 100, but none the less he is an asset that generates points and is deployed defensively, this sort of player would be in demand from most teams. It would be irresponsible, an abdication of GM duties to let him walk for nothing.

The core doesn’t work.

You don’t pretend you are getting results when you aren’t.

Change is needed and Marner’s cap space is where the money will come from.

It’s not hard.