TSN: Marner on tsn: "We are grown men".

[francis246]

The way I read it, he wasn't complaining about how much he made and he wasn't complaining about how much Marner made either. It sounded to me like he was complaining about Marner not working his butt off while making obscene amounts of money.

So as a working stiff, he feels like if Marner is getting all that dough, he as a fan has the right to expect Marner to work his ass off every single period of hockey he plays and I agree. Bobby Orr said the same thing, he doesn't begrudge the money players make now but feels that they should be giving 100% out there all the time in return (paraphrasing).

I bought Orr's book, remember reading that and nodding my head in agreement. You're living the dream, making a ton of money to play the game you love and in Marner's case, you even get to do it for the team you grew up dreaming of playing for - your hometown. There is zero excuse for mailing it in, not even for one shift. JMHO.

But that’s my point anyone who thinks they aren’t trying is a fool IMO. They are, they just aren’t producing and there’s a big difference. You don’t get 90+ points year after year by not trying. You’re not voted first team RW back to back years by not trying.

Not producing doesn’t always = lack of effort.

But I just find the comparison “that I work harder compared to these guys” silly. These guys work just as hard and in some cases harder than the average fan to keep their bodies and minds ready each day to play a high impact sport

 

[Gary Nylund]

But that’s my point anyone who thinks they aren’t trying is a fool IMO. They are, they just aren’t producing and there’s a big difference. You don’t get 90+ points year after year by not trying. You’re not voted first team RW back to back years by not trying.

Not producing doesn’t always = lack of effort.

But I just find the comparison “that I work harder compared to these guys” silly. These guys work just as hard and in some cases harder than the average fan to keep their bodies and minds ready each day to play a high impact sport

There's a big gap between "not trying" and "giving 100%". I'm pretty sure there are times when players could be trying harder than they are.

 

[francis246]

There's a big gap between "not trying" and "giving 100%". I'm pretty sure there are times when players could be trying harder than they are.

I agree, but even I have the cognitive ability to understand that it is not realistic for any human to sustain that level of effort every night over an 82 game schedule. But you want to have it for as many games as you possibly can.

However I do agree in the sense that it is early in the year and they should have that fire early. But some people they start off slower and find it. Some people have it right off the bat and taper.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I agree, but even I have the cognitive ability to understand that it is not realistic for any human to sustain that level of effort every night over an 82 game schedule. But you want to have it for as many games as you possibly can.

However I do agree in the sense that it is early in the year and they should have that fire early. But some people they start off slower and find it. Some people have it right off the bat and taper.

I agree nobody can give 100% 100% of the time. Some do it more often than others, some do it not as often as they could/should and it's only natural that when fans feel like the players could be giving more, they get pissed.

 

[francis246]

I agree nobody can give 100% 100% of the time. Some do it more often than others, some do it not as often as they could/should and it's only natural that when fans feel like the players could be giving more, they get pissed.

And I think that’s where fans have a right to be pissed. For whatever reason we don’t have players who give more effort on a nightly basis than not.

We have players who mail it in more often

 

[Racer88]

I understand that, but it’s not Marner’s job to manage the cap. It’s Dubas’

I agree with you 100% and that’s why I am firmly on the fire the incompetent Dubas

 

[Gary Nylund]

We are grown men, hear us roar.

 

[Apex Predator]

We are grown men, hear us roar.

Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh
Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh
Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh
You're gonna hear me roar

 

[Gabriel426]

Literally above my post there’s a guy who complains about not making more than 50,000 in his life. And somehow that’s supposed to be Marner’s fault? Why he felt the need to bring that up in a Marner thread is beyond me.

There are fans who absolutely hate this guy cause he didn’t take a discount and they feel he’s not giving the same work ethic they give on a daily basis at their own shitty job they hate for way less money.

So yes I do feel like there is a portion of the fan base that looks at the money he makes and projects their inadequacies in their own life. Absolutely

People need to realize this is the new wave of athletes. They are their own brand, own entity, they are money driven. Maybe few aren’t that way but most are even if they don’t outwardly show it. It’s how they sustain their lifestyle. They are also trying to build generational wealth right. So they will try and get as much as they can.

To me when I read the poster you are referring. It had more to do with someone who doesn’t want to cheer a player who is not producing and not giving his all on the ice. Certainly his contract value is a reference to his NHL peers and what other players at the 10mil plus are producing. His reason could be saying Engvall at 2.3mil is not pulling his weight and not playing with heart, would you still made the comment you did?

Also, this is just in general. I hate any players who mailed it in and esp those who Load Management. Now I understand players will have bad games and sometime they need to save themselves for playoffs….but I just find it hard to agree with someone who LM in Nov or Dec. Fans buy tickets to see the top stars and if those top stars LM, can the fans get refund for those tickets? To be sports is entertainment and in order for the fans to get the max. value, the players need to show they are performing at their best.

In my opinion, people can choose to cheer whoever they want or not for whatever the reason. It is a personal opinion. When it comes to sports, I find it quite unnecessary to use your argument and attack other poster. At the end of the day, what’s a player’s worth is his production on the ICE. If MM is playing great and leading the Leafs to Cups, I doubt anyone would be saying much about how much he is making.
His contract value has a direction relation to Leafs on ice performance. And when he is not producing and plus the fact that he ain’t the brightest when it comes to the press, it is understandable why some fans will be calling him out.

 

[Gabriel426]

Agreed, you can’t compare what you go through in your normal job to what these guys are doing. It’s not the same. But a lot of people do and they end up bitter.

Exactly, these guys are going to take whatever the market says they are worth. Are we forgetting that somebody (cough cough Dubas) put that number in front of Marner. If someone says here have 10.93 million are you realistically gonna say you know what I’m gonna take 9. Come on lol. Not a chance.

Even with other superstars like Rantanen, Point, Aho those teams didn’t offer them over 10.93. Those superstars probably asked for it, but the teams put a hard number of 9.5 or 9 in front of them and the players took it. If Dubas wanted Marner at 9 or 9.5, he should have stood firm at that number. You can’t blame Marner for accepting life changing money that was put in front of him. Can you be upset with him for not living up to the contract? yes absolutely but that’s more on Dubas for handing it to him

Players can ask for whatever amount they want and it is up to MGT to agree or not. Having said that, the players also need to be accountable for producing at their end.
I see no problem for fans to criticize players and MGT when they dropped the ball. Fans here criticize Dubas even more than MM.

 

[francis246]

To me when I read the poster you are referring. It had more to do with someone who doesn’t want to cheer a player who is not producing and not giving his all on the ice. Certainly his contract value is a reference to his NHL peers and what other players at the 10mil plus are producing. His reason could be saying Engvall at 2.3mil is not pulling his weight and not playing with heart, would you still made the comment you did?

In my opinion, people can choose to cheer whoever they want or not for whatever the reason. It is a personal opinion. When it comes to sports, I find it quite unnecessary to use your argument and attack other poster. At the end of the day, what’s a player’s worth is his production on the ICE. If MM is playing great and leading the Leafs to Cups, I doubt anyone would be saying much about how much he is making.
His contract value has a direction relation to Leafs on ice performance. And when he is not producing and plus the fact that he ain’t the brightest when it comes to the press, it is understandable why some fans will be calling him out.

Yeah I would still make the comment. Because I think it’s true, a lot of fans project their feelings onto players and make things personal.

I have no problems with him not wanting to cheer for Mitch. What I have an issue with is fans trying to compare their honest lifestyle or the fact that they take less money to work an honest job and then call an athlete selfish for doing what’s in their best interest. Marner isn’t forcing you to be underpayed. The situation an athlete is in financially is not comparable to someone who works a typical job.

Criticize Marner’s play 100%, but you don’t really have a right to call him selfish because you would have never taken over 10 million to play for the leafs lol. What?!

 

[cannucky]

I'll take the player who kicks the boards punches wall and smashes his sticks over the the guy that just sits there and smirks any effing day of the week , at least he cares enough to get mad and at least he goes into the corner and battles when he gets back out there , people criticize the guy who wants to earn his pay so badly then heap praise on the three douchebags that really just don't give two shytes .

 

[andora]

I'll take the player who kicks the boards punches wall and smashes his sticks over the the guy that just sits there and smirks any effing day of the week , at least he cares enough to get mad and at least he goes into the corner and battles when he gets back out there , people criticize the guy who wants to earn his pay so badly then heap praise on the three douchebags that really just don't give two shytes .

What if the player does both

 

[freshwind]

I'll take the player who kicks the boards punches wall and smashes his sticks over the the guy that just sits there and smirks any effing day of the week , at least he cares enough to get mad and at least he goes into the corner and battles when he gets back out there , people criticize the guy who wants to earn his pay so badly then heap praise on the three douchebags that really just don't give two shytes .

my question (not necessarily pointed at you) is did he get upset at the turnover on the ice that cost a goal - it did not appear so - or did he get upset at being told to take a seat for a shift?
2 very different scenarios and point to opposite conclusions in my view ... troubling

 

[Gaberd2608]

Yeah I would still make the comment. Because I think it’s true, a lot of fans project their feelings onto players and make things personal.

I have no problems with him not wanting to cheer for Mitch. What I have an issue with is fans trying to compare their honest lifestyle or the fact that they take less money to work an honest job and then call an athlete selfish for doing what’s in their best interest. Marner isn’t forcing you to be underpayed. The situation an athlete is in financially is not comparable to someone who works a typical job.

Criticize Marner’s play 100%, but you don’t really have a right to call him selfish because you would have never taken over 10 million to play for the leafs lol. What?!

I think my personal issue with Matthews and Marner is that they seem to get pissy if they do not play together.

If a player is going to ask for the moon, the earth, and the stars in a contract, they need to also understand that the pot is only so big so the trade off is that they may need to play with lesser players. For contrast, Crosby can play with scrubs and elevate their game without drawing attention or being a diva.

With cap hits of $11 mill, Matthews and Marner should be able to drive their own lines. If they did that we would not have depth issues and there would be no problems. While I don't begrudge a playing from not leaving money on the table, the player should understand that there is still a consequence. Sure we can say it is the GM's responsibility to manage the cap but I think a good agent might be wise to say he buddy, I can get you $15 million per season but you will likely need to play with scrubs since the team wont be able to afford support players for you. I don't think this is a Leaf situation, if a team wants to offer Matthews a big payday when he is a UFA they will have similar problems as we have now.

If Matthews and Marner would play with anyone and be happy and also improve those players while putting up points we would probably be in good shape...

Robertson-Matthews-Kerfoot
Jarnkrok-Tavares-Nylander
Bunting-Holmberg-Marner
Engvall-Kampf-Simmonds

 

[Racer88]

my question (not necessarily pointed at you) is did he get upset at the turnover on the ice that cost a goal - it did not appear so - or did he get upset at being told to take a seat for a shift?
2 very different scenarios and point to opposite conclusions in my view ... troubling

Bingo. You got it. If he had smashed his stick coming back on to the bench right away or as soon as he got on the bench I would be pleased but the Timelapse sure does indicate that it was displeasure at being told to sit a shift.

 

[cannucky]

my question (not necessarily pointed at you) is did he get upset at the turnover on the ice that cost a goal - it did not appear so - or did he get upset at being told to take a seat for a shift?
2 very different scenarios and point to opposite conclusions in my view ... troubling

Most likely both , did he come back to the bench and high five his line mates after the turnover ? or did he sit there stewing and lose it after being called out ? Sometimes shyte piles up eh ! It's not always the single turd that causes the spill .

 

[ToneDog]

I think my personal issue with Matthews and Marner is that they seem to get pissy if they do not play together.

If a player is going to ask for the moon, the earth, and the stars in a contract, they need to also understand that the pot is only so big so the trade off is that they may need to play with lesser players. For contrast, Crosby can play with scrubs and elevate their game without drawing attention or being a diva.

With cap hits of $11 mill, Matthews and Marner should be able to drive their own lines. If they did that we would not have depth issues and there would be no problems. While I don't begrudge a playing from not leaving money on the table, the player should understand that there is still a consequence. Sure we can say it is the GM's responsibility to manage the cap but I think a good agent might be wise to say he buddy, I can get you $15 million per season but you will likely need to play with scrubs since the team wont be able to afford support players for you. I don't think this is a Leaf situation, if a team wants to offer Matthews a big payday when he is a UFA they will have similar problems as we have now.

If Matthews and Marner would play with anyone and be happy and also improve those players while putting up points we would probably be in good shape...

Robertson-Matthews-Kerfoot
Jarnkrok-Tavares-Nylander
Bunting-Holmberg-Marner
Engvall-Kampf-Simmonds

In theory you make sense. In reality these 4 have not been able to get it done in pairs, doubt they can get it done flanked by scrubs. Plus, 16 and 34 want to play together and they have chemistry that the coach does not want to split up.

 

[Anthrax442]

He shit the bed again. For "best RW in the game" he surer don't look like he is all there mentally. Maybe they play him too much, I dunno.

 

[blue stick]

He shit the bed again. For "best RW in the game" he surer don't look like he is all there mentally. Maybe they play him too much, I dunno.

Your bad takes are laughable

 

[Anthrax442]

Your bad takes are laughable

Thank you. I work hard on them

 

[Stephen]

Some good and some bad vs Vegas. Scored a goal and the third period and OT was pure chaos.

 

[MilkofthePoppy]

Marner doesn't understand how to play a simple game. Sometimes I get the feeling he is out there trying to create Youtube highlights rather than play to win the game. The dude has a tantalizing skillset, but he is an egomaniac that hates constructive criticism. He will probably realize this when he gets closer to retirement and has some time for introspection.

I am rooting for the guy to put it all together...

 

[The Andrew Peeke Fan]

This kid is so annoying. Take the mic away from his face, already.

 

[JL17]

Listening to Spittin Chicklets and Derek Lalonde Wings new head coach and old asst in Tampa. He said from the beat down by Columbus to the next year they eliminated risk with the puck and got rid of the globetrotter style of play. There’s always going to be risk but make smart decisions with the puck. Marner is a prime example for this along with the Leafs and why they continue to not succeed.