Tribute Marner Appreciation Thread

[Stephen]

I think you are undervalueing Rantanen as many undervalue Marner.

Rantanen has been pretty spectacular for the Avs with all the injuries this year scoring 25% of all their goals.

5v5 they have been ob the ice for about the same amount of goals against with the Leafs having the better goaltending and Rantanen has been on the ice for quite a few more goals for.

I am taking Marner if I had to choose but it's closer than a lot will admit

Rantanen's a different flavour from Marner, and both have been in the league long enough for me to confidently say that there will be some years and some situations where one is preferable to the other and vice versa.

A Matthews-Rantanen cycle game would be an f'ing terror to defend against. Take a haircut on the artistry but they'd wear down the opposition defense.

Anyway, Marner's snipe on Colorado last night was pretty great to see.

 

[Gabriel426]

Rantanen's a different flavour from Marner, and both have been in the league long enough for me to confidently say that there will be some years and some situations where one is preferable to the other and vice versa.

A Matthews-Rantanen cycle game would be an f'ing terror to defend against. Take a haircut on the artistry but they'd wear down the opposition defense.

Anyway, Marner's snipe on Colorado last night was pretty great to see.

Agree with you. Both are great players but plays different game.
Rantanen might be a better fit with JT than MM due to their style.
MM will be better playing with Ovie than Rantanen.
Don’t think MM will be good playing with Mack bc both of them needs to hold onto the puck to be at their max.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

3 more points to #500.

 

[Antropovsky]

Leafs were on pace for playoffs when Marner was a 61 point winger. Tt will likely not make it with 100pts. Coincidence?

What are you saying in this post? I'd like to respond but I'm not sure what your saying.

 

[Antropovsky]

Such a bs post from you. JT had a career year with Marner, scored 12 more even strength goals that season, which is an astounding one off given how long he’d played. As for Matthews, imagine arguing Hull carried Oates(obviously different aside), that type of intellectually lazy soft bash is useless. Be better.

I can’t wait until this guy retires and Leafs fans finally get it. You aren’t seeing this again folks, enjoy it!

What do advanced stats say? When I looked, it appeared Marner benefitted more from Tavares/Matthews than the other way around. Why doesn't anyone want to discuss advanced stats? Let's go!

 

[DarkKnight]

What an amazing sequence.

 

[Zybalto]

What do advanced stats say? When I looked, it appeared Marner benefitted more from Tavares/Matthews than the other way around. Why doesn't anyone want to discuss advanced stats? Let's go!

Regular season 5v5 Since start of 2000 (with goal differential as well):

Matthews/Marner together:
CF%: 58.59
SF%: 58.06
SCF%: 63.46
HDCF%: 63.86
xGF%: 63.64
Goal differential: 64.19

Matthews without Marner:
CF%: 55.04
SF%: 56.11
SCF%: 58.49
HDCF%: 63.55
xGF%: 59.60
Goal differential: 59.94

Last 3 playoffs:

Matthews/Marner together:
CF%: 56.38
SF%: 58.03
SCF%: 56.95
HDCF%: 68.03
xGF%: 64.70
Goal differential: 63.71

Matthews without Marner:
CF%: 47.68
SF%: 50.31
SCF%: 45.14
HDCF%: 39.25
xGF%: 47.61
Goal differential: 0.00 (in almost 70 minutes played)

You always seem to be looking in the wrong places?

"Im right.com" is never a good source though.....


Tavares/Nylander have similar numbers as well (in favor of those two together in both advanced stats and results over the last few seasons).

Marner looks to be a strong candidate to win his third straight RW of the year award and is certainly one of the few big money players worth his salary.

 

[Antropovsky]

Regular season 5v5 Since start of 2000 (with goal differential as well):

Matthews/Marner together:
CF%: 58.59
SF%: 58.06
SCF%: 63.46
HDCF%: 63.86
xGF%: 63.64
Goal differential: 64.19

Matthews without Marner:
CF%: 55.04
SF%: 56.11
SCF%: 58.49
HDCF%: 63.55
xGF%: 59.60
Goal differential: 59.94

Last 3 playoffs:

Matthews/Marner together:
CF%: 56.38
SF%: 58.03
SCF%: 56.95
HDCF%: 68.03
xGF%: 64.70
Goal differential: 63.71

Matthews without Marner:
CF%: 47.68
SF%: 50.31
SCF%: 45.14
HDCF%: 39.25
xGF%: 47.61
Goal differential: 0.00 (in almost 70 minutes played)

You always seem to be looking in the wrong places?

"Im right.com" is never a good source though.....


Tavares/Nylander have similar numbers as well (in favor of those two together in both advanced stats and results over the last few seasons).

Marner looks to be a strong candidate to win his third straight RW of the year award and is certainly one of the few big money players worth his salary.

You didn't read my post very well. I said Marner seems to benefit from playing with these guys more than the other way around. Where's Marner without Matthews?

 

[DarkKnight]

Regular season 5v5 Since start of 2000 (with goal differential as well):

Matthews/Marner together:
CF%: 58.59
SF%: 58.06
SCF%: 63.46
HDCF%: 63.86
xGF%: 63.64
Goal differential: 64.19

Matthews without Marner:
CF%: 55.04
SF%: 56.11
SCF%: 58.49
HDCF%: 63.55
xGF%: 59.60
Goal differential: 59.94

Last 3 playoffs:

Matthews/Marner together:
CF%: 56.38
SF%: 58.03
SCF%: 56.95
HDCF%: 68.03
xGF%: 64.70
Goal differential: 63.71

Matthews without Marner:
CF%: 47.68
SF%: 50.31
SCF%: 45.14
HDCF%: 39.25
xGF%: 47.61
Goal differential: 0.00 (in almost 70 minutes played)

You always seem to be looking in the wrong places?

"Im right.com" is never a good source though.....


Tavares/Nylander have similar numbers as well (in favor of those two together in both advanced stats and results over the last few seasons).

Marner looks to be a strong candidate to win his third straight RW of the year award and is certainly one of the few big money players worth his salary.

 

[Gary Nylund]

You didn't read my post very well. I said Marner seems to benefit from playing with these guys more than the other way around. Where's Marner without Matthews?

I'm also wondering about how meaningful there numbers for the last 3 playoffs are. I mean sample size is important and how much how those guys even played apart over the last 3 playoffs? And of course you're right, "the other way around" is completely missing here.

 

[DarkKnight]

JT plays ten years in the league, comes here and plays a season with Marner, has a career year and people want sample size “advanced stats”. Are even strength goals a good indicator of production, is that advanced evough? You might notice one year in particular is eye popping. Back to the boring ankle biter routine…zzzzzz.

 

[ULF_55]

I'm also wondering about how meaningful there numbers for the last 3 playoffs are. I mean sample size is important and how much how those guys even played apart over the last 3 playoffs? And of course you're right, "the other way around" is completely missing here.

I'd like to see the current lines continue into the playoffs.
I was surprised that Nylander has the most even strength points in the 39 playoff games they've had.
In the post season, the difference are the PP points Matthews and marner have.
With the new lines maybe the marner-Tavares combo can make a difference?

 

[Gary Nylund]

I'd like to see the current lines continue into the playoffs.
I was surprised that Nylander has the most even strength points in the 39 playoff games they've had.
In the post season, the difference are the PP points Matthews and marner have.
With the new lines maybe the marner-Tavares combo can make a difference?

I much prefer rolling the current lines to selling out future for some top 6 rental player for sure. We should be favorites to beat TB and we should be able to give give Boston a good fight as well. Beat TB, get some confidence and if the goalies play well, we can beat anyone.

 

[Zybalto]

I'm also wondering about how meaningful there numbers for the last 3 playoffs are. I mean sample size is important and how much how those guys even played apart over the last 3 playoffs? And of course you're right, "the other way around" is completely missing here.

Might have missed it but I listed the minutes played in the last eye popping Goal differential stat for Matthews.

 

[Zybalto]

You didn't read my post very well. I said Marner seems to benefit from playing with these guys more than the other way around. Where's Marner without Matthews?

The reason I listed only those two is to not bias the stats as Matthews plays very similar minutes with and away from Marner while Marner does not away from Matthews.

I think I see what you are getting at while talking about Marner away from both centers as he is occasionally used as a shutdown forward and has some overflow minutes from the PK that affect his 5v5 numbers as well. On the surface they don't look great at 33% xGF (which is why you want them brought up right) but these two numbers stick out:

Ozone starts this year away from Matthews and Tavares: 0
Goal differential: 68.70

Pretty much what you want from shutdown minutes.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Might have missed it but I listed the minutes played in the last eye popping Goal differential stat for Matthews.

Right, I see it now. 70 minutes doesn't seem like enough to draw any conclusions from, I'd be surprised if you thought otherwise.

 

[Zur En Arrh]

Marner>>drai ainec!!!

 

[ULF_55]

Marner>>drai ainec!!!

Matthews so overrated!

 

[Antropovsky]

JT plays ten years in the league, comes here and plays a season with Marner, has a career year and people want sample size “advanced stats”. Are even strength goals a good indicator of production, is that advanced evough? You might notice one year in particular is eye popping. Back to the boring ankle biter routine…zzzzzz.

ATTACH=full]629312[/ATTACH]

Marner pre tavares 69 points in 82
Tavares pre Marner 84 points in 82
Matthews 62 games 63 points (same year)

Marner with Tavares 94
Tavares with Marner 88 (a total increase of 4 points)

Who elevated who?

Also list the best players Tavares played with during his time as an Islander (Okposo, Moulson). Now imagine his stats had he played with a player like Draisaitl or Matthews.

We are still waiting to see Marner without an elite linemate. We already know Tavares and Matthews are ppg players with lesser linemates.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I'd like to see the current lines continue into the playoffs.
I was surprised that Nylander has the most even strength points in the 39 playoff games they've had.
In the post season, the difference are the PP points Matthews and marner have.
With the new lines maybe the marner-Tavares combo can make a difference?

Really? Over the last 3± seasons he's second in both goals and ES goals, despite appreciably less ice time, and playing with Tavares.

There are only 12 players in the league with more goals over that span and only (not necessarily the same) 12 with more ES goals, and I think they're all first line players.

 

[Antropovsky]

6 points -6 in 8 games since ending his streak. He and Tavares done seem to have a lot of chemistry.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Marner pre tavares 69 points in 82
Tavares pre Marner 84 points in 82
Matthews 62 games 63 points (same year)

Marner with Tavares 94
Tavares with Marner 88 (a total increase of 4 points)

Who elevated who?

Also list the best players Tavares played with during his time as an Islander (Okposo, Moulson). Now imagine his stats had he played with a player like Draisaitl or Matthews.

We are still waiting to see Marner without an elite linemate. We already know Tavares and Matthews are ppg players with lesser linemates.

So Marner didn't factor into Tavares best goal scoring season of 47 goals in the 2018-19 Season, which was 9 more than the 38 goals he got with the Islanders in the 2014-15 Season.

I also realize this was not in the NHL but in Marner's last year playing in the OHL with London, he was the OHL MVP. OHL Playoffs MVP, Memorial Cup MVP, and CHL Player of the Year.

Finally he was the best player on that line with Matthew Tkachuk and Christian Dvorak.

​

 

[Yall are crazy]

Agree with you. Both are great players but plays different game.
Rantanen might be a better fit with JT than MM due to their style.
MM will be better playing with Ovie than Rantanen.
Don’t think MM will be good playing with Mack bc both of them needs to hold onto the puck to be at their max.

He's played with Mackinnon plenty of times and they were good together. He's a playmaker. Mack is a shooter.

 

[Antropovsky]

So Marner didn't factor into Tavares best goal scoring season of 47 goals in the 2018-19 Season, which was 9 more than the 38 goals he got with the Islanders in the 2014-15 Season.

I also realize this was not in the NHL but in Marner's last year playing in the OHL with London, he was the OHL MVP. OHL Playoffs MVP, Memorial Cup MVP, and CHL Player of the Year.

Finally he was the best player on that line with Matthew Tkachuk and Christian Dvorak.

​

Tavares had 36 points more than the next Islander in 2015. So your saying a 9 goal and 4 point increase is a reasonable increase when Tavares goes from low level linemates to a 11 million dollar linemate? And again lets not ignore that Matthews meant that Tavares wouldn't always be getting the opposing teams best defensive players.

Do his 5 points over a ppg and a plus minus of 0 blow peoples socks off halfway through the season? He's currently sitting at #27 in p/go and 7th highest paid player in the league.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Tavares had 36 points more than the next Islander in 2015. So your saying a 9 goal and 4 point increase is a reasonable increase when Tavares goes from low level linemates to a 11 million dollar linemate? And again lets not ignore that Matthews meant that Tavares wouldn't always be getting the opposing teams best defensive players.

Do his 5 points over a ppg and a plus minus of 0 blow peoples socks off halfway through the season? He's currently sitting at #27 in p/go and 7th highest paid player in the league.

I specifically used Tavares 47 goals in 2018-19 with the Leafs because that was 9 more than his previous high of 38 with the Islanders.

Going from a season best 84 points to 88 points that same season isn't that big of a number to use in my example.

So you can't say Marner didn't have any impact with Tavares in his first season with Toronto.