Player Discussion: Mark S Discussion

[LowLefty]

He doesn't play against the best he plays on their second pairing. McAvoy plays their hard matchups and Carlo spent no time with him this season.

Carlo's results aren't any better defensively leading up to this year then guys like Dillion and DeMelo. He would have looked just as lost in our awful scheme. Imo we have more then enough defense only dmen in DeMelo, Dillion and Samberg. What we need is a true two way big dmen to pair with JoMo and then you can run a bottom 4 with one skilled and one suppression guy on each pairing.

He has played top pairing - wasn't sure about LY
A few injuries had him in and out of that spot.
He is better than the guys you mention IMO - but then again, I've always favored D men that can play D.
A big right shot guy that would make even Smitty look good out there.
Ville is another that would benefit from playing with this guy - if he ever gets into the line up.
He's the type of player that should not be measured by his point production -

It would be nice if we could actually look at a Dman and weigh him on his defensive game and realize what an impact that might have in our end of the ice.

We all want the big, 2 way dman - but that's not what was being discussed as a potential add - so I'm working with what is being discussed. I'd take him in a minute if the price was right and I'd lose any of samberg, Dillon, or Demelo to do it.

 

[surixon]

He has played top pairing - wasn't sure about LY
A few injuries had him in and out of that spot.
He is better than the guys you mention IMO - but then again, I've always favored D men that can play D.
A big right shot guy that would make even Smitty look good out there.
Ville is another that would benefit from playing with this guy - if he ever gets into the line up.
He's the type of player that should not be measured by his point production -

It would be nice if we could actually look at a Dman and weigh him on his defensive game and realize what an impact that might have in our end of the ice.

We all want the big, 2 way dman - but that's not what was being discussed as a potential add - so I'm working with what is being discussed. I'd take him in a minute if the price was right and I'd lose any of samberg, Dillon, or Demelo to do it.

My issue with our dcore, well our team as whole actually is that it is full of one dimensional players.

On defense we have one player in Morrissey who is excellent all around but after him everyone is one is kne dimensional. We have our offensive first guys that can't defend in Pionk, Schmidt and Stanley. We have our defensive first guys in DeMelo, Dillion and Samberg that can't score.

In a vacuume I would agree with your assessment and bring him in but he would just be another one dimensional player on a team if them. If we are dealing Mark we need another dmen back that impacts the game positively in more then one dimension.

Now maybe coaching will fix some of the defensive issues with the team but if I'm looking at bringing dmen in its to bring in more balanced players and move out one dimensional ones.

 

[LowLefty]

My issue with our dcore, well our team as whole actually is that it is full of one dimensional players.

On defense we have one player in Morrissey who is excellent all around but after him everyone is one is kne dimensional. We have our offensive first guys that can't defend in Pionk, Schmidt and Stanley. We have our defensive first guys in DeMelo, Dillion and Samberg that can't score.

In a vacuume I would agree with your assessment and bring him in but he would just be another one dimensional player on a team if them. If we are dealing Mark we need another dmen back that impacts the game positively in more then one dimension.

Now maybe coaching will fix some of the defensive issues with the team but if I'm looking at bringing dmen in its to bring in more balanced players and move out one dimensional ones.

He plays better defense over anything we have - I don't get how you want to size him up as just another defensive dman (as if they are all created equal).
That makes no sense IMO -

I also don't consider defensive dmen as one dimensional -
Although I suppose you could measure a player in that manner - you could also measure KC that way - very one dimensional player. Does that mean he is just another one dimensional player?

We're a bit off topic here so I'll leave it at that
I get where you are going with your opinion - not saying or arguing you are wrong - I just don't agree with you.

 

[voyageur]

I'd want the 7th and Batherson from Ottawa. Gives us a big top 6 RW to take Blake's spot and gives us a marquee pick to get a Nemec, Savoie, Jirachek pick.



Adam flat out said it was awkward having his dad as the coach. It wasn't a good thing for him.

Wishful thinking. I am not even sure the Sens would want to trade Batherson for Scheifele straight up. I mean he's a rising star, put up 44 points in 46 games.

 

[DRW204]

Wishful thinking. I am not even sure the Sens would want to trade Batherson for Scheifele straight up. I mean he's a rising star, put up 44 points in 46 games.

OTT probably still has PTSD from the Duchene trade. i doubt they'll be offering anything close to batherson+7th OA for scheifele.

 

[jamiebez]

Wishful thinking. I am not even sure the Sens would want to trade Batherson for Scheifele straight up. I mean he's a rising star, put up 44 points in 46 games.

OTT probably still has PTSD from the Duchene trade. i doubt they'll be offering anything close to batherson+7th OA for scheifele.

Just to echo this with the perspective from here in Ottawa: they are 100% going with Norris and Stutzle as their #1 / #2 centers for the next 5-10 years (basically however long they can get Norris to sign for this summer).

Their focus is getting a top winger to play with either Tkachuk/Norris or Stuzle/Batherson, with Giroux and Fiala being the names kicked around most. Then, a right-shot D to pair with either Chabot or Jake Sanderson.

IMO, their goaltending still sinks them, but that's a topic for another board

They might be a landing spot if we need to dump Schmidt, but I'm sure they are on his no-move list. Not really seeing a trade fit, especially for Scheifele.

 

[DRW204]

Just to echo this with the perspective from here in Ottawa: they are 100% going with Norris and Stutzle as their #1 / #2 centers for the next 5-10 years (basically however long they can get Norris to sign for this summer).

Their focus is getting a top winger to play with either Tkachuk/Norris or Stuzle/Batherson, with Giroux and Fiala being the names kicked around most. Then, a right-shot D to pair with either Chabot or Jake Sanderson.

IMO, their goaltending still sinks them, but that's a topic for another board

They might be a landing spot if we need to dump Schmidt, but I'm sure they are on his no-move list. Not really seeing a trade fit, especially for Scheifele.

Yeah imo scheifele as a 29 year old soon-to-be ufa doesn't fit your teams time line. And I highly doubt he moves for a package close to the 7th overall+batherson (from any team). Would love to be wrong, but top 5-10 picks seldom get moved.
But just given Ottawa, say you move that for Scheifele, still don't make the PO's for the two years, he bolts and you're left holding the bag

Speaking of team and timelines.... Thinking the caps if backstrom is forced to retire due to hip injuries. they might up the desperation to get another long PO run. Down the middle with kuznetsov, scheifele, Eller /McMichael.

 

[robertocarlos]

Why trade him somewhere he would be happy? He could golf year round in Arizona. No, I want to see him traded to Montreal.

Montreal with money? I'd be happier than a pig in shit.

 

[GumbyCan2]

how long does it take to fix a broken room? is it reasonable for new coach/trotz to fix it within in a few months?

look at the wild for instance and what's come out about ryan suter recently and how they turned around. is it 1, albeit painful, transaction to fix?

we've been apparently broken for a few years now, i am going to assume chevy or maurice and co. have done things to help mend it (i hope so at least, if not then some1 should have been putting the heat on them).

i think you give scheifele the opportunity under a new regime..... if he still doesn't care about 2/3's of the ice & is still a locker-room problem, then trade him at the 2023 TDL when teams have more cap flexibility.

I suppose a new coach presumably could fix locker-room turmoil, but depends on how intwined and under lying the "cancer" is. Sometimes a roster tweak in the right position and need, along with new voice and coaching play-style demands must go hand-in-hand , or it is all for not! Players must show acceptance to new direction and buy-in to playing for , with each other under the new purpose, style and direction.

 

[GumbyCan2]

Montreal with money? I'd be happier than a pig in shit.

Who the heck do Jets get back of value?? Next 4 years 1st round picks and pray? They are not giving Suzuki up for Scheifele without the inclusion of say, Hellebuyck for Price, Morrissey for Romanov, Ehlers for Gallagher, and still have add our 1st this year. Not a good return partner. Love to see Scheif's tearing it up in a Les Canadiens (jersey! ( even tho' my tongue is permanently protruding my cheek passed my ear!).,

 

[GumbyCan2]

OTT probably still has PTSD from the Duchene trade. i doubt they'll be offering anything close to batherson+7th OA for scheifele.

Unless Jets give Helleboy for Gustafsson and KO for Formenton, too.
You might get Batherson, or Norris back and a 4th round pick for Scheifele. They are eying their future still, not win now at all costs and give up our potential higher-proving future, sadly.

 

[buggs]

Montreal with money? I'd be happier than a pig in shit.

Do you really think Scheifele would go to Montreal after what happened with his family last year?

 

[Cnile]

Do you really think Scheifele would go to Montreal after what happened with his family last year?

Absolutely
They aren’t violent, they are passionate

 

[ps241]

He plays better defense over anything we have - I don't get how you want to size him up as just another defensive dman (as if they are all created equal).
That makes no sense IMO -

I also don't consider defensive dmen as one dimensional -
Although I suppose you could measure a player in that manner - you could also measure KC that way - very one dimensional player. Does that mean he is just another one dimensional player?

We're a bit off topic here so I'll leave it at that
I get where you are going with your opinion - not saying or arguing you are wrong - I just don't agree with you.

Carlo is big but he’s not physical as I recall. How much better is he than DeMelo? I haven’t watched Carlo that closely but $4.1 isn’t cheap for a defensive D man. What about his game do you like?

I know one size doesn’t fit all with D first D men but I use DeMelo as a comp because he is pretty good at defending and tends to be a good partner for anyone he plays with.

 

[LowLefty]

Carlo is big but he’s not physical as I recall. How much better is he than DeMelo? I haven’t watched Carlo that closely but $4.1 isn’t cheap for a defensive D man. What about his game do you like?

I know one size doesn’t fit all with D first D men but I use DeMelo as a comp because he is pretty good at defending and tends to be a good partner for anyone he plays with.

He's not as physical as you might expect a 6'5" dman might be but he is physical - he takes the body and is very hard to play against when he is on you. No thunder hits but he'll stop you in your tracks and puck carriers are wary of him.
He gets over shadowed by McAvoy who brings it all at a top level - those guys are few and far between.
I like his skating, defensive awareness, and his ability to take control in his own zone - The Bruins rely on him for that shut down role and the PK. His offense is not his priority but he has a big shot and if we wasn't play the right side below McAvoy, the Bruins might have raised him with more offense in mind.

He's had injury issues and they have come at the worst times. Concussions are the concern and some might say he is playing with less of an edge after the Tom Wilson hit - that's the risk that might be associated with this player.
I can see him and Demelo having similar defensive awareness - but I see Carlo having a significant edge with his shut down ability all over the ice and especially the Dzone. Add to that, he is a much better skater, shooter, and brings size along with his abilities.

 

[ello]

Jarvis put up a 1.7 ppg in his draft year. Lysell didn't manage 1.2. There is a bit of a difference between the two, no?



You need Carlo with some offense. He's no different then what we currently have in big and gritty defensive dmen.

Yet Jarvis regressed back to about a ppg in his draft plus one and Lysell had a monster playoffs this year? Writing off a prospect for size (and a winger no less who's 5'10, not 5'6) is weirdly short sighted

 

[Teemusalami204]

Yet Jarvis regressed back to about a ppg in his draft plus one and Lysell had a monster playoffs this year? Writing off a prospect for size (and a winger no less who's 5'10, not 5'6) is weirdly short sighted

I would tend to agree with this

But the jets are soft already. For our particular team build a small soft forward doesn’t fit what we need

 

[tbcwpg]

I would tend to agree with this

But the jets are soft already. For our particular team build a small soft forward doesn’t fit what we need

I'd rather have a smaller player who can score than a big oaf who can hit but not do anything else.

 

[Teemusalami204]

I'd rather have a smaller player who can score than a big oaf who can hit but not do anything else.

I would rather have a big player that can play defensively. Then a small player who can score for the jets ..

 

[tbcwpg]

I would rather have a big player that can play defensively. Then a small player who can score for the jets ..

Put in a coach like Trotz, Julien or even Muller and I think the defensive numbers improve dramatically. I don't think the Jets issue with defending is that the players don't know what they're doing, but that they're being told to do the wrong thing coupled with no real consequences to not playing defence in the first place.

 

[DRW204]

Unless Jets give Helleboy for Gustafsson and KO for Formenton, too.
You might get Batherson, or Norris back and a 4th round pick for Scheifele. They are eying their future still, not win now at all costs and give up our potential higher-proving future, sadly.

Doubt the Jets trade Helle right now. as long as he's on this team the Jets will try to be competitive instead of a rebuild. goaltending is so key and after seeing this org trot out pavelec (and give him a 20m contract) & hutch they probably want to keep helle as long as possible to avoid going back to those days.

 

[GaryPoppins]

Put in a coach like Trotz, Julien or even Muller and I think the defensive numbers improve dramatically. I don't think the Jets issue with defending is that the players don't know what they're doing, but that they're being told to do the wrong thing coupled with no real consequences to not playing defence in the first place.

Murat Ates in an article said he had “yet to observe defensive miscues in practice be addressed or at least beyond his eyes of observation” so I think any coach coming in tbh should see us at minimum get to a middle of the pack D team. That in itself should spell playoffs.

 

[DRW204]

Murat Ates in an article said he had “yet to observe defensive miscues in practice be addressed or at least beyond his eyes of observation” so I think any coach coming in tbh should see us at minimum get to a middle of the pack D team. That in itself should spell playoffs.

I know Murat is watching from afar. But OOF, if true lol.

 

[cbcwpg]

Winnipeg Jets general manager Kevin Cheveldayoff said Tuesday he expects Mark Scheifele to remain with the team this off-season, after rumours previously swirled after the forward's future.

"Yeah, I do," Cheveldayoff told NHL.com. "My exit interview with Mark went well. Again, it was an emotional time for everybody. We asked [our players] to wear their emotions in the exits, and I think they were very productive."

Scheifele expected back with Jets next season, GM says | NHL.com

Cheveldayoff optimistic after meeting with center, who has two years remaining on contract

www.nhl.com

 

[surixon]

Winnipeg Jets general manager Kevin Cheveldayoff said Tuesday he expects Mark Scheifele to remain with the team this off-season, after rumours previously swirled after the forward's future.

"Yeah, I do," Cheveldayoff told NHL.com. "My exit interview with Mark went well. Again, it was an emotional time for everybody. We asked [our players] to wear their emotions in the exits, and I think they were very productive."

Would have loved to be a fly on the way for those interviews.