The Habs won when Price was in Vezina form and lost when he was mediocre. Meanwhile the year before it was the mediocre Condon show. I'm not sure what narrative you are trying to create since clearly Weber doesn't make a difference if the goaltending isn't Vezina level.
Marc Bergevin Thread -- How you Drouin?
- Thread starter M.C.G. 31
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The Habs won when Price was in Vezina form and lost when he was mediocre. Meanwhile the year before it was the mediocre Condon show. I'm not sure what narrative you are trying to create since clearly Weber doesn't make a difference if the goaltending isn't Vezina level.
DAChampion
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So far this summer for Bergevin,
Good:
Sergachev for Drouin
Beaulieu + 5th for Schlemko + 3rd
Make Emelin available to Vegas
Discard Dwight King, Nikita Nesterov, and Brian Flynn
Potentially bad, but uncertain at this time:
Lose Markov to UFA
Lose Radulov, to UFA
Keep Lefebvre
Hopefully this does end up being a good summer rather than a bad one.
Good:
Sergachev for Drouin
Beaulieu + 5th for Schlemko + 3rd
Make Emelin available to Vegas
Discard Dwight King, Nikita Nesterov, and Brian Flynn
Potentially bad, but uncertain at this time:
Lose Markov to UFA
Lose Radulov, to UFA
Keep Lefebvre
Hopefully this does end up being a good summer rather than a bad one.
- Jun 24, 2012
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Those are two distinct trades.
Bergevin gets no credit for McPhee's dumb moves. How about not doling out the bloated contract to Emelin, to begin with.
Are you sure Flynn is completely out of the picture? All these moves are self inflicted. So now he gets credit for the captain obvious decision of not making them worse?
Bad move if Radulov is lost, no question. Would negatively impact on the offensive gains made with the Drouin acquisition.
Markov at the right price on a one year deal otherwise, time to move on.
In what world is keeping Lefebvre only "potentially" bad?
TheGoalJudge
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His biggest mistake is the development of prospects. Lefebvre is not getting it done plain and simple. There are no results. Bergevin is patient with prospects and none that he has dealt have turned into anything. He keeps flexibility and he is betting on internal growth, but there is just none.
Bergevin is getting no help from internal growth outside of Lehkonen. Bergevin couldn't even bank on Galchenyuk becoming a top 6 C. I'm actually loving the fact that he dealt Sergachev for Drouin because we can skip that development phase.
Imagine being Bergevin and you are sitting there saying, "Well I have Galchenyuk to fill top 6. I have Tinordi who at his worst is a #6 right? Beaulieu should be a #4. Then I have Scherbak, McCarron, Hudon, JDLR, etc. Wow we got a chance here." Nothing pans out.
I gotta go get Danault, Drouin, bring Lehkonen over, claim Byron. These are all holes filled externally.
But ultimately it falls on Bergevin because he is allowing it to continue.
Bergevin is getting no help from internal growth outside of Lehkonen. Bergevin couldn't even bank on Galchenyuk becoming a top 6 C. I'm actually loving the fact that he dealt Sergachev for Drouin because we can skip that development phase.
Imagine being Bergevin and you are sitting there saying, "Well I have Galchenyuk to fill top 6. I have Tinordi who at his worst is a #6 right? Beaulieu should be a #4. Then I have Scherbak, McCarron, Hudon, JDLR, etc. Wow we got a chance here." Nothing pans out.
I gotta go get Danault, Drouin, bring Lehkonen over, claim Byron. These are all holes filled externally.
But ultimately it falls on Bergevin because he is allowing it to continue.
DAChampion
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In what world is keeping Lefebvre only "potentially" bad?
In the world where we don't yet have official confirmation that Lefebvre is staying.
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Unrealized potential can be cringeworthy. Lefebvre remains the guy until it's confirmed that he's not.
All I am saying is Price didn't carry this team like he did in 2015 when he won Hart/Vezna.
Weber did what he was advertised to do. 15+ goals 40 or more points. Eat minutes as a 1D. And guess what the team finished 1st in its division and top 8 in the league.
He finished 5th in Norris voting. Not sure how you lose a trade when you get a guy who is 5th for the Norris.
PK had a good season, but he didn't do what was advertised. HE was more a 1B in Nash and had 40 points not the 60+ some were saying he would get. Still a big piece of their team and their big 4. Nash got a good player and what they wanted but so did the habs.
and I think some would argue Radulov had a bigger impact then Weber for the habs. MB was the one who signed him, the best UFA last year. What else outside of PK trade did Polie do last year? I am asking seriously I don't remember them signing any big UFA or making any big trades. Maybe there was something? I think he got Weber and Irwin? His bottom pair D. I think he traded Vesey for a 3rd rounder?
No ones giving you a first line centre for Pacioretty. Defeats the purpose. At this point our centres are set. With teams low balling offers for Galchenyuk, it's just better to keep him around and pray his defense gets better. If not he better score 80-90 pts because he will be a defensive liability out there
If Bergevin fails to get a centre again I don't know how anyone can defend him. Six off-seasons
Galchenyuk and Drouin are horrible in their own end. That was Coopers biggest problem
With him. Both should not play centre
habergeon
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Uncle Gary
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The jury is no where near out on Beaulieu being a good move.
Until I see someone who can pass the puck and skate the puck out of trouble like Nathan did I'm not convinced...
Talk about a bum rap Nathan never got credit for anything he did well and was always pointed at when things went wrong his fault or no. How friggin' often did Petry have worse screw-ups and yet get a free pass? Oh yeah but we didn't have a Petry B party video to accentuate his fake poor play reports. Weber led the league in +/- up and until Beaulieu was moved off his pairing. The Habs best PP rating last season occurred when Beaulieu was paired with Weber and Markov was out. Total coincidence? Not by a long shot. Poor IQ I call BS Nathan put himself into very many advantageous positions all year long but had trouble finishing. My bet is we end up missing much of what Nathan brought to the table. This regime and their mouthpiece is the most hypocritical in memory.
WeThreeKings
Habs cup - its in the BAG
Doc McKenna
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Might as well trade all our draft picks now. At least we can get established players that need less development.
Doc McKenna
A new era 2021
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Yep because the narrative starts changing and the blame game is passed through the media.
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For those who read French, a stinging account from LaPresse's Martin Leclerc.
"The Decline of the Canadien Empire": http://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/1041468/hockey-lnh-martin-leclerc-le-declin-de-lempire-canadien
"The Decline of the Canadien Empire": http://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/1041468/hockey-lnh-martin-leclerc-le-declin-de-lempire-canadien
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1) Subban has put up 60pts once in his career, so not sure who said he'd get 60+ but you're probably taking the words of a tiny minority.
2) You are very well aware that PK was injured, which affected his play and also lowered his games played. In truth he produced at a 50pt pace.
3) Funny how you like to draw a link between Weber and the Habs finising atop the division, but you omit to mention the big success of Nashville.
4) I'll do it for you then, Nashville got Subban in hopes that it would improve their offense and make them a better puck carrying team, low and behold, they reach the cup finals for the first time in their franchise history.
This is a silly discussion. PK is a better player to have considering the type of game that dominates this sport. Weber still played well for us, but PK is just better. This is over and done with.
DAChampion
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Non Player Canadiens
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sheed36
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How can MB be absolutely fine with the drafting and development departments with numbers like this from the article?
Translated with Google translate:
This is a major problem that really needs to be addressed instead of ignored. It's comical at this point.
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It doesn't matter. The Biceps Brothers are part of a mutual admiration society as you saw at the pre-draft pressers Bergevin and Timmins.
Whitesnake
If you rebuild, they will come.
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How can MB be absolutely fine with the drafting and development departments with numbers like this from the article?
Translated with Google translate:
This is a major problem that really needs to be addressed instead of ignored. It's comical at this point.
I've been saying that for how many years now....as of now, aside from Lindgren, and we are talkingn here about a goalie's value, this Habs team has NO value in their prospect pool. None. That doesn't mean that Mete won't become great. Just saying..Mete right now, Bitten, Sherbak, holds NO value. Who else in the league has that? And this year, it's worst than ever.
But hey, the great Trevor Timmins, to show the journalists and trying to impress them, tells them that our prospect pool is healthy because 2 of our guys were invited in the Team Canada's Summer development camp.....wow. Straight from Jaffy and Co explanations. No wonder they love this organization. But still an awful example and shows exactly why we should be worried.
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