Marc Bergevin Thread -- How you Drouin?

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Why though?

ITs only RS so lets not count NASH playoff run as has been pointed out to me. We also can't count Habs being bounced from 1st round.

Habs won their division after finishing 9th worst last year. They also were 8th in the league overall.

MB went out and got Shaw/Weber/Rads/Al in the off season and all 3 played big roles on the team (Shaw and Al to a lesser extent). He then managed to also get CJ here a former cup winning coach.

Polie traded for PK who had one of his worst seasons in the last 5 years and his team was an 8th place wild card team. 94 pts vs 103 pts.

If we don't take the playoffs into account I don't see the genius of Polie on display this year. Weber was more of a difference maker for the habs than PK was for Nash.

Weber wasn't more of a difference maker. You're acting as if PK played 15-16 with Price in net. Actually, if you compare the first 20 games of 15-16 with the first 20 games of 16-17, it seems pretty much the same. For Nashville, it's the same too. Not much difference.

The voting for Poile was probably centered on the fact that he fleeced your beloved GM.

 

[Bryson]

I dislike the Beaulieu trade, unless he was Vegas's original target. They wanted a defenceman, and Beaulieu's faster, younger and more skilled than Emelin, not to mention on a much cheaper contract. Both are equally guilty of brainfarts. If Beau was McPhee's first choice then he'd gone for nothing and we'd still have Emelin and his $4.1M. Instead, we have a 3rd-round pick and enough freed up cap to get someone better than Emelin. Habs were going to lose someone; at least in this scenario we lose a little less and have enough cash to go shopping.

To be fair, I realize the above scenario is completely hypothetical. I still hate losing Beaulieu like this.

Protect Beaulieu, Expose Plekanec, Emelin and Shaw. Either way you guaranteed to get rid of a bad contract. EZ PZ.

Beaulieu could have easily been flipped at the TDL or until someone better was found. Having cap space is only a good thing if you actually do something useful with it, so far Bergevin has show to use extra cap space to overpay 4th liner players and grinders instead of elite talent. Let's hope Julien has a more positive influence on MB thought process than Therrien did.

 

[Habs Halifax]

MB did not deserve any votes you have to be kidding!!

Poile winning says it all.

What does it say really? I didn't hear Poile saying "thank god I traded Weber away for Subban" This is why I won the GM award. It was all about one player. The team without Subban was nothing.

What a joke! Poile didn't win the award because of one trade.

 

[Runner77]

Protect Beaulieu, Expose Plekanec, Emelin and Shaw. Either way you guaranteed to get rid of a bad contract. EZ PZ.

Beaulieu could have easily been flipped at the TDL or until someone better was found. Having cap space is only a good thing if you actually do something useful with it, so far Bergevin has show to use extra cap space to overpay 4th liner players and grinders instead of elite talent. Let's hope Julien has a more positive influence on MB thought process than Therrien did.

Protect the fan base, Expose Bergevin (for what he truly is ...).

Bergevin's mistake contract with Emelin was relieved by others. He's got to stop doling out money to bottom type players and to those types of players that used to have value in the old NHL. Just look at his TDL acquisitions from this year -- sounds like the type of moves a GM would have made 15 years ago. Maybe he learned his lesson with the Drouin acquisition, who knows.

 

[scrubadam]

Weber wasn't more of a difference maker. You're acting as if PK played 15-16 with Price in net. Actually, if you compare the first 20 games of 15-16 with the first 20 games of 16-17, it seems pretty much the same. For Nashville, it's the same too. Not much difference.

The voting for Poile was probably centered on the fact that he fleeced your beloved GM.

Weber was habs 1 D and helped the PP. PK did his thing for Nash but was injured for a bit and put up his lowest career totals since before the lock out. I would say they were equal in the effect they had with their teams, and it could be argued that due to injury Weber was slightly more valuable (again DUE TO INJURY).

But you are correct, Polie won the award because the media focused on the trade that benefited both teams rather than the entire body of work. I don't agree it was a fleecing at all (Regular season only remember).

But overall MB's team did better than Polies team. MB brought in Rads as well the coup of the summer and then snagged CJ a cup winning coach. And Price was crap for a good portion of the season, habs were a top 5 corsi team and top 8 goal differential team so I don't think we can use the old Price excuse this season.

 

[Lshap]

Protect Beaulieu, Expose Plekanec, Emelin and Shaw. Either way you guaranteed to get rid of a bad contract. EZ PZ.

Beaulieu could have easily been flipped at the TDL or until someone better was found. Having cap space is only a good thing if you actually do something useful with it, so far Bergevin has show to use extra cap space to overpay 4th liner players and grinders instead of elite talent. Let's hope Julien has a more positive influence on MB thought process than Therrien did.

Well yeah, obviously the assumption is that Emelin's cap space will be used to get someone good. Or keep someone good. Like I said, that's the one concrete advantage we've gained in all this. If the $4.1M is used to get a good dman, keep Radulov or re-sign Price, then it was money well-spent.

You're right -- they could've protected Beaulieu over Shaw, especially if Vegas was set on getting a D. Would've changed nothing, except we'd still have Beaulieu as an asset. Dumping him for loose change makes no sense on the surface, unless other GMs considered him untradeable.

 

[mariolemieux66]

Subban wasn't the reason he won GM of the year. Preds are a well build team through the draft. Subban is not their best D-man. He is one of a very strong top 4D that works together. That top 4D is deadly!

Habs got Weber. Yeah, he's not Subban, he's Weber. We need to get use to this and accept what Weber brings to the table. Weber in front of Price is a very good situation for the Habs and we can count on this for many years.

Subban makes a team much better than Weber does.

 

[417]

Subban makes a team much better than Weber does.

The Subban/Weber trade will end up being the most dissected trade in history.

And the end result will be a wash.

I'm convinced of it.

 

[jaffy27]

Weber wasn't more of a difference maker. You're acting as if PK played 15-16 with Price in net. Actually, if you compare the first 20 games of 15-16 with the first 20 games of 16-17, it seems pretty much the same. For Nashville, it's the same too. Not much difference.

The voting for Poile was probably centered on the fact that he fleeced your beloved GM.

Yet Weber finished 5th in Norris voting while PK got NO votes......you'll have to use another angle Amigo

 

[scrubadam]

Subban makes a team much better than Weber does.

103 pts vs 94 pts. REGULAR SEASON only.

And Price was not superstar Price this year regardless of his reputation nomination for the Vezna this year.

 

[76]

Subban makes a team much better than Weber does.

Subban will never be close of what all Shea Weber brings and will bring to the Montreal Canadiens.

 

[void]

What does it say really? I didn't hear Poile saying "thank god I traded Weber away for Subban" This is why I won the GM award. It was all about one player. The team without Subban was nothing.

What a joke! Poile didn't win the award because of one trade.

He kinda did. The Preds had barely squeaked into the playoffs when the votes were submitted. What reason other than the Subban trade could have caused the majority of voters to vote for Poile?

Yet Weber finished 5th in Norris voting while PK got NO votes......you'll have to use another angle Amigo

Subban missed 16 regular season games and when he finally came back it took him a while to get back to his regular play. That's why he didn't get any votes. YOU'LL have to use another angle, amigo.

103 pts vs 94 pts. REGULAR SEASON only.

And Price was not superstar Price this year regardless of his reputation nomination for the Vezna this year.

First round exit vs. Stanley cup finals.

That is all.

 

[scrubadam]

He kinda did. The Preds had barely squeaked into the playoffs when the votes were submitted. What reason other than the Subban trade could have caused the majority of voters to vote for Poile?

Did he make any other trades or signings ? Not that I remember.

And what about Shero? Did he sign or trade for anyone this year? I dont think so.

Dorion gets some noms what did he do? Sign GB okay thats good but MB signed CJ, and CJ>GB. Dorion also traded younger Z for older Brassard and both put up nearly identical numbers. So somehow getting older gets you votes for GM of the year in Ottawa but not in MTL? And Weber's pedigree compared to Brassard is 10 fold.

Essentially the media ran with the PK vs Weber story and gave Polie the award for that and punished MB even though in reality MB had one of the better off season and RS of any GM in the league last year.

 

[jaffy27]

He kinda did. The Preds had barely squeaked into the playoffs when the votes were submitted. What reason other than the Subban trade could have caused the majority of voters to vote for Poile?

Team success

Only in Montreal do his diciples think its because of him and him only......

 

[scrubadam]

Team success

Only in Montreal do his diciples think its because of him and him only......

But Nash had 94 points this year and finished as a wild card team.

Ottawa finished below the habs.

MB's TEAM had 103 points top 8 in the league but not 1 vote???

Not saying MB should of won but how do Dorion and Polie make the top and MB gets nothing when objectivly MB and his team were better than those 2?

And if someone says Price, while Shero got noms too and he has Crosby/Malkin that should disqualify him right there. And if I am not mistaken all Shero did was trade for Hainsey this year ??

 

[jaffy27]

He kinda did. The Preds had barely squeaked into the playoffs when the votes were submitted. What reason other than the Subban trade could have caused the majority of voters to vote for Poile?



Subban missed 16 regular season games and when he finally came back it took him a while to get back to his regular play. That's why he didn't get any votes. YOU'LL have to use another angle, amigo.



First round exit vs. Stanley cup finals.

That is all.

5th in Norris voting vs Zero.....this angle speaks for itself

 

[Perrah]

But Nash had 94 points this year and finished as a wild card team.

Ottawa finished below the habs.

MB's TEAM had 103 points top 8 in the league but not 1 vote???

Not saying MB should of won but how do Dorion and Polie make the top and MB gets nothing when objectivly MB and his team were better than those 2?

And if someone says Price, while Shero got noms too and he has Crosby/Malkin that should disqualify him right there. And if I am not mistaken all Shero did was trade for Hainsey this year ??

When did Crosby and Malkin get traded to the devils?

 

[void]

Did he make any other trades or signings ? Not that I remember.

And what about Shero? Did he sign or trade for anyone this year? I dont think so.

Dorion gets some noms what did he do? Sign GB okay thats good but MB signed CJ, and CJ>GB. Dorion also traded younger Z for older Brassard and both put up nearly identical numbers. So somehow getting older gets you votes for GM of the year in Ottawa but not in MTL? And Weber's pedigree compared to Brassard is 10 fold.

Essentially the media ran with the PK vs Weber story and gave Polie the award for that and punished MB even though in reality MB had one of the better off season and RS of any GM in the league last year.

The **** does Shero have to do with anything?

How can you compare Dorion hiring Boucher at the start of the season to Bergevin keeping a neanderthal like Therrien for more than half a season and firing him because the team was heading for another epic collapse? Like, what??

Also, your last argument is invalid because the GM of the year is voted for by: "40-member panel that includes all 30 general managers, five NHL executives and five media members".

 

[the valiant effort]

103 pts vs 94 pts. REGULAR SEASON only.

And Price was not superstar Price this year regardless of his reputation nomination for the Vezna this year.

He wasn't superstar Price but among goalies that started more than 60 games it was down to Bob, Holtby, Dubnyk or Price (Dubnyk/Price were basically dead even). Hardly a stolen nomination.

 

[void]

5th in Norris voting vs Zero.....this angle speaks for itself

Ok so I see that you're not actually interested in having a discussion. I don't even know why I bothered.

 

[G0bias]

Get Pacioretty some help...and his production in the playoff increases.

I don't buy that "playoff performer/warrior" argument personally.

Although there is something to Pacioretty's lack of intensity in the playoffs, he seems to have the same sense of urgency in game 1 of the season as he has in game 6 of an ECF. But again, I think if surrounded better, his production would increase.

Pacioretty is just miscast as a leading actor, he's a supporting actor.

Not really.
He had plenty of help during international tournaments. That didn't change much. Starting on top lines with the likes of Kane, Pavelski etc.. and finishing on the 3rd and 4th. He simply doesn't step up when there's more pressure, good linemates or no. Tortorella made that pretty clear last year.

 

[Peanut]

 

[scrubadam]

When did Crosby and Malkin get traded to the devils?

LOL ooops meant rutherford not shero

 

[417]

Not really.
He had plenty of help during international tournaments. That didn't change much. Starting on top lines with the likes of Kane, Pavelski etc.. and finishing on the 3rd and 4th. He simply doesn't step up when there's more pressure, good linemates or no. Tortorella made that pretty clear last year.

What does international tournaments have to do with Habs in the playoffs?

 

[jaffy27]

Ok so I see that you're not actually interested in having a discussion. I don't even know why I bothered.

What are you gonna discuss??

Your boy PK got no votes vs Weber who finished 5th in voting. Nobody is gonna convince me that Poile won his award on account of one individual player when that individual player got no votes for an individual trophy vs the guy that he traded finished 5th in voting for that same trophy.

Subban was certainly a big figure in Nashville's success this post season.....but so was Rinne, and Ellis, and Josi, and Forsberg, and Neal, and Scissons, and Eckholm, and Johansen......think you get the point here.