Management Discussion | Pre-Season Approaching

[SeawaterOnIce]

We haven't even had a chance to see Mikheyev play yet, how can we judge that move?

If they had signed Mikheyev and traded/released Boeser then it's a clear W on the basis of clearing some cap and adding a better 5v5 player. If we had a strongish D core and needed to hedge our bets on a top 6 forward, then no biggie as well.

Issue I see is we are pretty much capped out and took an unnnecessary risk signing this player. He needs to continue his strong play from last year; while playing on an inferior team.

 

[4Twenty]

I don’t believe “they are going for it”.

I believe they had a plan A that didn’t come to fruition due to a misreading of the market. Something they were not alone in doing btw. Teams and agents alike got caught.

I believe they recognized they were going to have to wait out some contracts or let things develop to a more favorable market position but stil desired to improve the depth of the team in some respect. That ended up being up front as there was very little blueline wise to pursue. I don’t see much that could have been done with the blueline at this point.

I don’t believe they are going all in simply because if they were then they would have been moving heaven and earth to get out from under those contracts. They didn’t and haven’t yet done that. They are balancing trying to make tangible improvements while also trying to restock organizational depth. The depth up front for the origination is improved. It will help despite the blueline still being a major concern.

The blueline through the organization is a sticking point for sure. It needs to be addressed. While I dislike the pick going out the window I do like that they (1) got out from one of the contacts. Perhaps the easiest one and (2) some blueline depth came back at the same time.

It’s not pretty. It’s not neat but I fail to see “going for it at this time”. I see they have taken the opportunity to build some depth up front which maybe can be used moving forward to rebalance the team. But there is no selling the future to go for it. Far from it, they’ve been pretty diligent thus far trying to get things in place to improve the farm system and stocking of the farm system.

Thanks for the response.

“Going forward with this group” is probably what my post should’ve said because the semantic discussion over “going for it” has dominated your response.

I believe what they’ve done says they’re “going forward with this group” and given that, I think aggression is better than the “diligence” you’re attributing to them.

I agree about the Dickinson dump for Stillman move. I also hope it’s stitched together with a larger move from the excess spent at wing.

 

[Vector]

Given the way things have gone but I’m wondering if there might be a move in place for after rosters have been submitted and teams have locked in their cap and LTIR numbers.

Not necessarily from the Canucks as this group has been, in my opinion, far too passive but from other organizations.

 

[Hit the post]

Given the way things have gone but I’m wondering if there might be a move in place for after rosters have been submitted and teams have locked in their cap and LTIR numbers.

Not necessarily from the Canucks as this group has been, in my opinion, far too passive but from other organizations.

Putting Vector on waivers isn't going to clear any cap space.

 

[MS]

On the cap situation and clearing cap/moving picks:

If you took a look at the roster 9-10 months ago and the contracts everyone here would have loved to dump, if you'd told anyone that we'd essentially net $5.6 million in cap space by moving out Hamonic and Dickinson and we'd only have to give up the difference between a 2nd and 3rd round pick, literally everyone here would have jumped at that.

They aren't moving quickly on this but they are moving fairly efficiently, asset-wise.

 

[strattonius]

I'm so over the 'they've shown they're going for it' comments.

So because they didn't let Miller go for highway robbery they've somehow said 'we're all in!!!'? It's such a gap in logic. They didn't want to bleed an enormous asset. Not that I love the Miller contract but over the next couple years with the projected rise in the CAP, Miller will be an okay price in the twilight of his career.

Also there's comments that Mikheyev is over-priced. I strongly disagree. A strong middle 6 utility forward. He may be on the steep end this year with a flat CAP but we get his prime years. And again, the CAP in 2 years going up 4.75 isn't a lot for a role player.

 

[4Twenty]

On the cap situation and clearing cap/moving picks:

If you took a look at the roster 9-10 months ago and the contracts everyone here would have loved to dump, if you'd told anyone that we'd essentially net $5.6 million in cap space by moving out Hamonic and Dickinson and we'd only have to give up the difference between a 2nd and 3rd round pick, literally everyone here would have jumped at that.

They aren't moving quickly on this but they are moving fairly efficiently, asset-wise.

You think that’s a fair representation of the transactions?

So Dermott and Stillman don’t count?

I think it should be looked at as half the number you’re pushing. And $2.6-8m or whatever it is, is not a great deal less space than if both were waived.


Look I like the idea on what they did with Dickinson. I’m glad he’s gone. I thinks it’s cheaper than Nemeth but I don’t think it’s as valuable as is being portrayed.

I’m glad the two year salary is gone. But I have a hard time separating Dermott and Stillman from these transactions.


Both were brought in with multi year contracts in essentially the same transactions or the same transaction.

 

[MS]

You think that’s a fair representation of the transactions?

So Dermott and Stillman don’t count?

I think it should be looked at as half the number you’re pushing. And $2.6-8m or whatever it is, is not a great deal less space than if both were waived.


Look I like the idea on what they did with Dickinson. I’m glad he’s gone. I thinks it’s cheaper than Nemeth but I don’t think it’s as valuable as is being portrayed.

I’m glad the two year salary is gone. But I have a hard time separating Dermott and Stillman from these transactions.


Both were brought in with multi year contracts in essentially the same transactions or the same transaction.

Dermott is a totally separate type of transaction. And again, every team makes transactions like that. I think Stillman is a roughly zero-value asset.

I'm looking specifically at the bad contracts we inherited and the net cost to move them out and the net cap savings we've generated with those transactions.

 

[andora]

Dermott is a totally separate type of transaction. And again, every team makes transactions like that. I think Stillman is a roughly zero-value asset.

I'm looking specifically at the bad contracts we inherited and the net cost to move them out and the net cap savings we've generated with those transactions.

it helped out for off season that's for sure, with dickinson gone (not factoring in ELC bonus situation)

	2023/24		LW		C		RW
open slots	5		X		Pettersson		Boeser
cap space	12,518,750.00		Mikheyev		Miller		Garland
$/player w xtra	2,503,750.00		Pearson		X		Podkolzin
$/player w/o xtra	6,259,375.00		Joshua		Aman		Lazar
full roster	5		EXTRA	X	X
min roster	2		DEFENSIVE PAIRINGS				G
Notable to Sign			Hughes		Myers		Demko
Kuzmenko	Dermott		Ekman-Larsson		Poolman		Martin
Hoglander	Horvat		Rathbone		Stillman
						EXTRA	X

 

[tantalum]

Thanks for the response.

“Going forward with this group” is probably what my post should’ve said because the semantic discussion over “going for it” has dominated your response.

I believe what they’ve done says they’re “going forward with this group” and given that, I think aggression is better than the “diligence” you’re attributing to them.

I agree about the Dickinson dump for Stillman move. I also hope it’s stitched together with a larger move from the excess spent at wing.

I think they ended up going forward with this group as they made the determination that this course of action was the most prudent when the market simply wasn’t there for the likes of Miller or Boeser. That was plan A. Sell off some assets to receive good future assets. That’s what didn’t materialize.

So plan B was build some depth where they could and take a wait and see approach to some of these other things. I think that’s fine.

 

[MarkMM]

the benning comparisons are tired; agreed. i don't get why people are giving this group so much rope though. they've done nothing to inspire confidence so far

their best moves were all gimmes. they didn't scout or discover kuzmenko. they get credit for convincing him to sign in vancouver over edmonton or whatever for sure. same with lazar, joshua, aman, etc. those are salesmanship successes not scouting or player development successes. i like what they did with the bottom end of the roster but that's table stakes for a winning team. if you can't find cheap and effective depth then you have no business managing a roster

the contracts with term they've given out (miller, boeser, mikheyev) all come with a fair amount of risk and none look to be bargains. they've gone back and forth on first miller and now horvat which while pragmatic doesn't really speak to their long term planning ability. they're facing a cap crunch next summer with 8 roster slots to sign for ~12ish million and no clear path to freeing up any space without sacrificing a piece like garland (a player who while not great may be their best winger). they were unable to clear space to cover bonuses last season which makes it harder to clear space to cover bonuses this season and could face another ~2 mil in bonus overages being pushed into next season. they were arguably forced into a situation where they had to pay a 2nd to clear cap just to set their opening day roster. good cap management is basically free. you just need to invest time in understanding the cba and then execute

maybe worst of all they're going into a season where they plan to compete with schenn, poolman, myers and burroughs as their right side defense. you can't say they don't know this isn't a problem as they identified it themselves from day one. i respect that they can't force a move that isn't there but if it's literally impossible to put together a credible defense then this was a year to sit back and prepare for next year. they've done exactly the opposite

i'm not calling them 'the worst management group ever' or anything hyperbolic. i do have high expectations for them though. i'm going to be critical until they do something to live up to those expectations

All this is fair. I don't think they've done anything to prove that they're building contenders, but even the decisions which I wouldn't be in favour of aren't long-term crippling, and even if their positive moves are gimmes those are gimmes Benning never got. The specific issue was those (4Twenty) saying this is no different than Benning. Even if it's not great management, even if it's just average or even mediocre, it's definitely worlds apart from Benning who was actively horrific.

All this strong down the middle talk is nice and all but while Miller is strong at face offs, at least stronger than EP, he cheats on the offensive side over his Center duties way too much. For that reason, I consider him more of a winger. I know some people don’t see EP as a center because of the face offs but he does all the other center duties quite well so I do consider him one.

Where it really falls apart though is Calgary is actually also quite strong down the middle with lindholm, kadri, and backlund but their D is also way WAY WAY better than ours.

We can’t just be strong down the middle and have tire fire D because there are other teams also strong down the middle but with much less holes. And that’s if EP and Miller are even considered in the middle. Right now the best description for us is that we have a lot of good forwards but terrible D. So the people that actual argue that we should keep all our forwards are crazy imo. Lol

As far as new management goes. There only bad moves were 3rd for a dermott, 2nd to cap dump Dickinson, re signing Boeser and miller, and maybe the Mikayev signing(at least the timing is bad if it lead to the 2nd as a cap dump move). However, literally every single move that dim made was bad so its going to take a lot more for them to be in the same conversation as dim. Mistakes happen so I can give them a little more rope. I prefer their doing nothing approach over dims going nuts approach at the very least. Patience is a virtue. I have always been a if you are not sure, don’t do it type of approach person and I agree that’s how the Canucks management should be too but they need to keep ALL of their picks for this to work. Because if you don’t make any moves, at least you have picks and the farm to replenish the team when necessary. If you trade all your picks, have no cap, have no farm, AND don’t do anything or make it worse by trading picks just for a little bit of cap, then you are in trouble. Let’s hope new management just stops now.

Yeah, I've always thought of Miller as more of a winger and Petersson as more of a centre, I'd be happy if we built an elite top-line of Miller - Petersson - Boeser, that would be a top line that could be on a contending team, and allowing Horvat to slot in as a 2C where his production and poor fit as a match-up centre-man make more sense. To clear cap space, if Kuzmenko turns out to be the real deal then he could be a legit top six winger, and as much as I like Garland, we'd need to move him out and I wouldn't have done the Mikheyev deal, which would simultaneously make more room for the likes of Hoglander and Podkolzin to grow.

Then there'd be more room to fix the defence, but I also don't think that would happen right away, it would just be a matter of waiting for the right circumstance to develop and be ready to pounce, with ample cap space and hopefully the hoarding of picks which I'd hope could be addressed over a couple of seasons.

a lot of but benning going on this morning.

mikhaeyev does have a feel of a benning era pro scouting disaster. too much money and term for a guy who is only worth that much if you project better performance than he has ever achieved. that's the blueprint..

but i think the real problem is playing in the non-replacement level ufa market at all. it's like criticizing someone for losing at roulette instead of for playing roulette. the odds are against you. that's the game.

so why does our strategy still include it? because i believe if we are going to keep doing it we will be in cap hell forever because of the inevitable misses and resulting deadweight.

you look at a successful team like colorado and all they do in the ufa market is bottom feed.

i would love for someone to do a comparison of $2m aav plus ufa spending among nhl teams over the years and see where we sit.

Benning comes up fairly in two points:

1.) We have to acknowledge the hole he dug us, and that it'll take more than one off-season to undo nearly a decade of damage that some here spent years pretending was fine, and are now saying that this new management isn't fast enough at fixing.

2.) Using Benning as a benchmark of the current management, and then incredulously saying that there isn't any difference. That's dishonest and bizarre and rightly needs to be called out.

I don’t think it’s an exaggeration let alone an extreme one.

I understand why that’s triggering because it was so devastating for it to go on for 8 seasons, but I’ve made my points about it. Not sure why you want to keep discussing them.

Look at all the stuff we agree on.

Saying this management is doing the same damage as Benning is so preposterously stupid one would have to be intentionally obtuse to say it with a straight face.

None, absolutely NONE of the moves made thus far by Rutherford and Alvin came close to the damage any one of Benning's decisions. Trading a 2nd to get rid of Dickinson and bring in Stillman is NOT the same as saddling this team with OEL's salary anchor till 2027 AND losing Guenther (and Garland doesn't come close to making up for it). And that trade also only happened because Benning suffocated us with Eriksson's signing, and then piled on with Beagle and Roussel. I'm not a fan of the Mikheyev signing, but he does bring speed, aggression and defensive responsibility, unlike Benning trading Bonino for Sutter, adding on a draft pick, and then signing him to a multi-year bloated contract with a retroactive NTC.

Saying Benning and Rutherford / Alvin are the same because they're both making bad decisions is like saying a shop lifter and a serial killer are basically the same because they both commit crimes. It's just silly and neuters any semblance of credibility.

 

[RandV]

It appears to me they’re being taken to task for overspending on the wing, coming back with the same blueline, and essentially going for it.

Given they’re going for it, I don’t think it’s fair that what they’ve done can’t be analyzed and critiqued. Nor do I think writing off the next two seasons from evaluation makes any sense in any line of work.

This management has chosen this path.


Just the same as the last one decided their own path.


That folks don’t want analysis or critique until next November is silly. Moves like Bonino, R.Miller, and Dorsett explained a lot about the last crew. I don’t get why people can’t make judgements on Mikheyev, and the bloated spending at wing.

Surely nobody is saying they should be removed. So I don’t get the complaints.


Just because average or whatever you folks are calling it is better than Benning, doesn’t mean good. The org needs better than average.

Is it?

Center: Pettersson, Horvat, Miller, Lazar
Total: $19.1M
Avg: $4.78M

Wing: Boeser, Garland, Mikheyev, Pearson, Kuzmenko, Podkolzin, Hoglander, Dakota
Total: $23.19
Avg: $2.90M

Defense: Hughes, OEL, Myers, Poolman, Dermott, Schenn
Total: $26.96
Avg: $4.33

People have been saying this repeatedly but when you actually stop and look at the salary breakdown it looks much more like a case of 'who did we last spend money on' than any sort of actual overspending. Take Boeser and Mikheyev's salaries out and the average (without adding two more from the farm) drops to $1.97M, which is bargain basement spending. Also in terms of top 10 ranked spending by position on the team it goes: D-C-D-W-D-C-C-G--W-W.

If anything it seems to me if it's anywhere the "bloat" is on defense, which again thanks Jim Benning!

 

[MarkMM]

I think they ended up going forward with this group as they made the determination that this course of action was the most prudent when the market simply wasn’t there for the likes of Miller or Boeser. That was plan A. Sell off some assets to receive good future assets. That’s what didn’t materialize.

So plan B was build some depth where they could and take a wait and see approach to some of these other things. I think that’s fine.

I thought it was a fair debate whether this team was too far from being a contender within the window of our existing core, and therefore the ugly but necessary of a rebuild was necessary.

Management clearly looked at Demko, Hughes and Petersson, and figured that they could work with that. One of Horvat or Miller would need to be kept, I think it was transparent that they probably assumed Horvat was their guy (since he was younger and our captain) and Miller would hopefully be auctioned off to fix the defence. Either they were too greedy and missed the window with Miller or we never got a fair offer, so they decided to hold on to him rather than lose him for nothing (unlike Benning and Tyfolli, because, you know, Rutherford/Alvin is NOT the same as Benning).

All that makes fair enough sense, the question to me was the Mikheyev signing. Even if in isolation he adds an element we need, it's not an element we need as much as we need to fix the defence, and there's only so much cap space. When we got Kuzmenko, it made the wing even more crowded.

My only assumption would be that they have a to-do list of things that needed to be fixed, and figured that if we can't fix the defence right now we might as well move when we can to fix other things (speed, size and aggression, penalty killing) and if Mikheyev does that then tick it off the to-do list. Just because we can't fix all things right now doesn't mean we shouldn't act on what we can, kind of thinking. That's all fine, except for the cap crunch it's left us in, they gambled that fixing our forwards before moving out surplus wingers and salaries could be managed, and then injuries bit them hard and cost us a 2nd to get cap compliant again.

This could all turn out fine if they eventually do move out surplus wingers, fix the defence and recoup futures. There's a logic to it, but it is a gamble that time will tell whether it pays off.

 

[4Twenty]

All this is fair. I don't think they've done anything to prove that they're building contenders, but even the decisions which I wouldn't be in favour of aren't long-term crippling, and even if their positive moves are gimmes those are gimmes Benning never got. The specific issue was those (4Twenty) saying this is no different than Benning. Even if it's not great management, even if it's just average or even mediocre, it's definitely worlds apart from Benning who was actively horrific.



Yeah, I've always thought of Miller as more of a winger and Petersson as more of a centre, I'd be happy if we built an elite top-line of Miller - Petersson - Boeser, that would be a top line that could be on a contending team, and allowing Horvat to slot in as a 2C where his production and poor fit as a match-up centre-man make more sense. To clear cap space, if Kuzmenko turns out to be the real deal then he could be a legit top six winger, and as much as I like Garland, we'd need to move him out and I wouldn't have done the Mikheyev deal, which would simultaneously make more room for the likes of Hoglander and Podkolzin to grow.

Then there'd be more room to fix the defence, but I also don't think that would happen right away, it would just be a matter of waiting for the right circumstance to develop and be ready to pounce, with ample cap space and hopefully the hoarding of picks which I'd hope could be addressed over a couple of seasons.



Benning comes up fairly in two points:

1.) We have to acknowledge the hole he dug us, and that it'll take more than one off-season to undo nearly a decade of damage that some here spent years pretending was fine, and are now saying that this new management isn't fast enough at fixing.

2.) Using Benning as a benchmark of the current management, and then incredulously saying that there isn't any difference. That's dishonest and bizarre and rightly needs to be called out.



Saying this management is doing the same damage as Benning is so preposterously stupid one would have to be intentionally obtuse to say it with a straight face.

None, absolutely NONE of the moves made thus far by Rutherford and Alvin came close to the damage any one of Benning's decisions. Trading a 2nd to get rid of Dickinson and bring in Stillman is NOT the same as saddling this team with OEL's salary anchor till 2027 AND losing Guenther (and Garland doesn't come close to making up for it). And that trade also only happened because Benning suffocated us with Eriksson's signing, and then piled on with Beagle and Roussel. I'm not a fan of the Mikheyev signing, but he does bring speed, aggression and defensive responsibility, unlike Benning trading Bonino for Sutter, adding on a draft pick, and then signing him to a multi-year bloated contract with a retroactive NTC.

Saying Benning and Rutherford / Alvin are the same because they're both making bad decisions is like saying a shop lifter and a serial killer are basically the same because they both commit crimes. It's just silly and neuters any semblance of credibility.

This is a misinterpretation of anything I’ve said. I think you’re attributing a whole bunch of your own incorrect inferences to create an argument that I’ve never made.


It doesn’t feel that different doesn’t mean I’ve said they’re as damaging or that there is no difference.

The part I think people forget is The previous regime was 8 years. If all you’re using in the reference are moves like Eriksson, beagle, OEL, you’re missing the big picture of what im referring to.

As part of a bigger picture it doesn’t feel dissimilar.

I’m glad it does for you.

Hopefully there’s a real stamp of authority type move coming sooner than later.

 

[Ruthervin]

Trading for OEL was an absolute necessity for this team because this team was in desperate need of a prime Alexander Edler replacement (i.e. a guy that could take on tough match-ups and be an all-situations guy for us). Last season, OEL more than fit that bill. People need to realize that he wasn't brought in here to be an offensive juggernaut/PP QB. That's what we have Hughes for. OEL was brought in here to fill the role of prime Alex Edler and he did that for the most part. Furthermore, whenever Hughes was hurt and OEL needed to step up and fill the Hughes void, he did that.

OEL is overpaid, YES, but he was criminally underrated by many Canucks fans for the simple fact that he was "a Benning guy."

 

[4Twenty]

Is it?

Center: Pettersson, Horvat, Miller, Lazar
Total: $19.1M
Avg: $4.78M

Wing: Boeser, Garland, Mikheyev, Pearson, Kuzmenko, Podkolzin, Hoglander, Dakota
Total: $23.19
Avg: $2.90M

Defense: Hughes, OEL, Myers, Poolman, Dermott, Schenn
Total: $26.96
Avg: $4.33

People have been saying this repeatedly but when you actually stop and look at the salary breakdown it looks much more like a case of 'who did we last spend money on' than any sort of actual overspending. Take Boeser and Mikheyev's salaries out and the average (without adding two more from the farm) drops to $1.97M, which is bargain basement spending. Also in terms of top 10 ranked spending by position on the team it goes: D-C-D-W-D-C-C-G--W-W.

If anything it seems to me if it's anywhere the "bloat" is on defense, which again thanks Jim Benning!

Well obviously they’re bloated on defence. My assumption is theyre stuck with those high priced dmen.

That said defensman tend to make more than wingers. There are less available positions for defensman.

I think the Canucks having $6.67m, $4.95m, $4.75m, and $3.25m tied up on the least valuable position is wasteful. I also think there’s an $8m player who is only a C in Vancouver based on the roster makeup who probably goes to this list.

It also projects to be even more expensive if Kuzmenko hits the expected heights. That’s clearly the place imo the Canucks have bloat. It’s probably also the easiest to fill with cheaper salaries.

 

[Hit the post]

Trading for OEL was an absolute necessity for this team because this team was in desperate need of a prime Alexander Edler replacement (i.e. a guy that could take on tough match-ups and be an all-situations guy for us).

 

[andora]

This is a misinterpretation of anything I’ve said. I think you’re attributing a whole bunch of your own incorrect inferences to create an argument that I’ve never made.


It doesn’t feel that different doesn’t mean I’ve said they’re as damaging or that there is no difference.

The part I think people forget is The previous regime was 8 years. If all you’re using in the reference are moves like Eriksson, beagle, OEL, you’re missing the big picture of what im referring to.

As part of a bigger picture it doesn’t feel dissimilar.

I’m glad it does for you.

Hopefully there’s a real stamp of authority type move coming sooner than later.

this gave me an interesting thought - here is bennings first year of trades and signings...

Jun. 30, 2015	Anaheim Ducks Acquire:​ Kevin Bieksa · $4,600,000 Sum: $4,600,000 Change: +$4,600,000		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2016 2nd round pick (ANA - #55 - Filip Gustavsson) Sum: $0 Change: -$4,600,000
Jun. 27, 2015	San Jose Sharks Acquire:​ Patrick McNally · $0 Sum: $0 Change: $0		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2015 7th round pick (TBL - #210 - Tate Olson) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Jun. 27, 2015	Carolina Hurricanes Acquire:​ Eddie Läck · $1,150,000 Sum: $1,150,000 Change: +$1,150,000		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2015 3rd round pick (CAR - #66 - Guillaume Brisebois) 2016 7th round pick (CAR - #194 - Brett McKenzie) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,150,000
Mar. 2, 2015	Calgary Flames Acquire:​ 2015 2nd round pick (VAN - #53 - Rasmus Andersson) Sum: $0 Change: -$894,167		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Sven Baertschi · $894,167 Sum: $894,167 Change: +$894,167
Mar. 2, 2015	New York Islanders Acquire:​ Dustin Jeffrey · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: -$600,000		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Cory Conacher · $600,000 Sum: $600,000 Change: +$600,000
Jan. 29, 2015	Chicago Blackhawks Acquire:​ Gustav Forsling · $0 (Signing Rights) Sum: $0 Change: $0		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Adam Clendening · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Nov. 25, 2014	New York Islanders Acquire:​ Alexandre Mallet · $0 (AHL/JR) 2016 3rd round pick (VAN - #64 - William Lockwood) Sum: $0 Change: $0		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Andrey Pedan · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Nov. 20, 2014	Edmonton Oilers Acquire:​ Kellan Lain · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Will Acton · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Jun. 28, 2014	Los Angeles Kings Acquire:​ 2014 2nd round pick (TBL - #50 - Roland McKeown) Sum: $0 Change: $0		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Linden Vey · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Jun. 27, 2014	New York Rangers Acquire:​ 2014 3rd round pick (ANA - #85 - Keegan Iverson) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,633,333		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Derek Dorsett · $1,633,333 Sum: $1,633,333 Change: +$1,633,333
Jun. 27, 2014	Anaheim Ducks Acquire:​ Ryan Kesler · $5,000,000 2015 3rd round pick (VAN - #84 - Deven Sideroff) Sum: $5,000,000 Change: +$925,000		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Luca Sbisa · $2,175,000 Nick Bonino · $1,900,000 2014 1st round pick (ANA - #24 - Jared McCann) 2014 3rd round pick (ANA - #85 - Keegan Iverson) Sum: $4,075,000 Change: -$925,000
Jun. 27, 2014	Tampa Bay Lightning Acquire:​ Jason Garrison · $4,600,000 Jeff Costello · $0 (Signing Rights) 2015 7th round pick (VAN - #204 - Jack Sadek) Sum: $4,600,000 Change: +$4,600,000		Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2014 2nd round pick (TBL - #50 - Roland McKeown) Sum: $0 Change: -$4,600,000

Miller, Ryan		Jul. 1, 2014	Standard (UFA)	3 years	$6,000,000	$18,000,000
Sanguinetti, Bobby		Jul. 1, 2014	Standard (UFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Jeffrey, Dustin		Jul. 2, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
O'Reilly, Cal		Jul. 2, 2014	Standard (UFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Vrbata, Radim		Jul. 3, 2014	Standard (UFA)	2 years	$5,000,000	$10,000,000
Kassian, Zack		Jul. 4, 2014	Standard (RFA)	2 years	$1,750,000	$3,500,000
Weber, Yannick		Jul. 4, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$850,000	$850,000
Biega, Alex		Jul. 4, 2014	Standard (UFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Cannata, Joe		Jul. 4, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Tanev, Christopher		Jul. 5, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$2,000,000	$2,000,000
Andersson, Peter		Jul. 5, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Vey, Linden		Jul. 15, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$735,000	$735,000
Archibald, Darren		Jul. 22, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
DeFazio, Brandon		Jul. 22, 2014	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Virtanen, Jake		Jul. 26, 2014	Entry-Level (ELC)	3 years	$925,000	$5,325,000
McCann, Jared		Jul. 26, 2014	Entry-Level (ELC)	3 years	$925,000	$3,412,500
Sautner, Ashton		Mar. 15, 2015	Entry-Level (ELC)	3 years	$675,000	$2,036,000
Hutton, Ben		Mar. 16, 2015	Entry-Level (ELC)	2 years	$896,250	$1,850,000
Tanev, Christopher		Mar. 24, 2015	Standard (RFA)	5 years	$4,450,000	$22,250,000
Sbisa, Luca		Apr. 8, 2015	Standard (RFA)	3 years	$3,600,000	$10,800,000
Dorsett, Derek		Apr. 8, 2015	Standard (UFA)	4 years	$2,650,000	$10,600,000
Subban, Jordan		May 16, 2015	Entry-Level (ELC)	3 years	$755,000	$2,775,000
Labate, Joseph		May 16, 2015	Entry-Level (ELC)	2 years	$680,000	$1,600,000
Stewart, MacKenze		May 16, 2015	Entry-Level (ELC)	3 years	$655,000	$1,965,000
Cannata, Joe		Jun. 18, 2015	Standard (UFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Kenins, Ronalds		Jun. 22, 2015	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000
Friesen, Alex		Jun. 22, 2015	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$575,000	$575,000
Markström, Jacob		Jun. 29, 2015	Standard (RFA)	2 years	$1,550,000	$3,100,000
Vey, Linden		Jun. 29, 2015	Standard (RFA)	1 year	$1,000,000	$1,000,000
Biega, Alex		Jun. 30, 2015	Standard (UFA)	1 year	$600,000	$600,000

 

[TruGr1t]

Trading for OEL was an absolute necessity for this team because this team was in desperate need of a prime Alexander Edler replacement (i.e. a guy that could take on tough match-ups and be an all-situations guy for us). Last season, OEL more than fit that bill. People need to realize that he wasn't brought in here to be an offensive juggernaut/PP QB. That's what we have Hughes for. OEL was brought in here to fill the role of prime Alex Edler and he did that for the most part. Furthermore, whenever Hughes was hurt and OEL needed to step up and fill the Hughes void, he did that.

OEL is overpaid, YES, but he was criminally underrated by many Canucks fans for the simple fact that he was "a Benning guy."

The clock on OEL has already started. It’s only a question of how quickly he breaks down. Over under is probably you get 1.5 more seasons out of him before he starts to decline precipitously due to age and injury.

 

[credulous]

oel was bad last year. myers was also bad. this market/fanbase gave oel and myers way too much credit for not being disasterous. that pairing was in the bottom third of the league for effectiveness. they got absolutely dominated on zone entries and they were awful at zone exits. they don't bring much offense altho to be fair they were blocked by quinn hughes in that respect. their on ice (actual) results were slightly better than expected based on their metrics but that's mostly down to demko's incredible performance last year

the canucks are paying 13.25 mil for that pairing and it's getting outperformed by pairings making a fraction of that

 

[credulous]

You think that’s a fair representation of the transactions?

So Dermott and Stillman don’t count?

this is where i'm at. getting a third for hamonic is great. trading a third for dermott is not

clearing dickinson's salary is great. paying a 2nd to do it is not, not even to get 'depth' at left defense

we'll see soon where stillman and dermott are actually at, but i don't really see either of them being much of an upgrade on burroughs/wolanin

 

[VanillaCoke]

OEL was a necessity now

Holy moly the copium around here has been cranked up

 

[I Hart Conor Garland]

Trading for OEL was an absolute necessity for this team because this team was in desperate need of a prime Alexander Edler replacement (i.e. a guy that could take on tough match-ups and be an all-situations guy for us). Last season, OEL more than fit that bill. People need to realize that he wasn't brought in here to be an offensive juggernaut/PP QB. That's what we have Hughes for. OEL was brought in here to fill the role of prime Alex Edler and he did that for the most part. Furthermore, whenever Hughes was hurt and OEL needed to step up and fill the Hughes void, he did that.

OEL is overpaid, YES, but he was criminally underrated by many Canucks fans for the simple fact that he was "a Benning guy."

OEL has one of the worst contracts in hockey. You never need to add that.

 

[biturbo19]

Keeping Poolman on the roster is definitely one of those litmus test moments for this new regime. It's a test that they egregiously failed. Just makes it abundantly clear that they're not willing to break a few eggs to make an omelette.


Just demonstrated that they're not willing to make the hard calls to make the team better, if that means waiving or hurting the feelings of a vested veteran on a significant contract.

Bringing in a $1.3M depth defenceman on top of that, when they have very cheap guys in house who performed well through the preseason just shows a lack of awareness when it comes to finding small efficiencies with the salary cap. When you get depth guys who can play on those minimal sort of salaries, you have to leverage that to balance out the spending you're doing at the top of the roster. They failed to identify those sort of areas of potential savings on defence. They seemed to identify Aman as a point of leverage up front, and hopefully he's good enough...but the defence corps was really where they had a more solid opportunity to make some savings. But instead, they kept Poolman on the roster, and spent a premium pick to move a useful player in Dickinson for marginal cap relief and an expensive depth defenceman they didn't need.

It's just really not confidence inspiring.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

oel was bad last year. myers was also bad. this market/fanbase gave oel and myers way too much credit for not being disasterous. that pairing was in the bottom third of the league for effectiveness. they got absolutely dominated on zone entries and they were awful at zone exits. they don't bring much offense altho to be fair they were blocked by quinn hughes in that respect. their on ice (actual) results were slightly better than expected based on their metrics but that's mostly down to demko's incredible performance last year

the canucks are paying 13.25 mil for that pairing and it's getting outperformed by pairings making a fraction of that

To me OEL is kind of like Horvat where he is best situated on the team to play the shut down role, but isn't really that effective at it. Below 50% in shots for, scoring chances and high danger scoring chances. Being 4th in on ice save percentage masked a lot. As an aside, of the defenders that played at least 400 5v5 minutes last year, 5 Canucks were in the top 30 in on ice save percentage. Really goes to show how important Demko is for this team.

OEL and Myers would ideally be a number 3 and 4/5 respectively. The problem is that even if we had the assets to bring in a top pairing D to push them down the line up, their 13.25m cap hit means we wouldn't be able to afford one.