LW Kyle Connor (2015, 17th, WPG) II

4thline

Registered User
Jul 18, 2014
14,519
9,848
Waterloo
Given your history of posting in Jets prospects threads and downplaying their ability where I remember the time you compared Laine to Aramia statistically once. I would hope you would be less transparent here in your attempts to compare Kyle Connor to Connor Brown. http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=128878043&postcount=747

Nevertheless, the point I was comparing both to was Connor's and Nylander's stats from their first AHL season. They are very similar, if not better for Connor since he has 18 goals to Nylander's 14 with similar games played. But points wise they are very similar, but a fraction better for Nylander.

Further, though it is true Nylander was younger when he entered the AHL than Connor was, I do think it evens out when you consider their paths to the pros. You have a habit of posting that development is linear for all players, failing to realize not all conditions are the same. Here is the condition you do not realize that makes up the age difference.

Most reasonable people will agree Nylander was much more AHL ready than Connor was, given he had already played against Men in the Swedish hockey league, his draft year, and the beginning of his sophomore year, whereas Connor played Tier I Junior A hockey against similar aged teenagers his draft year, and then after being drafted College hockey last year.

IF we are comparing just these 2 players and not to pivot into making general statements in other separate cases. Which you are hinting at here with Matthews and Laine. Where both played against pros in their draft year, however Laine was 17 doing it, Matthews was 18. It is quite a difference, and given this I see a Connor/Nylander comparison fine if we take age and pro experience into account.

Instead of simplistic linear the apples to apples comparisons you are attempting here.

307 words to say "contextual analysis and logic be damned"
 

93LEAFS

Registered User
Nov 7, 2009
34,074
21,178
Toronto
Given your history of posting in Jets prospects threads and downplaying their ability where I remember the time you compared Laine to Aramia statistically once. I would hope you would be less transparent here in your attempts to compare Kyle Connor to Connor Brown. http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=128878043&postcount=747

Nevertheless, the point I was comparing both to was Connor's and Nylander's stats from their first AHL season. They are very similar, if not better for Connor since he has 18 goals to Nylander's 14 with similar games played. But points wise they are very similar, but a fraction better for Nylander.

Further, though it is true Nylander was younger when he entered the AHL than Connor was, I do think it evens out when you consider their paths to the pros. You have a habit of posting that development is linear for all players, failing to realize not all conditions are the same. Here is the condition you do not realize that makes up the age difference.

Most reasonable people will agree Nylander was much more AHL ready than Connor was, given he had already played against Men in the Swedish hockey league, his draft year, and the beginning of his sophomore year, whereas Connor played Tier I Junior A hockey against similar aged teenagers his draft year, and then after being drafted College hockey last year.

IF we are comparing just these 2 players and not to pivot into making general statements in other separate cases. Which you are hinting at here with Matthews and Laine. Where both played against pros in their draft year, however Laine was 17 doing it, Matthews was 18. It is quite a difference, and given this I see a Connor/Nylander comparison fine if we take age and pro experience into account.

Instead of simplistic linear the apples to apples comparisons you are attempting here.
I compared them statistically because guess what, they came from the same league and similar statistics. When you are compaing prospects by statistics, it sort of matters which league and age they did things. You don't pick and choose statistics when it comes to that stuff, you find comparables, and guess what Laine's comparable coming from that league was Armia. If that is too hard a concept to understand for you, I'm not surprised.

And no, it doesn't balance out. You are creating a ridiculous comparison. You care comparing an 18-year-old Nylander to a 20-year-old Connor. Laine played another year against men, I don't see you ever bringing that up.

And if you want to talk about my history talking about Jets prospects. How about your 5 years of pretending to be a Leafs fan and your history posting about Nylander and Marner?

You do this with comparrisons all the time, why don't you find an actual baseline and be consistent from prospect to prospect, instead of constantly cherry picking which side you are going to take and then using it against whatever Leafs prospect you feel like. I'm sure 95% of Jets and Connor fans would find the Nylander season you chose to use as a comparable quite ridiculous. I also love this, "Most reasonable people would agree" stance you constantly harp on, its borderline ridiculous. When you want to use the opposite argument (which you have) you just claim Marner was more ready for the NHL than Laine becuase he played on smaller ice, but when it comes to Connor and Nylander, Nylander was more ready because he played against men.

But fine, Nylander's 18-year-old comparison is absolutely fine to compare to Connor's 20-year-old season, but comparing Connor's 20-year-old season to Brown's 20-year-old season is not.

I don't think all development is linear, but you hide behind that claim to constantly spout ridiculously biased opinions and hide behind that.

Connor's doing fine, but just avoid comparing anyone to a Leafs prospect and we won't have problems. But, since you constantly do, and cherry pick how you do it, I have a feeling I'll have to continue to call out your ******** on a regular basis.
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,921
21,228
A better comparison is to Nylander's last AHL season. Age difference would be only 5 months.

Connor had a bit of a slow start, but lately he's been gold. It's undeniable that Nylander played on a much stronger team than what Connor's playing in, and Connor has scored goals at a higher rate after he got past the initial hurdle. At least a part of the assist differential can be attributed to the difference in team strength.


To me, it's more that things just needed to "click" for Connor when it came to the differences between college and pro play and that took a bit more time than expected. But his tools and skills are still there just as they always were.

The age difference is certainly compensated by Nylander's previous pro experience playing against men, where Connor's experience was from playing in Tier I Junior A hockey against teenagers or College hockey to the AHL. I hope no one is implying Connor has the advantage here.

I think it evens out, Nylander younger but experience wise was surely more ready to play in the AHL than Connor was even though he started to do so in his sophomore year. To be absolutely fair both had advantages and disadvantages, thus to just make it an age to age comparison is somewhat a disingenuous argument.
 

snowkiddin

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 26, 2016
16,618
27,446
I compared them statistically because guess what, they came from the same league and similar statistics. When you are compaing prospects by statistics, it sort of matters which league and age they did things. You don't pick and choose statistics when it comes to that stuff, you find comparables, and guess what Laine's comparable coming from that league was Armia. If that is too hard a concept to understand for you, I'm not surprised.

And no, it doesn't balance out. You are creating a ridiculous comparison. You care comparing an 18-year-old Nylander to a 20-year-old Connor. Laine played another year against men, I don't see you ever bringing that up.

And if you want to talk about my history talking about Jets prospects. How about your 5 years of pretending to be a Leafs fan and your history posting about Nylander and Marner?

You do this with comparrisons all the time, why don't you find an actual baseline and be consistent from prospect to prospect, instead of constantly cherry picking which side you are going to take and then using it against whatever Leafs prospect you feel like. I'm sure 95% of Jets and Connor fans would find the Nylander season you chose to use as a comparable quite ridiculous. I also love this, "Most reasonable people would agree" stance you constantly harp on, its borderline ridiculous. When you want to use the opposite argument (which you have) you just claim Marner was more ready for the NHL than Laine becuase he played on smaller ice, but when it comes to Connor and Nylander, Nylander was more ready because he played against men.

But fine, Nylander's 18-year-old comparison is absolutely fine to compare to Connor's 20-year-old season, but comparing Connor's 20-year-old season to Brown's 20-year-old season is not.

I don't think all development is linear, but you hide behind that claim to constantly spout ridiculously biased opinions and hide behind that.

Connor's doing fine, but just avoid comparing anyone to a Leafs prospect and we won't have problems. But, since you constantly do, and cherry pick how you do it, I have a feeling I'll have to continue to call out your ******** on a regular basis.

Weren't you one of the people a few pages back grumbling that people were comparing Marner and Connor last year because their stats (albeit in different leagues) were similar?

Let's also remember that Connor has a December birthday, and played 19 games in the NHL as a 19 year old before being sent to the AHL on his 20th birthday. Brown has a January birthday and began his rookie year at the age of 20. Brown was ten months older than Connor when each began their respective pro (AHL) careers.
 

snowkiddin

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 26, 2016
16,618
27,446
Uhh yeah? Its different leagues? :shakehead

Yeah, and if anything you could argue that Connor's performance was more impressive as he was playing against men, while Marner was playing against boys. But of course you could argue that the players Connor was playing with were better than the players Marner was playing with (I personally disagree but that is irrelevant). You can really cherrypick any argument you want when using stats as comparables.
 

93LEAFS

Registered User
Nov 7, 2009
34,074
21,178
Toronto
Weren't you one of the people a few pages back grumbling that people were comparing Marner and Connor last year because their stats (albeit in different leagues) were similar?

Let's also remember that Connor has a December birthday, and played 19 games in the NHL as a 19 year old before being sent to the AHL on his 20th birthday. Brown has a January birthday and began his rookie year at the age of 20. Brown was ten months older than Connor when each began their respective pro (AHL) careers.
I haven't said anything really about Marner since the first batch of Connor threads. I took issue with it last year, but not on a statistical basis. But, again, they were in different leagues, which is sort of a key point.
 

snowkiddin

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 26, 2016
16,618
27,446
I haven't said anything really about Marner since the first batch of Connor threads. I took issue with it last year, but not on a statistical basis. But, again, they were in different leagues, which is sort of a key point.

Ok, well then I apologize. I thought you were one of the ones complaining about the Marner/Connor comparisons, but I guess you weren't. My bad. I don't think the comparison ended with similar statistics in different leagues. I think Connor and Marner were being compared as offensive wingers with similar skill sets who had put up similar stats. People were just saying that basically they had the same PPG while playing in different leagues. But saying this just brings up a whole new argument of which league was harder to produce in. Arguably there's more future NHLers in the OHL than in college, but college has produced it's fair share of NHL talent. Connor was also a rookie playing against older players whereas Marner was in his third OHL season. Yes, there were players older than Marner too, but not the same level as players who were older than Connor.
 

kxx

the great southern threadkill
Feb 21, 2015
1,824
66
Winnipeg, MO
If Connor turns into a 30 goal a year winger, that's great value for his draft position. I would say 99% of HF posters (me included), had no idea at the level of creativity Marner had, and didn't expect him to adapt so quickly to the NHL, he is a treat to watch. At this point I don't expect Connor to be that type of player, but a 30 goal per year player would be a great fit on the second line in Wpg

I'll be happy with a Connor being a Marner lite. That would excellent value.
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,921
21,228
I'll be happy with a Connor being a Marner lite. That would excellent value.

I believe they are different type of players. Marner is more of a distributer. Connor is a better goal scorer. I can see Marner having the advantage points wise, and Connor having the advantage goals wise in their careers.
 

traffic cone

Registered User
May 12, 2011
1,841
1,479
But fine, Nylander's 18-year-old comparison is absolutely fine to compare to Connor's 20-year-old season, but comparing Connor's 20-year-old season to Brown's 20-year-old season is not.
1 year and 5 months actually.

Remember this the next time you're comparing Laine and Matthews. Laine is also "1 year" younger.
 

Potrzebie

Registered User
Mar 25, 2010
2,377
3,035
Came here to see how Kyle Connor is doing. I must have taken a wrong turn as this seems to be the Marner/Nylander thread.
 

93LEAFS

Registered User
Nov 7, 2009
34,074
21,178
Toronto
1 year and 5 months actually.

Remember this the next time you're comparing Laine and Matthews. Laine is also "1 year" younger.
My issue is with how the comparison is being done, and constantly shifted from prospect to prospect. Either way, by any comparison Connor is a draft year ahead of Nylander was when he started in the AHL. It doesn't work draft class or birth year wise, which is what I was bringing attention to. If you bothered to read the rest of the post, I acknowledge where they were by draft class in the original post.

I just thought it was pretty comical, someone who constantly belittles Leafs prospects has chosen to compare Connor's 20-year-old and draft plus 2 season to Nylander's 18-year-old season and draft+1. Especially, when they hard on that 8-month difference and how hard it is to come over from Europe in every Laine thread. I mean, I guess coming from Europe and adjusting to big ice is easy..... But coming from junior to play against men at the NHL level is easier than coming from Europe playing against men to playing against men is harder....

Maybe if people didn't constantly compare players to Leafs players when there are a boatload of other examples to choose from they wouldn't get this, but this particular poster has an affinity for choosing Leafs prospects, then comparing them unfavorably to other prospects. Why not use Pacioretty? Instead, he chooses to use Nylanders draft+1 against Connor's draft +2. Or has constant mentions of Marner.
 

Whileee

Registered User
May 29, 2010
46,144
33,346
My issue is with how the comparison is being done, and constantly shifted from prospect to prospect. Either way, by any comparison Connor is a draft year ahead of Nylander was when he started in the AHL. It doesn't work draft class or birth year wise, which is what I was bringing attention to. If you bothered to read the rest of the post, I acknowledge where they were by draft class in the original post.

I just thought it was pretty comical, someone who constantly belittles Leafs prospects has chosen to compare Connor's 20-year-old and draft plus 2 season to Nylander's 18-year-old season and draft+1. Especially, when they hard on that 8-month difference and how hard it is to come over from Europe in every Laine thread. I mean, I guess coming from Europe and adjusting to big ice is easy..... But coming from junior to play against men at the NHL level is easier than coming from Europe playing against men to playing against men is harder....

Maybe if people didn't constantly compare players to Leafs players when there are a boatload of other examples to choose from they wouldn't get this, but this particular poster has an affinity for choosing Leafs prospects, then comparing them unfavorably to other prospects. Why not use Pacioretty? Instead, he chooses to use Nylanders draft+1 against Connor's draft +2. Or has constant mentions of Marner.

I think posters compare Connor to Leafs prospects because the large majority of posters that slag him are Leafs fans.

Regardless of how anyone wants to spin it, Connor is having an excellent season in the AHL, in his 19 year old (D+2) season. His scoring pace on a very low scoring AHL team is outstanding, just as it was as an NCAA freshman.
 

snowkiddin

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 26, 2016
16,618
27,446
Came here to see how Kyle Connor is doing. I must have taken a wrong turn as this seems to be the Marner/Nylander thread.

Also, if you're still interested:

Connor is having a pretty good rookie year. It took him a while to adjust but once he did he began to produce offensively again. He is absolutely on fire right now. Just needs to beef up a bit and continue to work on his defense and he should be back in the NHL.
 

4thline

Registered User
Jul 18, 2014
14,519
9,848
Waterloo
Regardless of how anyone wants to spin it, Connor is having an excellent season in the AHL, in his 19 year old (D+2) season..

So which season since his U15 and U16 Major Bantam/Minor midget years played with other 96's was imaginary?

The U17,U18, and U19 years spent in the USHL or the U20 year in the NCAA?

There's no spin here. He's simply a 96 in his U21 season playing very comparably to other high end 96's that have not yet made the jump. Good bet to be a top 6 forward, potential for more.
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,921
21,228
Kyle scores his 19th of the season. Continues his hot streak. It was on a breakaway and on the backhand. Just caught the tail end of it flipping channels.
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,921
21,228
Based on last night's game. I believe Connor is NHL ready. He looked very comfortable in the style he is playing. When he was on the ice, he was dangerous and showed some good instincts. He's got a bit of Ehlers in him in terms of hustle, I think he will be more opportunistic with scoring chances though. IMO he was the best player on the ice for the Moose last night.

Here's his goal last night. He deked me out, at first I thought he scored on his back hand, but it was a backhand to forehand move.

 

Gurilla

former goal scorer
Jan 28, 2015
2,457
1,737
Winnipeg
Based on last night's game. I believe Connor is NHL ready. He looked very comfortable in the style he is playing. When he was on the ice, he was dangerous and showed some good instincts. He's got a bit of Ehlers in him in terms of hustle, I think he will be more opportunistic with scoring chances though. IMO he was the best player on the ice for the Moose last night.

Here's his goal last night. He deked me out, at first I thought he scored on his back hand, but it was a backhand to forehand move.



Yup he's definitely ready to go. Though I'd let him overripe in the A for the rest of the season and give him a fresh start next year with the Jets as a rookie.
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,921
21,228
Yup he's definitely ready to go. Though I'd let him overripe in the A for the rest of the season and give him a fresh start next year with the Jets as a rookie.

Very impressed in how he played last night. Think he is by far the most NHL ready player on the Moose. I agree, to save a year on him. He may be called up at the end of month and to finish out seaon.
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,921
21,228
Jets fans will be happy. Just checked the boxscore for today's game. Connor had 2 assists.

Brings him to 34 points in 41 games now on the season. 16 in his last 9.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad