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LW Arthur Kaliyev (2019, 33rd, LAK) | Page 24 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League
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LW Arthur Kaliyev (2019, 33rd, LAK)

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So there's a girl I knew for a long time. Always did poorly at school. Had to repeat a grade. Dropped out of high school. Some 6 years later, started high school again. Passed with extremely high marks. Got scholarship to a top uni in America.

You know what happens when you age? You mature.

I'd always bet on a 18-year-old maturing - a natural process - over an untalented prospect becoming an impact player.
Disagree, scouts and management always talks about being a self-starter, it's not really something that can be developed. The kid may still do enough to develop into an NHL'er but to say he will develop a work ethic, well that typically never happens.
 
Disagree, scouts and management always talks about being a self-starter, it's not really something that can be developed. The kid may still do enough to develop into an NHL'er but to say he will develop a work ethic, well that typically never happens.

Well that’s just not true. You didn’t slack off in high school? Or if you did, have you changed since? Do you work hard now?
 
Disagree, scouts and management always talks about being a self-starter, it's not really something that can be developed. The kid may still do enough to develop into an NHL'er but to say he will develop a work ethic, well that typically never happens.
I've known plenty of people who developed a work ethic and self control after age 18. One of the guys I grew up with went from a drunken, out of control buffoon in the last two years of high school to a respected(and sober) Toronto corporate lawyer.
 
pretty sure this is what Arthur said when he was interviewed after finally getting selected:

tumblr_ptkmct6dvY1xkok61o1_500.gif
lol that's awesome
 
Disagree, scouts and management always talks about being a self-starter, it's not really something that can be developed. The kid may still do enough to develop into an NHL'er but to say he will develop a work ethic, well that typically never happens.
What? On a fundamental level, this is completely incorrect. Actually, upon entering uni for example, many of the brighter people struggle because they actually need to start working hard when they could just cruise through earlier education. But many indeed to develop the work ethic necessary. I know so many examples that directly contradict what you're saying that I'm very surprised if that's considered general knowledge. All it takes is one moment where you realize that you actually need to work towards it. Will everyone get it? No, but a good amount will, and like I said, I'd much rather bet on that than bet on a bad player becoming good.

To me, I like to think like: "If he's this good with such a poor work ethic, imagine how good he'll become when he starts putting in the effort". On the other hand, if a player's bad in spite of putting in tons and tons of effort, that's not very promising to me. It's a very shortsighted way of looking at things to assume that people's mentality is fully matured at 18. It won't physiologically be until the 20s. Especially the frontal lobe develops slowly, which indeed is what comes to play for things such as these.
 
So there's a girl I knew for a long time. Always did poorly at school. Had to repeat a grade. Dropped out of high school. Some 6 years later, started high school again. Passed with extremely high marks. Got scholarship to a top uni in America.

You know what happens when you age? You mature.

.

Does that happen often?

My guess is not. Most people like that end of on low paying job or welfare.


The red flag reminds me of Hunter Shinkaruk
 
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What? On a fundamental level, this is completely incorrect. Actually, upon entering uni for example, many of the brighter people struggle because they actually need to start working hard when they could just cruise through earlier education. But many indeed to develop the work ethic necessary. I know so many examples that directly contradict what you're saying that I'm very surprised if that's considered general knowledge. All it takes is one moment where you realize that you actually need to work towards it. Will everyone get it? No, but a good amount will, and like I said, I'd much rather bet on that than bet on a bad player becoming good.

To me, I like to think like: "If he's this good with such a poor work ethic, imagine how good he'll become when he starts putting in the effort". On the other hand, if a player's bad in spite of putting in tons and tons of effort, that's not very promising to me. It's a very shortsighted way of looking at things to assume that people's mentality is fully matured at 18. It won't physiologically be until the 20s. Especially the frontal lobe develops slowly, which indeed is what comes to play for things such as these.
This is why you aren't a scout, you would have a 90 to 95% bust rate.
 
I've known plenty of people who developed a work ethic and self control after age 18. One of the guys I grew up with went from a drunken, out of control buffoon in the last two years of high school to a respected(and sober) Toronto corporate lawyer.
You are comparing a sport where having the best work ethic still doesn't guarantee you a career to school where the majority of people who qualify for university can finish any degree with varying degrees of work. The 99.5 percentile to the 60 to 70 percentile.

If your peers are working harder than you at 17 then they are likely to be working harder than you at 20 and 21.
 
Hopefully this doesnt turn into a discussion like usual. Like with Gaudreau who was too small to play in the NHL.

Seriously. 55 infractions and name calling all over. Eventually he proved almost everyone wrong. Nobody even looked back and just moved on.

I understand this is a discussion board but it so silly to be honest. Discussions about hockey IQ, work ethic or attitude are the worst.
 
I've known plenty of people who developed a work ethic and self control after age 18. One of the guys I grew up with went from a drunken, out of control buffoon in the last two years of high school to a respected(and sober) Toronto corporate lawyer.
Did he do it by the time he was 21? Because if a hockey player doesn't have pro-level work ethic at that point, he's extremely likely to wash out. It's not like other jobs where you can just dive in as an adult; every single year of training is important. and they all build on each other.
 
Character analysis aside, I can't think of a better mentor for a sniper who is a below average skater than Luc Robitaille.
 
I don't know if this guy makes it or not, but to use a 2nd rounder, your team's 3rd pick in the draft, seems like a reasonable price to pay. Even if your scouts don't love the way the guy plays, 50 goals shouldn't be ignored in case they are wrong on their projections (like everyone can be).
 
I was gutted that the Capitals didn't take him.
I read about concerns over "determination", which when asked, Arthur replied
" Do you think it is easy to score 50 goals in the OHL WITHOUT determination?"

There was also a flag about his skating, but he seemed to find his way to position himself perfectly to receive the pass.
I am not a scout, just a fan, and watching him pound One timers from the Right Circle, ala an opposite "Ovie", would be enough for me to take a risk.....Im not sure how much of a "risk" he is..
 
Am I the only one who doesn't think his skating is bad, or even below average?

Why do I have the sneaking suspicion that he fell in the rankings because he seems awkward and fidgety in interviews? Is it possible that the Bro culture of the NHL just didn't feel comfortable with his demeanour?
 
Am I the only one who doesn't think his skating is bad, or even below average?

Why do I have the sneaking suspicion that he fell in the rankings because he seems awkward and fidgety in interviews? Is it possible that the Bro culture of the NHL just didn't feel comfortable with his demeanour?

I think teams bought into the idea he's Brendl 2.0.
 
Didn't Esposito drop from the top 5 to 20th for that reason? Veleno falling from top-15 to 30th was due to consistency issues. I'm sure Ho-Sang was going higher but fell due to poor work ethic.
 
Why are you changing the context of the question now?

i did not

i am saying because he is not a north american and his background and the way he expresses himself is part of the reason he gets dropped down ?? i am stating even a 100 point plus big frame player with the exact same “characteristics” is still in the conversation for a minimum top 5
 
Didn't Esposito drop from the top 5 to 20th for that reason? Veleno falling from top-15 to 30th was due to consistency issues. I'm sure Ho-Sang was going higher but fell due to poor work ethic.

100 point plus in draft yr
 
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