Confirmed with Link: Leafs sign F Auston Matthews to extension (4 years, $13.25M AAV)

[Hellcat]

You're providing a good example of how intellectual dishonesty (or willful obtuseness?) makes intelligent discussion impossible.

I told you many posts ago that we disagree, pretty weird that you're only understanding that now.

I said good talk earlier, I take it back. Have a nice day.

I'd go with option B ...

... You feel the coach has no responsibility in managing the game, while I do, lets agree to disagree. If a player is playing like shit, lets just play him 22 minutes... how does a player "in game" hold himself accountable? Does he bench himself? Maybe he's a comic book hero where he can just decide to be better, ya know, ignore injures, ignore nerves, ignore the pressure you are putting on yourself, ignore the 26 years of dreaming about being a cup champion and seeing it slip through your hands ... just be better like those comic book cartoon hero's is your motto? You get that hockey players are human right not robots? Prone to bad games? and when they do play poorly it is who's job to manage the game ... Jesus some people...

 

[Gary Nylund]

I'd go with option B ...

... You feel the coach has no responsibility in managing the game, while I do, lets agree to disagree. If a player is playing like shit, lets just play him 22 minutes... how does a player "in game" hold himself accountable? Does he bench himself? Maybe he's a comic book hero where he can just decide to be better, ya know, ignore injures, ignore nerves, ignore the pressure you are putting on yourself, ignore the 26 years of dreaming about being a cup champion and seeing it slip through your hands ... just be better like those comic book cartoon hero's is your motto? You get that hockey players are human right not robots? Prone to bad games? and when they do play poorly it is who's job to manage the game ... Jesus some people...

I never said that, perfect example of your ridiculous straw man arguments. Jesus some people indeed.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Here's a thought.

Instead of signing players to absolute dollar terms, why not sign them to a percentage of the cap hit?

As the cap goes up or down each year the salary moves in lock step. This way Connor McDavid is always the highest paid player in the league. Everyone else can base what percentage of the cap hit they are worth off his.

Contracts can already be manipulated for the payouts to be different amounts each year anyway.

So no difference there if the player gets more one year and less another. Since the AAV is adjusted every year based off a percentage of the cap hit the player is always getting paid full value what he is worth every year. So it incentivizes long term signing for the player.

The only real downside is that the team has less opportunity for windfall gains if a player outgrows his contract.

That's not a player problem though.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Just gonna keep saying it: Auston Matthews is now committed to being a Leaf for 12 years minimum at the end of this deal. And he's happy about it. This is a happy story. The contract is secondary and isn't horrible.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Just gonna keep saying it: Auston Matthews is now committed to being a Leaf for 12 years minimum at the end of this deal. And he's happy about it. This is a happy story. The contract is secondary and isn't horrible.

That's something to be excited about.

 

[ACC1224]

Just gonna keep saying it: Auston Matthews is now committed to being a Leaf for 12 years minimum at the end of this deal. And he's happy about it. This is a happy story. The contract is secondary and isn't horrible.

It's all a ruse, just looking for the perfect opportunity to flee.

 

[Arzak]

Here's a thought.

Instead of signing players to absolute dollar terms, why not sign them to a percentage of the cap hit?

As the cap goes up or down each year the salary moves in lock step. This way Connor McDavid is always the highest paid player in the league. Everyone else can base what percentage of the cap hit they are worth off his.

Contracts can already be manipulated for the payouts to be different amounts each year anyway.

So no difference there if the player gets more one year and less another. Since the AAV is adjusted every year based off a percentage of the cap hit the player is always getting paid full value what he is worth every year. So it incentivizes long term signing for the player.

The only real downside is that the team has less opportunity for windfall gains if a player outgrows his contract.

That's not a player problem though.

We overpaid our RFA because RFA is the new UFA they said (spoiler alert, it's not).

Cooking a new CBA now?

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

We overpaid our RFA because RFA is the new UFA they said (spoiler alert, it's not).

Cooking a new CBA now?

You wouldn't necessarily be overpaying them.

Not if you give them a fair share of the cap hit commensurate to their performance. A floating salary determined by the cap hit percentage makes sense to me. You could still structure it so most of it is paid out in signing bonuses and front loaded.

It wouldn't take a whole lot of ingenuity to implement it I don't think.

Then again, how the f*** would I know? I don't have a clue what most of the CBA even says. It's not like I'm a lawyer or an accountant.

Just a fan with a big mouth and access to the internet.

 

[Hellcat]

Marner played possibly the worst game of his career in game 3 against Florida, how do you figure Keefe is to blame for that?

I never said that, perfect example of your ridiculous straw man arguments. Jesus some people indeed.

Pretty clear your giving Keefe a free pass, I've said it a half dozen times that the coach controls the ice time, if your star winger is having a game where he is so piss poor he is hurting the team you BENCH HIM.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Pretty clear your giving Keefe a free pass, I've said it a half dozen times that the coach controls the ice time, if your star winger is having a game where he is so piss poor he is hurting the team you BENCH HIM.

Pretty clear you twist my words to suit your narrative.

What Is a Straw Man Argument? Definition and Examples

Imagine arguing with a scarecrow. You can make any argument you want and the scarecrow won’t argue back. In fact, you can do…

www.grammarly.com

 

[mapleleaf979]

His contract isnt bad, a good leader would have accepted less. Matthews ego appears to be an issue to the point where he will shut it down on the playoffs, if he doesnt feel up for it.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

There are better examples than Drai. If Matthews had McDavid on his team he'd probably be putting up similar if not better numbers than Drai in the playoffs. It's not just the times they play together, but the attention McDavid gets. I think if anyone takes the time to actually imagine Matthews on the same team as McDavis will come to the same conclusion (though we got a preview in the World Cup or whatever it was called before his rookie season)

McDavid is THAT much better than Matthews, eh?

Wow.

Ok.

So... uh... why was Matthews paid as McDavid's equal last contract (when term is included)?

That seems like a strange decision, no? Man, McDavid is THAT much better than Matthews? AAV's don't represent that.

THAT is the problem.

 

[Arzak]

Pretty clear your giving Keefe a free pass, I've said it a half dozen times that the coach controls the ice time, if your star winger is having a game where he is so piss poor he is hurting the team you BENCH HIM.

If you eat 11M out of 82M cap you have to perform because your cap hit prevents the team from having a plan B for your special days...

Might as well hope for Mitch to start playing like it's regular season and he needs that 100th point...


50% tied in 4 forwards is the reason why we have so many 750k-3M fillers on the roster. Even if your filler overperforms by a factor of 2, that still makes him 2-6M player.


If he wasn't so greedy and or we had a couple of 5M players with the potential of putting up 11M season, we could bench Mitch and try one of them hoping for the best.

 

[Hellcat]

Pretty clear you twist my words to suit your narrative.

What Is a Straw Man Argument? Definition and Examples

Imagine arguing with a scarecrow. You can make any argument you want and the scarecrow won’t argue back. In fact, you can do…

www.grammarly.com

Pretty clear that is not the truth at all and you struggle with a simple concept of who manages ice time. Now that you know what a strawman argument is , can you put it into practice?

 

[Hellcat]

If you eat 11M out of 82M cap you have to perform because your cap hit prevents the team from having a plan B for your special days...

Might as well hope for Mitch to start playing like it's regular season and he needs that 100th point...


50% tied in 4 forwards is the reason why we have so many 750k-3M fillers on the roster. Even if your filler overperforms by a factor of 2, that still makes him 2-6M player.


If he wasn't so greedy and or we had a couple of 5M players with the potential of putting up 11M season, we could bench Mitch and try one of them hoping for the best.

Yes a 11m player should bring a 11mil type game, however every player is human, Gretzky, Ovie, Crosby, Vas., Stamkos, Kucherov, McDavid All have had horrible NHL playoff games, that is just a reality, people will be people, humans have inconsistent performances no matter the name on the back of the sweater, when that happens its up to the coach to manage their ice time.

We had players with lower cap hits that played over their value all season, didn't do a hill of beans good for this team in round 2. Not a single player or coach showed up in the Fla round, to blame one person is very "fan-ish". Where was ROR the fan darling who was supposed to lead us to the promise land. Rielly? Matty? JT? Jarnkrok? Anyone? No one?

The Leafs, coaching staff included were not prepared for Floridas physical game. The Leafs wanted to play a free flowing, transition soft game, when what it took was a grinding, physical game. Keefe was not prepared, his team was not prepared. Game one Florida ground and pound, Toronto lets play a soft transition game, Florida game 2, Ground and pound ... Toronto? Oh we are going to try that soft transition game again, worked so well for us in game one. Rinse wash repeat game 3, 4, 5. Toronto didn't respect their opponent, they didn't adjust they lost in 5. The coach and only the coach sets the game plan and the strategy for the game, it's his job to go to the team and say, hey this is not working , we need to do this instead. Florida wanted a war, Toronto wanted to have Tea time with biscuits.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Pretty clear that is not the truth at all and you struggle with a simple concept of who manages ice time. Now that you know what a strawman argument is , can you put it into practice?

Thanks for the suggestion but putting it into practice is clearly your thing, not mine.

What Is a Straw Man Argument? Definition and Examples

Imagine arguing with a scarecrow. You can make any argument you want and the scarecrow won’t argue back. In fact, you can do…

www.grammarly.com

 

[Hellcat]

Thanks for the suggestion but putting it into practice is clearly your thing, not mine.

What Is a Straw Man Argument? Definition and Examples

Imagine arguing with a scarecrow. You can make any argument you want and the scarecrow won’t argue back. In fact, you can do…

www.grammarly.com

Now now Gary that is called deflecting ... own it big buddy...own it...

 

[pcruz]

If you eat 11M out of 82M cap you have to perform because your cap hit prevents the team from having a plan B for your special days...

Might as well hope for Mitch to start playing like it's regular season and he needs that 100th point...


50% tied in 4 forwards is the reason why we have so many 750k-3M fillers on the roster. Even if your filler overperforms by a factor of 2, that still makes him 2-6M player.


If he wasn't so greedy and or we had a couple of 5M players with the potential of putting up 11M season, we could bench Mitch and try one of them hoping for the best.

Are you suggesting that Matthews hasn't lived up to his contract?


Hmm


He has played 4 of the 5 years of his deal.

In those 4 seasons, he has won 4 major individual trophies.

He ended 2nd in voting for 2 of them.

He ended 3rd in another trophy, in a season cut short by Covid, with the 2 guys ahead of him tied with 1 more goal scored, and 12 games left on the schedule.


I think he has lived up to every bit of his contract up to today.

The team around him has been underwhelming, but calling a player who has been at the very very top of the league in performance, greedy, is simple character assassination.


It's stupid and pedantic, and worst of all, it's incorrect.

 

[Hellcat]

You wouldn't necessarily be overpaying them.

Not if you give them a fair share of the cap hit commensurate to their performance. A floating salary determined by the cap hit percentage makes sense to me. You could still structure it so most of it is paid out in signing bonuses and front loaded.

It wouldn't take a whole lot of ingenuity to implement it I don't think.

Then again, how the f*** would I know? I don't have a clue what most of the CBA even says. It's not like I'm a lawyer or an accountant.

Just a fan with a big mouth and access to the internet.

The reference point for the guy you replied to is clearly a home town discount. he's paid fairly for what he would get on the open market but if you base your opinion on him taking a steep home town discount, he's over paid.... mmm fan logic ... like freshly baked chocolate chip cookies.

 

[Hellcat]

Are you suggesting that Matthews hasn't lived up to his contract?


Hmm


He has played 4 of the 5 years of his deal.

In those 4 seasons, he has won 4 major individual trophies.

He ended 2nd in voting for 2 of them.

He ended 3rd in another trophy, in a season cut short by Covid, with the 2 guys ahead of him tied with 1 more goal scored, and 12 games left on the schedule.


I think he has lived up to every bit of his contract up to today.

The team around him has been underwhelming, but calling a player who has been at the very very top of the league in performance, greedy, is simple character assassination.


It's stupid and pedantic, and worst of all, it's incorrect.

Bravo!!! Bravo!!! Bravo!!!

 

[Arzak]

Are you suggesting that Matthews hasn't lived up to his contract?


Hmm


He has played 4 of the 5 years of his deal.

In those 4 seasons, he has won 4 major individual trophies.

He ended 2nd in voting for 2 of them.

He ended 3rd in another trophy, in a season cut short by Covid, with the 2 guys ahead of him tied with 1 more goal scored, and 12 games left on the schedule.


I think he has lived up to every bit of his contract up to today.

The team around him has been underwhelming, but calling a player who has been at the very very top of the league in performance, greedy, is simple character assassination.


It's stupid and pedantic, and worst of all, it's incorrect.

No, I was merely replying to a poster suggesting it's as simple as benching Marner.

Matthews lived up to his contract. Took every penny, but lived up to it, unlike Mitch

 

[Gary Nylund]

No, I was merely replying to a poster suggesting it's as simple as benching Marner.

Matthews lived up to his contract. Took every penny, but lived up to it, unlike Mitch

That was an amusing sequence. First one guy quotes your post, goes on a rant about Matthews who wasn't even mentioned, then mr. straw man gets all excited and starts shouting bravo.

 

[pcruz]

That was an amusing sequence. First one guy quotes your post, goes on a rant about Matthews who wasn't even mentioned, then mr. straw man gets all excited and starts shouting bravo.

I'm not sure if you've noticed....


This is a discussion about Matthews and his contract.

Give the title a quick glance.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I'm not sure if you've noticed....

This is a discussion about Matthews and his contract.

Give the title a quick glance.

It's not enough to just read the thread title, don't be so lazy. If you're going to quote someone, you should also familiarize yourself with the content of their post before responding. I hope that helps.

 

[francis246]

No, I was merely replying to a poster suggesting it's as simple as benching Marner.

Matthews lived up to his contract. Took every penny, but lived up to it, unlike Mitch

I don’t understand this either. Marner has been above PPG every year of his contract and 2x first team nhl all star. How has he not lived up to his contract? He as well has been top 3 or even the best at his position every year. As a group they have struggled in the playoffs but like other posters have said, Matthews, Nylander and Marner have all pretty much lived up to their expectations and contracts individually.