Leafs need to address the goaltending.

[horner]

You actually need it explained to you?

It is idiotic because claiming that another player could get hurt isn't a valid comparison - there are replacements for the other players. The only replacement for Jones is a guy with 15 games experience, none of which were in the NHL, or a guy whose brain is broken. What part of that is so difficult to understand? They are literally one errant shot away from not having an NHL goalie. And what if they did have to go with Hildeby because Jones gets injured, who do they use as a backup then?

4 teams have the same issues

Can you wait and see what Hildeby is all about he is going to play 4 games.

When Woll comes back and there are problems then iam sure the Leafs will do something about it .

If Mathew's or Nylander went down we don't have a replacement for them I shouldn't have to explain THAT TO YOU.

 

[horner]

Honestly


Truthfully I don't care who.

But if I HAD to pick a name MAF would be on my list for sure.

He's not having a great year himself but his numbers are still MILES better than Samsonov.

As for how? Well you ask Minnesota what additional assets they would need to take Samsonov because Samsonov would need to be part of a deal.

I thought heard last that he didn't want to play ?
He's Minnesota's starting goaltender right now, Gustafsson is injured week to week.
Minnesota is 4 points out of a wild card position , the West really sucks this year .

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I thought heard last that he didn't want to play ?
He's Minnesota's starting goaltender right now, Gustafsson is injured week to week.
Minnesota is 4 points out of a wild card position , the West really sucks this year .

It came out after that trade offer got leaked that he was never asked to waive his NTC, but that he would have waived if he was asked.

I don't see why that would change now given where Minnesota is in their division

 

[horner]

Honestly


Truthfully I don't care who.

But if I HAD to pick a name MAF would be on my list for sure.

He's not having a great year himself but his numbers are still MILES better than Samsonov.

As for how? Well you ask Minnesota what additional assets they would need to take Samsonov because Samsonov would need to be part of a deal.

We have Jones not to sure why you are talking about Sammy he got waived.

 

[horner]

Honestly


Truthfully I don't care who.

But if I HAD to pick a name MAF would be on my list for sure.

He's not having a great year himself but his numbers are still MILES better than Samsonov.

As for how? Well you ask Minnesota what additional assets they would need to take Samsonov because Samsonov would need to be part of a deal.

Fleury 2 playoff games .811 save %
This yr 16 gp .896 save %
3.5 mil cap
Then you want them to take on Sammy's cap hit
1st rd pk that is what I would ask for if I was Minnesota

 

[Menzinger]

I'd probably rather bet on Jones than MAF this season despite their recent history.

Goalies are voodoo, ride the hot hand. And MAF is 39 and not having a great season

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

I'd probably rather bet on Jones than MAF this season despite their recent history.

Goalies are voodoo, ride the hot hand. And MAF is 39 and not having a great season

This. There's no clear cut upgrades that are available. Do not waste assets on a goaltender. Stick with Woll and Jones for now and solidify the defense to help insulate our goaltenders.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

This. There's no clear cut upgrades that are available. Do not waste assets on a goaltender. Stick with Woll and Jones for now and solidify the defense to help insulate our goaltenders.

Yes there are You just refuse to see it you choose to live in a world of denial

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

Yes there are You just refuse to see it you choose to live in a world of denial

The only solution you've come up with for a goaltender is a 39 year old, having a bad season. You know there aren't many good goalies in the league who are an upgrade on Woll and Jones. There's only about 10 good starters and everyone else is just average or just below. So why exactly are you wanting to waste assets on a move that is most likely a lateral?

Lets just say Markstrom is available. You put him behind a weak defense like ours has been for most of the season. One that gives up a lot of grade A chances. It s not going to have as big an impact as it would be to get some top 4 defendersin here.

A goaltender is only as good as the team in front of him. If the team in front of him is making it easier on him, he looks good. If the team in front of you isn't playing their positions and making the goalies job harder, he looks worse. It's not a hard concept to understand.

If you want an example, look at Vegas. They used 4 goaltenders through out the year last year. Thompson, Broissoit, Quick, Hill. Do any of those guys scream elite starter to you? All 4 guys had outstanding records and sv%s. They won their cup with their 4th stringer. Now is it because all 4 goaltenders are really good? Or is it because that team is made up of forwards and Defense that are playing a rock solid team game in front of them? What seems more likely to you?

 

[Ciao]

The Leafs don't need to panic over goaltending or defence.

If they can acquire a genuine upgrade at a reasonable cost they should do so, but they don't need more of what they already have. That wouldn't help them.

Benoit, Lagesson and Jones all look fine. Good job by Treliving to sign them.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

The only solution you've come up with for a goaltender is a 39 year old, having a bad season. You know there aren't many good goalies in the league who are an upgrade on Woll and Jones. There's only about 10 good starters and everyone else is just average or just below. So why exactly are you wanting to waste assets on a move that is most likely a lateral?

Lets just say Markstrom is available. You put him behind a weak defense like ours has been for most of the season. One that gives up a lot of grade A chances. It s not going to have as big an impact as it would be to get some top 4 defendersin here.

A goaltender is only as good as the team in front of him. If the team in front of him is making it easier on him, he looks good. If the team in front of you isn't playing their positions and making the goalies job harder, he looks worse. It's not a hard concept to understand.

If you want an example, look at Vegas. They used 4 goaltenders through out the year last year. Thompson, Broissoit, Quick, Hill. Do any of those guys scream elite starter to you? All 4 guys had outstanding records and sv%s. They won their cup with their 4th stringer. Now is it because all 4 goaltenders are really good? Or is it because that team is made up of forwards and Defense that are playing a rock solid team game in front of them? What seems more likely to you?

So if the defense is all that matters Why has Samsonov been a piece of shit, while Jones has had a good stretch? It's the EXACT same defense It's not like Samsonov gets Tonights defense while Jones has the best defense of all time in front of him.

That's not how that works.

I'm never going to be comfortable with Martin Jones as the #1 goalie because at the end of the day It's Martin Jones, he's had a great 10 game run and we have needed it but he's on the contract he's on because he was AWFUL for 5 straight years, even last year when he won 27 games it wasn't because he was good, he wasn't.

And I promise you I sure as hell don't EVER want to see Samsonov again he needs to be DONE.

So yes I do want another goalie and yes I would be more comfortable with a tandem with MAF and Woll in it.

Or should Woll go down again, because he is very injury prone then MAF and Jones.

But again I care who it is I was just asked for a name.

You know what I'm NOT comfortable with? and nobody should be, although You seem to be.

Beijing ONE wrong movement away from an AHL kid being the #1.

Look at Woll's injury it was a nothing play, a muffin shot.

It doesn't take much.

 

[horner]

So if the defense is all that matters Why has Samsonov been a piece of shit, while Jones has had a good stretch? It's the EXACT same defense It's not like Samsonov gets Tonights defense while Jones has the best defense of all time in front of him.

That's not how that works.

I'm never going to be comfortable with Martin Jones as the #1 goalie because at the end of the day It's Martin Jones, he's had a great 10 game run and we have needed it but he's on the contract he's on because he was AWFUL for 5 straight years, even last year when he won 27 games it wasn't because he was good, he wasn't.

And I promise you I sure as hell don't EVER want to see Samsonov again he needs to be DONE.

So yes I do want another goalie and yes I would be more comfortable with a tandem with MAF and Woll in it.

Or should Woll go down again, because he is very injury prone then MAF and Jones.

But again I care who it is I was just asked for a name.

You know what I'm NOT comfortable with? and nobody should be, although You seem to be.

Beijing ONE wrong movement away from an AHL kid being the #1.

Look at Woll's injury it was a nothing play, a muffin shot.

It doesn't take much.

I will give you a senerio.
1st + 5th + Sammy
For
MAF

Then Woll comes back
Who do you waive because this time Jones won't pass through waivers

THen you are back to worrying about if woll gets injured the we have to us Hildeby.

Now we don't have assets to pick up a goaltender

Go with
Jones
Hildeby 4 games

When Woll comes back
Woll
Jones

If Woll gets injured again they will probably put on ltir

Now you can your assets to try and find a goaltender

 

[arso40]

I will give you a senerio.
1st + 5th + Sammy
For
MAF

Then Woll comes back
Who do you waive because this time Jones won't pass through waivers

THen you are back to worrying about if woll gets injured the we have to us Hildeby.

Now we don't have assets to pick up a goaltender

Go with
Jones
Hildeby 4 games

When Woll comes back
Woll
Jones

If Woll gets injured again they will probably put on ltir

Now you can your assets to try and find a goaltender

Sure up the d clearly if sammys not in net we usually win

 

[horner]

So if the defense is all that matters Why has Samsonov been a piece of shit, while Jones has had a good stretch? It's the EXACT same defense It's not like Samsonov gets Tonights defense while Jones has the best defense of all time in front of him.

That's not how that works.

I'm never going to be comfortable with Martin Jones as the #1 goalie because at the end of the day It's Martin Jones, he's had a great 10 game run and we have needed it but he's on the contract he's on because he was AWFUL for 5 straight years, even last year when he won 27 games it wasn't because he was good, he wasn't.

And I promise you I sure as hell don't EVER want to see Samsonov again he needs to be DONE.

So yes I do want another goalie and yes I would be more comfortable with a tandem with MAF and Woll in it.

Or should Woll go down again, because he is very injury prone then MAF and Jones.

But again I care who it is I was just asked for a name.

You know what I'm NOT comfortable with? and nobody should be, although You seem to be.

Beijing ONE wrong movement away from an AHL kid being the #1.

Look at Woll's injury it was a nothing play, a muffin shot.

It doesn't take much.

It was everything leading up to the injury , it was our worst defensive game of the year.

The injury happened a couple of plays before he finally could get up.

Woll made so many incredible saves that night no wonder he got injured.

The good thing is our defensive play is 100% better.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

So if the defense is all that matters Why has Samsonov been a piece of shit, while Jones has had a good stretch? It's the EXACT same defense It's not like Samsonov gets Tonights defense while Jones has the best defense of all time in front of him.

That's not how that works.

I'm never going to be comfortable with Martin Jones as the #1 goalie because at the end of the day It's Martin Jones, he's had a great 10 game run and we have needed it but he's on the contract he's on because he was AWFUL for 5 straight years, even last year when he won 27 games it wasn't because he was good, he wasn't.

And I promise you I sure as hell don't EVER want to see Samsonov again he needs to be DONE.

So yes I do want another goalie and yes I would be more comfortable with a tandem with MAF and Woll in it.

Or should Woll go down again, because he is very injury prone then MAF and Jones.

But again I care who it is I was just asked for a name.

You know what I'm NOT comfortable with? and nobody should be, although You seem to be.

Beijing ONE wrong movement away from an AHL kid being the #1.

Look at Woll's injury it was a nothing play, a muffin shot.

It doesn't take much.

Jones is playing with confidence. Samsonov is not. That's been the big difference. When Samsonov had his confidence last year, he was solid. Earlier in the year, he wasn't playing that bad, a lot of the goals were because of bad defensive coverage and giveaways. Then he loses confidence. The team has cut down on the bad defensive play recently and now you can see he's giving up goals on his own. It doesn't matter anymore. He is not with the team.

We are still giving up goals due to bad defensive coverage. The Vatrano goal last night for example. Who was covering him all alone in front of the net? The Bunting and Jarvis goals on Saturday. Again no one covering them in front of the net.

Jones has been great and Woll has been solid this year as well. Use your assets on building a good defense in front of them. Rielly and maybe McCabe are our only guys that are legit top 4 D men. Liljegren hasn't been it this year. Brodie's play has fallen off a cliff, GIO is 40 yrs old and we've had our depth D men playing big minutes this season due to injuries. Does that look like a Stanley cup defense to you?

That seems like a more pressing need then wasting assets on a goaltender when Jones has a .930sv% and Woll has a .916sv%. Again, who is an upgrade on that and is he available.

I gave you a pretty damn good example of how good defense makes your goalies look good with Vegas.

 

[TMLAM34]

10 games in, 93% save percentage. Definitely couldn’t ask for anything more from Jones.

 

[horner]

Jones is playing with confidence. Samsonov is not. That's been the big difference. When Samsonov had his confidence last year, he was solid. Earlier in the year, he wasn't playing that bad, a lot of the goals were because of bad defensive coverage and giveaways. Then he loses confidence. The team has cut down on the bad defensive play recently and now you can see he's giving up goals on his own. It doesn't matter anymore. He is not with the team.

We are still giving up goals due to bad defensive coverage. The Vatrano goal last night for example. Who was covering him all alone in front of the net? The Bunting and Jarvis goals on Saturday. Again no one covering them in front of the net.

Jones has been great and Woll has been solid this year as well. Use your assets on building a good defense in front of them. Rielly and maybe McCabe are our only guys that are legit top 4 D men. Liljegren hasn't been it this year. Brodie's play has fallen off a cliff, GIO is 40 yrs old and we've had our depth D men playing big minutes this season due to injuries. Does that look like a Stanley cup defense to you?

That seems like a more pressing need then wasting assets on a goaltender when Jones has a .930sv% and Woll has a .916sv%. Again, who is an upgrade on that and is he available.

I gave you a pretty damn good example of how good defense makes your goalies look good with Vegas.

To me there worst defensive game was Woll's last game .

Woll's best game but no wonder he got hurt he made 10 unbelievable saves.

 

[Ciao]

When the team lacks confidence in the goalie, everyone else is on edge. Pucks jump, players panic and bad plays are made.

If the team is good with the goalie, everything works a lot better.

Samsonov lost confidence in himself. No wonder he gave the Leafs the jitters.

I don't follow the Oilers, but I would bet that they had the same problem with Jack Campbell.

Those two could start a therapy group for nutty goaltenders.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

To me there worst defensive game was Woll's last game .

Woll's best game but no wonder he got hurt he made 10 unbelievable saves.

Yes, thank you. That's a perfect example of how not to make it easier on your goaltender. Your goalie shouldn't have to be stopping constant one timers.

 

[horner]

When the team lacks confidence in the goalie, everyone else is on edge. Pucks jump, players panic and bad plays are made.

If the team is good with the goalie, everything works a lot better.

Samsonov lost confidence in himself. No wonder he gave the Leafs the jitters.

I don't follow the Oilers, but I would bet that they had the same problem with Jack Campbell.

Those two could start a therapy group for nutty goaltenders.

Yes, thank you. That's a perfect example of how not to make it easier on your goaltender. Your goalie shouldn't have to be stopping constant one timers.

That game I think he had to due the splits 8 time .
Ihe stopped Tarasenko twice on sure goals

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I will give you a senerio.
1st + 5th + Sammy
For
MAF

Then Woll comes back
Who do you waive because this time Jones won't pass through waivers

THen you are back to worrying about if woll gets injured the we have to us Hildeby.

Now we don't have assets to pick up a goaltender

Go with
Jones
Hildeby 4 games

When Woll comes back
Woll
Jones

If Woll gets injured again they will probably put on ltir

Now you can your assets to try and find a goaltender

I don't think MAF gets a 1st from anybody at this point.

 

[horner]

I don't think MAF gets a 1st from anybody at this point.

If you want them to take Sammy the only way MAF's contract fits 3.4 mil.
What would you ask for ?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

If you want them to take Sammy the only way MAF's contract fits 3.4 mil.
What would you ask for ?

I never said they wouldn't ask, every negotiation, no matter what it is starts with everybody involved asking for to much, then negotiations happen and You meet somewhere in the middle.

It's very possible they start out asking for a 1st but nobody is doing thatnot just the Leafs, nobody is doing that for MAF at this point.

In a bigger trade maybe.

But for MAF alone? I don't think he can get a 1st from any team.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

It's easy to forget that Jones won 30+ games over a four-year stretch with the Sharks, as well as backstopped them to a Stanley Cup Final. I know that was 5 to 10 years ago, but he knows what the rigours of being a #1 are.

For a depth signing that elicited very little fanfare, he's been full value (obviously) and then some.

What a weird dynamic the goaltending has turned out to be this year. Many thought Samsonov was going to continue to put up top 10 numbers and be huge for the Leafs, while Woll would dabble with a few decent games here or there. Instead, Samsonov has gone complete Jack Campbell, Woll was taking the reigns of the #1 role prior to his injury and showing he may finally be that piece for the team both now and into the future, and we have a 33-year old 3rd stringer thrust into the starter's role who is putting up top notch numbers.